Help me decide on tank....

[Egeldi]

Tanked as a druid and a pally through TBC. Switched to warrior in Wrath and have never once looked back.

Pally rotation is very static, and honestly doesn't seem fun for me at all. Warriors have sword + board, which makes their rotation variable.

Druid rotation is also rather static. I also got pretty bored of looking up a bear butt all the time. Even with the recent model updates for druids its still pretty boring seeing a bear. I like seeing cool looking armor on my character as I tank.

Warriors are also the most mobile of the classes. Three different charges, all on short cooldowns (although realistically speaking you'll probably never use intercept while tanking).

I also like that warriors are the best debuffers of a boss. They can put sunder up, which is class specific, and few DPS warriors seem to take the time to do it (even though its a big raid DPS increase), they can put up -20% attack speed, and they can reduce the boss attack power (which is a pretty big deal, mob AP is calculated differently than player AP).

However, I do miss my druids ability to shift out and huck a battle rez + innervate during phase shifts and such.

[iglocska]

Tanked as a druid and a pally through TBC. Switched to warrior in Wrath and have never once looked back.

Pally rotation is very static, and honestly doesn't seem fun for me at all. Warriors have sword + board, which makes their rotation variable.

Druid rotation is also rather static. I also got pretty bored of looking up a bear butt all the time. Even with the recent model updates for druids its still pretty boring seeing a bear. I like seeing cool looking armor on my character as I tank.

Warriors are also the most mobile of the classes. Three different charges, all on short cooldowns (although realistically speaking you'll probably never use intercept while tanking).

I also like that warriors are the best debuffers of a boss. They can put sunder up, which is class specific, and few DPS warriors seem to take the time to do it (even though its a big raid DPS increase), they can put up -20% attack speed, and they can reduce the boss attack power (which is a pretty big deal, mob AP is calculated differently than player AP).

However, I do miss my druids ability to shift out and huck a battle rez + innervate during phase shifts and such.

Not only warr tanks that do that

[Egeldi]

Not only warr tanks that do that

I know. My point was warriors bring the biggest toolkit of boss debuffing abilities.

[getefix]

I know. My point was warriors bring the biggest toolkit of boss debuffing abilities.

I'd rather a feral druid tank so I get a mangle bot than have a tank that puts up sunders. Sure, you love your class and you want to feel like it's the best. Warriors are situational. Great on Jaraxxus, great on Ony and great on Anub adds. Anything else they're no better than a Druid and in some cases they're not even close.

[exdeath202]

I would like to add something, warriors can dispel, silence, interrupt casting on very short cooldowns and spell reflect for the whole party. On the other hand paladins can solo pretty much anything wich is a huge plus if you like soloing old raids etc.

[Leda-buhr]

I play a bear so I'm a bit biased, but here's what I love about it (and my perception of protadins)I've been a bear for two years now. I leveled with my boyfriend (who plays a moonkin) back in mid-BC.

Gear
I remember the defense cap on druids, it wasn't so horrible or hard to get, however I haven't had to worry about defense since WotLK. Since I was geared for farming ZA at launch, I basically walked right into Naxx. Since Naxx, I have noticed a remarkable lack of upgrades for my bear set (I play kitty as my dual-offspec) In Ulduar, a few trinkets, necklaces and the like found their way into my Outfitter. And in ToC, I am having some problems rolling against rogues and DPS ferals. However, I am fairly happy with my current gear choices. I gem for Stamina (blue) and Agility (red) and enjoy the lightning effect of Mongoose on my polearm.

Offtanking
/begin rant
I'm not exactly sure when druids-as-OTs became the normal assumption. Its one I've always attempted to challenge. A large majority of the fights in WotLK require two or more tanks, regardless of what you're tanking you're still a tank. Especially in ToC, a MT/OT distinction can be harmful (Gormok? tank switching) I'm a bear, I am guild leader of a tiny 5man guild. When we run 10mans (or when I PUG25s) I'm usually "MT". /end rant

I find that being able to throw out innervates between phases (or have another tank taunt off you to toss a Brez) is just one of the bonuses of being a druid. I can think of a great deal of situations we've found ourselves in where a Brez or Innervate has turned a wipe into a win.

Regarding kitty: I only began playing kitty off spec in WotLK, even though I had a bear for all of BC. It is a difficult rotation, incredibly complicated and relies on 6 or 7 buffs and debuffs all being up at the same time. I'd suggest leveling as kitty for part of the questing process as I'm sure I wouldn't have struggled with the form if I had had that experience. There is plenty of gear for kitty and as we don't usually run with rogues, a lot of it was passed to me by default.

Mechanics
As a bear, tanking is rather simplistic. I pull with feral faerie fire, mangle, demoralizing roar, 5 stacks of lacerate for some deeps and then spam swipe. Its not difficult, but you do need to watch for a number of things as well. Phase 2 is coming up, does the holy priest need an innverate? Where is the body of that stupid rogue? etc.

Charge is a wonderful mechanic, serving as a brief interrupt as well (but don't get ahead of your healers on ... say Anub and then get 3shotted because they're RP walking XD) So yes, the rotation is simple, but you have a few other things to watch for as well.

Paladins
I don't want to badmouth anyone that enjoys their paladin tank. But here's a druid's perspective on protadins:

Ezmode! Put down a consecrate and all the mobs are on you. Not a problem at all. As a druid, I have to tab through them and make sure to mangle/faeriefire them all. Yes, its more difficult, but also more active. For added fun don't mark anything and still not have any DPS die as they try to peel aggro away!

I think that's actually my only beef with paladins. Perhaps all those bubbles. I'm not sure how many are viable for tanking. I was astonished in a 25man Ulduar a couple weeks ago when they said they usually had to rotate bubbles from holy paladins and retadins to get through Frozen Blows on Hodir. I had just tanked it with only my healers for support.

So as bear, on a server where I'm frequently known as "that girl bear tank", I'm saying level a druid. There's lots of protadins on my server and I can count the bears I've raided with on one hand. Also, you may want to consider your current guilds tanking roster. Are there bears already? Is there a need for a paladin tank? Are you going to be with this guild when you ding 80? There's no point in leveling a bear if you won't get to raid because there's already a bear that gets priority over you.

<3 Leda'buhr
<The Boisterous Few>
Ravenholdt

[EektheCat]

Druid Tank:


Pros - Massive health pool, No Def cap, Good support abilities, Faire Fire, Easy rotation to master, Good in both OT and MT role, Easy to gear up, Easy to level

Cons - Overly simple rotation, Lack of true tanking gear

Druid tanking is very fun as a person who like you switched from being a Dk tank it was a very simple transition. Maul is similar to Rune Strike and it is easier to crowd control tank in my opinion.

[Paroxysm]

Paladins
I don't want to badmouth anyone that enjoys their paladin tank. But here's a druid's perspective on protadins:

Ezmode! Put down a consecrate and all the mobs are on you. Not a problem at all. As a druid, I have to tab through them and make sure to mangle/faeriefire them all. Yes, its more difficult, but also more active. For added fun don't mark anything and still not have any DPS die as they try to peel aggro away!

I think that's actually my only beef with paladins. Perhaps all those bubbles. I'm not sure how many are viable for tanking. I was astonished in a 25man Ulduar a couple weeks ago when they said they usually had to rotate bubbles from holy paladins and retadins to get through Frozen Blows on Hodir. I had just tanked it with only my healers for support.

1) If your paladins swapping bubbles for Hodir (wtf does this even mean?), it's not a class problem --- it's a player problem. First, I don't even understand *why* you would do it, much less *how* it be beneficial to do so. It simply sounds retarded.
2) Druids are not OTs. None of the tanks are. Either you, or the people you run with regularly, have a perception problem. All 4 tanks classes are viable for 99% of the content. That said, there are advantages for some during specific hard modes...
3) "I don't want to badmouth, but..." Whenever someone starts off a phrase like that, they do *exactly* what they just said they don't want to do. For example, I don't want to sound racist..... but all Puerto Ricans should be kept in cages. See how that sounds? Smart Paladin tanks are fine, just like DKs , Druids, and Warriors.

Really --- change the people you play with, or your perception. Something's off.

[Iyotanka]

The issue (at least on ravenholdt) is that people think bear tanks are bad for a number of reasons. Naturally not everyone thinks this, but in a majority of PuG 25s we've entered into the common concensus is that bear tanks can't hold threat, or are only good on adds, or the other tanks are just better in general.

[Sunshine]

2) Druids are not OTs. None of the tanks are. Either you, or the people you run with regularly, have a perception problem. All 4 tanks classes are viable for 99% of the content. That said, there are advantages for some during specific hard modes...

I completely agree that druids are not OT's based on skills or capability of tanking; however, it's not always easy to change the mentalities or habits of the people you play with. Right now in my guild, myself (bear) and a prot paladin MT all of the fights, but it wasn't always easy for me to get my foot in the door.

Back in Naxx, when we had 3 primary tanks (those above + prot warrior), I was always the first one asked to go dps if the fight needed fewer tanks. The reasoning at the time was sound -- with no dual spec, I could do worlds more while not tanking than either of the other two tanks. But changing that mentality once dual spec was implemented was difficult. Part of it was that I already had a decent set of dps gear even using the gear I tank with (where the warrior/paladin were lacking in other gear sets), and part of it was just habit of the guild. For me, the catalyst for change was our prot warrior having to take time off.

Just because druids are not *technically* inferior doesn't mean that it's easy to change the mindset of people, even reasonably intelligent ones who happen to be your guildmates. Changing the minds of random pugs who refuse to give you a chance to prove it... now that's a feat.

[iglocska]

I don't want to badmouth anyone that enjoys their paladin tank. But here's a druid's perspective on protadins:

Ezmode! Put down a consecrate and all the mobs are on you. Not a problem at all. As a druid, I have to tab through them and make sure to mangle/faeriefire them all. Yes, its more difficult, but also more active. For added fun don't mark anything and still not have any DPS die as they try to peel aggro away!

Same as swipe. A large portion of paladin aoe threat comes from SoV and stacking it up fast on all targets (which, just as in your case, means tabbing through them).

The "rotation" for both aoe and single target are very similar in terms of complexity for both druid and paladin, the main difference is that the paladin will also cleanse, use hand spells, divine sac etc while doing the same thing as a bear is. Hence why out of my 3 tanks I like the bear the least...

[Leda-buhr]

Honestly, I've never played a paladin, let alone leveled one to 80 and tanked with it, so I'll defer to your knowledge of the rotation/class.

I do realize that swipe was meant to be an AoE threat grabber, however, when competing with paladins for threat on multiple targets, they paladin will win hands down. Swipe can't compete with consecrate. In the end, it doesn't really matter because as long as the mobs are tanked and no one dies - it doesn't matter who had aggro. Just a pet peeve I guess.

So I guess it boils down to:

Cleanses, hand spells, divine sanc vs. Innervates, Battle Rezzes and abolish poison/curse

And yes, those spells will switch me back into caster form, but with some practice, you can time it so that no one even notices

EDIT: Forgot abolish curse

[Ghost-Flight]

I use to tank with a pally in BC and moved to a druid in wrath and never looked back, Just being able to shift forms is fun enough to not want to be a pally.

And in terms of tanking they can both do just as well in any MT/OT situation and fights where you dont need to OT much you can still dish out decent damage in cat form.

now off topic... AoE tanking now is pretty easy for all classes, it always pisses me off to see other tanks say "My class cant aoe tank, you have to do it", sure a pally might have more threat over the other classes but players very rarely pull off me in AoE situations which makes the extra threat from paladins more overkill then necessary.

[Cardrels]

The nice thing about a druid is you can be about the best OT there is. In normal tank gear that's gemmed for agility with some stam I sit at 50k hp raid buffed with a stam flask and I can shift to cat and still have over 11k ap and 48% crit. Only thing I'm missing is armor pen in tank gear (13% vs 51% + MRS).

What "Normal tank gear" are you talking about? Link armory instead of saying what it is. Im gemmed for stam all the way down the line and I have 50k life raid buffed, unless yr in 25man H gear, you are not gemming for agi and still wind up with 50k life. Self buffed my stats are...
39,637 hp
396 hit (way over, I know)
40.49% crit
25 expertise
39.87% dodge
I have never been out tanked by a pally so idk wtf u guys are talking about.

[iglocska]

What "Normal tank gear" are you talking about? Link armory instead of saying what it is. Im gemmed for stam all the way down the line and I have 50k life raid buffed, unless yr in 25man H gear, you are not gemming for agi and still wind up with 50k life. Self buffed my stats are...
39,637 hp
396 hit (way over, I know)
40.49% crit
25 expertise
39.87% dodge
I have never been out tanked by a pally so idk wtf u guys are talking about.

Under 40k in bear form definitely sounds low if you're really stacking stam ???

[Cerus]

What "Normal tank gear" are you talking about? Link armory instead of saying what it is. Im gemmed for stam all the way down the line and I have 50k life raid buffed, unless yr in 25man H gear, you are not gemming for agi and still wind up with 50k life. Self buffed my stats are...
39,637 hp
396 hit (way over, I know)
40.49% crit
25 expertise
39.87% dodge
I have never been out tanked by a pally so idk wtf u guys are talking about.

I have more HP than you and 15% more dodge with only a couple pure stam gems. Gem agi or agi/stam - your dodge blows.

To the person who said Pallies have better single target threat....L O L. And heroic mode bosses - Druid>Pally.

To the OP: It's hard for anyone to tell someone else what class they would enjoy. While there may not be gear designed purely for Bears there doesn't really need to be. My only advice is to try the classes out although keep in mind that Druids can be pretty boring to level (as feral) until you get cat form and mangle.

PS. Paladins have the best effective health? Did they remove Druid tanks from the game?

[MestHoop]

I do realize that swipe was meant to be an AoE threat grabber, however, when competing with paladins for threat on multiple targets, they paladin will win hands down. Swipe can't compete with consecrate. In the end, it doesn't really matter because as long as the mobs are tanked and no one dies - it doesn't matter who had aggro. Just a pet peeve I guess.

Gonna have to disagree there. I have a feral druid alt and my main is a prot paladin.
If our guild's feral tank starts swiping and all I do is consecrate and holy shield then I'm not going to have anything on me at all.
The problem is you hardly see a paladin doing other stuff :\ I have to HotR, judge, ShoR, etc to keep several mobs on me.
Only then I will have them standing in my consecration, a few stacks of corruption on em and extra damage from holy shield which would be enough to withstand threat from constant swiping (and gotta hit em every now and then or make them get hit by HotR so corruption doesn't fall off).

In naxx though I'm unbeatable. Holy Wrath ftw


edit:
And there I go without helping the OP :P
In my eyes it would be easier for a DK tank to switch to a paladin tank ability cost wise.
Paladins and DK both start off with a full rage bar and gather up more as time goes on, where a druid and a warrior start off with jack shit and have to use certain abilities to keep them going at first and then all classes tend to end up with a infinite resource situation (aside from DK's ).
For single target the paladin rotation is very static like the DK one, where warriors have sword and board to mix things up.
All in all it comes down to what you like to play best while looking at what a class can do aside from tank (paladins = protective cooldowns, cleansing and save the occasional life. Warriors = more physical protection (think intervene and spell reflect) and charging around the battlefield. Druids = easy switching between roles with minimal spec disadvantages, cleansing and situational raid savers).

[Cardrels]

Under 40k in bear form definitely sounds low if you're really stacking stam ???

That was with DMC: Greatness on. With TBH equipped, HP sits at 41,507 self buffed. Food and Flasked it goes up quite a bit more.

[iglocska]

That was with DMC: Greatness on. With TBH equipped, HP sits at 41,507 self buffed. Food and Flasked it goes up quite a bit more.

Still sounds a bit low for a stam stacking bear...

[xebtria]

stam stacking bear reports with 59,082 life full raidbuffed.
yes, 40k is low. I already had that with t7 and a few blues.