Ret talent tree in Cataclysm

[zcks]

Well we all know by this point that blizz plans on getting rid of the talents that add +crit & + damage in favor of the mastery system.

My question is being that the retribution tree is already so sparse compared to most other trees & the fact that many of its talents do what the mastery system would do who else is hoping for a rework of how many of the spells & abilities work ?

[Borigrad]

they have already said we are going to have a lot more "fun" talents... blizzards definition of fun for the paladin class sucks though... so wait and see.

[Deleted]

in essence, a complete talent tree rehaul would be great. paladin started out as great defensive utility, so we could not have burst or even sustained DPS. after that, (3.0) blizzard gave us burst, but no utility. then people started to nag about our burst. so blizzard nerfed that as well. so now we are left without burst, without utility, and with top paladins who are speccing into shockadin or protribution because ret has less burst, less survival and less utility.

a talent overhaul would give us the fresh start we need in PvP (not that i care about it, but some people do.

[Geckomayhem]

Guess we wait and see what Blizzard's idea of "fun" is, but to remove passive talents seems like a strange thing to do. I prefer having passive abilities to having 500 buttons to press. Maybe the line between PvE and PvP will be drawn even darker. And maybe Seal of Command will be scratched altogether. Can't really predict what will happen until Blizzard release more information as to just how much will be overhauled.

As it stands, ret Paladins are still more fun than some other class-specs. Yes, even in PvE.

[Copain]

Paladin's already got an overhaul for Wrath, so I doubt they'll change a ton of stuff this time. I think it's a bit early to assume what Paladins (not just Ret) will be getting.

[DaGhostDS]

Paladin's already got an overhaul for Wrath, so I doubt they'll change a ton of stuff this time. I think it's a bit early to assume what Paladins (not just Ret) will be getting.

overhaul? hum ok..
Blizz dev before wrath : lets remove the seal getting consumed, lets add up more jugement damage and what about a whirlwind that heal!

judgement of wise is one of the best part but the rest are just ductape fix

[Ronark]

Well we all know by this point that blizz plans on getting rid of the talents that add +crit & + damage in favor of the mastery system.

My question is being that the retribution tree is already so sparse compared to most other trees & the fact that many of its talents do what the mastery system would do who else is hoping for a rework of how many of the spells & abilities work ?

See Paladins, 4.0 thread, first page.

[zcks]

See Paladins, 4.0 thread, first page.

Hey ronark, I read your thread & I have to agree you had some pretty good ideas. Regretfully Blizz doesn't seem to listen to level headed smart players, instead they seem to only listen to pubescent idiotic whiners.

I suppose its the curse of becoming more of a company enterprise & less of a small friendly business.

[Ronark]

Well some of those ideas are very likely to go through, such as the stun length/CD on HoJ, or what I have set as bonuses for the Mastery system.

[Krekko]

Paladin's already got an overhaul for Wrath, so I doubt they'll change a ton of stuff this time. I think it's a bit early to assume what Paladins (not just Ret) will be getting.

I disagree. I think they will extend what they started.

The only touched the tip of the iceberg, and will go ahead and further refine, and work out the seal/judgment system.

[Ronark]

I disagree. I think they will extend what they started.

The only touched the tip of the iceberg, and will go ahead and further refine, and work out the seal/judgment system.

I agree here, which is why I expanded it to the Seal Strike/Sacred Vow combo- that specific seals can be used as unique buffs/debuffs, rather than a 30 minute "set-and-forget system" that we have now.

I do think that consumable seals were the way to go for DPS abilities, as it gives some "rotation" at least to set up abilities. However, I do know that a system like this would mess up healers/tanks, which is why I extended the length for the specific seals they use and the abilities that they should be using (i.e. if a healer is DPSing or a tank healing, then the seal should be consumed, since that is not their "roles").

[Copain]

Paladins got a lot more than a lot of classes got, partly due to the fact that Bliz decided to design them so they could be other things besides holy and be attractive (Where as the previous designs had holy being the best and the others being "OK").


I consider it an overhaul because Rets/Prots are actually Real now, not the boring, not that great, stuff they were before (I really don't care if you played Ret/Prot in BC, great for you. And if you played it PRE-BC You're a fucking moron to even think of trying to brag about it).

[Ronark]

Paladins got a lot more than a lot of classes got, partly due to the fact that Bliz decided to design them so they could be other things besides holy and be attractive (Where as the previous designs had holy being the best and the others being "OK").

If done right, Prot and Ret in TBC were fine.

A lot of classes didn't get as much because they didn't need as much as we did to become "broad-line viable".

And if you played it PRE-BC You're a fucking moron to even think of trying to brag about it).

Reck bombs.

'Nuff said.

[Renoblade]

i have asked myself too, what to do with talent trees without some passive talents like + crit or + damage.
if you remove conviction (5% crit) and maybe sanctified (3%crit) were to put enough points to go deeper in the tree?

i tryed to look at some trees. for example a mage arcane tree has some static passive stuff like + haste, +int etc... but if you scrap them completely,
there are not enough points to get the next tier.

i can only imagine they try to combine multiple talents, or they make new talents with funny effects to many abilities.
they sayd Body and Soul was one example.

the speed boost on PW:Shield with the pvp poison selfdispell talent.
i could see thats one way to do it. we got divine purpose. a mix of passive defense with an active side effect of HoF

how about we make a new toppic with lots of fun talents to make a new talent tree? ;D (yay more war-toos fun)

[Copain]

If done right, Prot and Ret in TBC were fine.

A lot of classes didn\'t get as much because they didnt need as much as we did to become \"broad-line viable\".
Reck bombs.
Nuff said.

The point being, a Ret/Prot Pally could not as easily do the things others could.


As for Reck bombs, gimmick specs do not count. I am reffering to those who are like LOOK AT ME I WAS RET IN PRETBC ARENT I SUCH A BADASS? Because they are morons.

[Ronark]

The point being, a Ret/Prot Pally could not as easily do the things others could.

Yes.

As for Reck bombs, gimmick specs do not count. I am reffering to those who are like LOOK AT ME I WAS RET IN PRETBC ARENT I SUCH A BADASS? Because they are morons.

Yes.

[Borigrad]

The point being, a Ret/Prot Pally could not as easily do the things others could.


As for Reck bombs, gimmick specs do not count. I am reffering to those who are like LOOK AT ME I WAS RET IN PRETBC ARENT I SUCH A BADASS? Because they are morons.

wow i think i actually agree with copain for once.

[zcks]

I actually did stay ret through all of the t4 content and some of the t5, though i did end up having to change to holy allot for later t5 content because it was more advantageous for my groups to stack hunter mages & warlocks.


On a side note I wish they had made duel spec allot sooner, cant count how much gold I spent changing specs back then.

[zcks]

Oh btw am I the only one here who used to blessing of protection melee classes & hunters back in early bc & vanilla to make there dps more in line with ours ?
Because it was a hell of allot of fun.

[Ronark]

Oh btw am I the only one here who used to blessing of protection melee classes & hunters back in early bc & vanilla to make there dps more in line with ours ?
Because it was a hell of allot of fun.

I do that to my DK raid friend and Hunter raid friend, except usually the DK is out of range