Paladin PvP Closer

[Elovan]

I had an idea on my way home from school about how PvP paladins can get the closer most whine for. I dont PvP very much, so i dont know if this would be OP or not.

Glyph of Hammer of Justice (redesigned)
When your target is more than 15 yards away, the cooldown on Hammer of Justice resets. If you change your target and your new target is closer than 10 yards, Hammer of Justice will automatically be on cooldown.

Basically what this does is allows paladins to stun their target whenever they get too far away (HoJ range is 10 yards, so you'll need to outside of range for the cooldown to reset). The second part prevents paladins from switching from a far away target to a close target to instantly stun them whenever they want.

[DaGhostDS]

if you can code that.. good luck
balance issue too

run far from your target, come back hoj, hit him, run again come back, hoj, hit and dead

[Copain]

This would not be abused at all.

[Imdownhere]

I had an idea on my way home from school about how PvP paladins can get the closer most whine for. I dont PvP very much, so i dont know if this would be OP or not.

Glyph of Hammer of Justice (redesigned)
When your target is more than 15 yards away, the cooldown on Hammer of Justice resets. If you change your target and your new target is closer than 10 yards, Hammer of Justice will automatically be on cooldown.

Basically what this does is allows paladins to stun their target whenever they get too far away (HoJ range is 10 yards, so you'll need to outside of range for the cooldown to reset). The second part prevents paladins from switching from a far away target to a close target to instantly stun them whenever they want.

hmm..good idea

wait... thats not balanced...

your idea blows

[Adamson]

This would not be abused at all.

[Kanes]

[quote=Elovan ]

Just stupid. Don't you have a talent that increases your movement speed by 15% and a judgment that locks the target to 100% movement speed? do the fucking math.

[Ronark]

Just stupid. Don't you have a talent that increases your movement speed by 15% and a judgment that locks the target to 100% movement speed? do the fucking math.

Dont bring either PoJ nor JoJ into this equation, you will just embarrass yourself and start a flame war.

[Kanes]

Dont bring either PoJ nor JoJ into this equation, you will just embarrass yourself and start a flame war.

Oh, my bad, back in the day JoJ owned druids(lulz your kitty can't kite heal) in arena. PoJ, meh whatever, do the math, its a free 15% movement speed increase. Just because you folks are too fuckin spoiled to use the shit, AIN'T MAH PROBLEM BRO!

P.S: Ronark, you are perhaps one of the three pallies I have any respect for, my crudeness is not directed at you per say, just tired of blizzard either over fuckin powering paladins(ruining a good portion wotlk pvp in the process), or being too slow to react to truly broken and exploited mechanics/specs related to it.

And then having folks that only play paladins leap to defend the class as if its totally balanced, or even underpowered really flips my lid. Your class, in the hear and now, is perhaps one of the solidest classes in the game, hands down, it certainly, along with dk's has eaten up the lion share of class dev time in wotlk.

[Rurikar]

Oh, my bad, back in the day JoJ owned druids(lulz your kitty can't kite heal) in arena. PoJ, meh whatever, do the math, its a free 15% movement speed increase. Just because you folks are too fuckin spoiled to use the shit, AIN'T MAH PROBLEM BRO!

P.S: Ronark, you are perhaps one of the three pallies I have any respect for, my crudeness is not directed at you per say, just tired of blizzard either over fuckin powering paladins(ruining a good portion wotlk pvp in the process), or being too slow to react to truly broken and exploited mechanics/specs related to it.

And then having folks that only play paladins leap to defend the class as if its totally balanced, or even underpowered really flips my lid. Your class, in the hear and now, is perhaps one of the solidest classes in the game, hands down, it certainly, along with dk's has eaten up the lion share of class dev time in wotlk.

I DIDN'T KNOW THEY HAD INTERNET IN IGNORANCE LAND. HAR HAR SEE I CAN TYPE ON THE INTERNETS TOOOOOOO.

Stop talking.

[Ronark]

Oh, my bad, back in the day JoJ owned druids(lulz your kitty can't kite heal) in arena. PoJ, meh whatever, do the math, its a free 15% movement speed increase. Just because you folks are too fuckin spoiled to use the shit, AIN'T MAH PROBLEM BRO!

P.S: Ronark, you are perhaps one of the three pallies I have any respect for, my crudeness is not directed at you per say, just tired of blizzard either over fuckin powering paladins(ruining a good portion wotlk pvp in the process), or being too slow to react to truly broken and exploited mechanics/specs related to it.

And then having folks that only play paladins leap to defend the class as if its totally balanced, or even underpowered really flips my lid. Your class, in the hear and now, is perhaps one of the solidest classes in the game, hands down, it certainly, along with dk's has eaten up the lion share of class dev time in wotlk.

Back in the day, Feral spec was as bad as lolret also.

[toastymage]

PoJ is easily defeated by anyone who does that lame strafejump BS. I'm not sure whether that's an issue of latency or the fact that 15% speed increase isn't enough to matter over the course of a handful of seconds, but it does not get the job done.

Just because the Paladin says "we need X" where X = interrupt, closer, etc, doesn't mean they are QQ'ing. It's a legitimate concern.

[Abolishment]

Oh, my bad, back in the day JoJ owned druids(lulz your kitty can't kite heal) in arena. PoJ, meh whatever, do the math, its a free 15% movement speed increase. Just because you folks are too fuckin spoiled to use the shit, AIN'T MAH PROBLEM BRO!

That's the thing. We do use it. Every Ret is Spec'd into Pursuit of Justice, uses Judgement of Justice to try and catch fleeing opponents (Sprinting Rogues, Shifting Druids). Stopping an opponent from moving faster than 100% is nowhere near as potent as Crippling Poison being applied on 50% of auto-attacks (more if Assassination) and slowing them to 30%.

The idea behind snares is that your opponent is slowed and you are allowed to actually fight them without them running you in circles.

If we are to pretend that being 15% faster than an opponent is enough to stop them from getting away, then why is Crippling Poison a 70% movement speed reduction? Why is Hamstring, Chilled, Frost Shock, Wing Clip, Piercing Howl, Daze, Infected Wounds, and other similar snares all 50% or greater?

Pursuit of Justice works decently if your opponent is already nearby, you don't have any snares on yourself, and there is a limited amount of space that your opponent can move to. In a large, open field, where the fleeing target has snares, they can indefinitely kite the Paladin. There's a video on YouTube that is just five minutes of a Frost Mage kiting a Paladin in circles using Ice Lance. The Mage loses because they're dueling outside of Orgrimmar and runs out of room, but during that 5 minutes the Paladin gets about 10 seconds of melee combat in. Watch a skilled Survival Hunter stay between 25 and 41 yards on a Paladin at all times. There is entirely nothing the Paladin can do, short of leaving combat and mounting up- which requires line of sight and a dead pet.

Compare to a Rogue, who gets in close, stays close until Blink/Intervene/Teleport, something moves their opponent far away. The Rogue then has defensive cooldowns they can use to re-close the distance.

I understand that you think Paladins with snares means the end of the world. I can assure you, it wouldn't be nearly as bad as you'd like to think.

Judgement and Pursuit of Justice work like this:
Classes that can't kite you-
--Other Paladins, to a degree
--Restoration Druids who aren't spec'd into Brambles.
Classes than can still kite you-
--Mage: Blink out of stun to gain distance, constantly throwing both melee and ranged snares. Multiple immobilizes on different diminishing returns.
--Warlock: Very few snares, but Fear will run you so far away from the Warlock that it will take a very long time to get back in range, assuming he uses this time to gain distance.
--Priest: A priest moving in a straight line away from a Paladin, assuming neither can mount up, can indefinitely chain Psychic Screams. Yes. It takes that long to get back in range if the Priest is moving in the opposite direction.
--Rogue: At any point, Gouge in conjunction with a Crippled Paladin will give the Rogue enough time to re-enter stealth or mount up. If the Gouge is trinketed, Blind will work, unless Bubbled, at which point they have Vanish to negate the need to leave combat.
--Druid: Balance needs help, yes, but with long-range roots and DoTs that resist Dispel, combined with a Knockback that dazes, Balance can kite Rets. Feral will permanently keep the Paladin snared, and now has instant Cyclones to gain distance if needed- even if they are limited at moving 100% of normal speed, the Paladin is now entirely immobilized and snared at 50% when that breaks.
--Hunters: With good area control, a Hunter who starts at range with a dismounted Paladin can remain at range until the Paladin dies. Pet will keep the Paladin in combat, Repentance- the only gap closer, still requires to be 20 yards away from the target. A Hunter with a good gauge of distance will never let the Paladin within 25.
--Shamans: With constant purging to keep Hand of Freedom off, Shamans of all specs can emply a variety of low cooldown snares or immobilizes. Wanting to get away only requires a knockback, an immobilize, or a hex to leave combat with. Once you have range, you can keep range, absorbing Repentances with Grounding Totems.
--Death Knights: No other class boasts a 30-yard range "Get over here". Impossible to be kited by a Ret Paladin, impossible for a Ret Paladin to stay in range if the Death Knight really wants to get out of range.

Judgement and Pursuit of Justice are nice, but they're not nearly as crippling as well, Crippling Poison.

Thanks for your two cents though. I'll be sure to add them to the Big Jar of Misconception Payouts.

[Ronark]

I use Repentance as my distance closer.. It sucks, but hey.

Until a DoT hits, or a huntard hits them when you are trying to catch up.



Or you are against a druid.

Besides, we need Repent as a poor man interrupt.

[Ershiin]

I use Repentance as my distance closer.. It sucks, but hey.

[Switchshot]

nah man..

[Deleted]

And then having folks that only play paladins leap to defend the class as if its totally balanced, or even underpowered really flips my lid. Your class, in the hear and now, is perhaps one of the solidest classes in the game, hands down, it certainly, along with dk's has eaten up the lion share of class dev time in wotlk.

Cry me a river. Just because You are too shít to fight a pally, it doesn't mean they are OP...

[Moshy]

your idea blows