Where did all the hard bosses go we had back in classic??

[sicness]

I don't think the "everybody was retarded in Vanilla" excuse is getting you anywhere. Especially since you fail to provide any kind of proof.

So you're saying when you first hit 60 you knew everything about your class and how to play it? Probably not, but now when you hit 80 there are more guides and information than there ever was at 60, you simply google it. That alone helps countless players improve their gameplay by simply having an optimal spec and knowing their rotation/priority system.

Honestly if you go back and look at the majority of encounters in vanilla, even at level 80 when it's trivial due to being much higher level, you'll notice that the overall design of them is very simple. They all have maybe one mechanic or two at best with a few bosses having multiple phases. Now half the bosses have multiple phases and require more out of the average raider to stay alive. I know it's a simple concept, but adding stay out of the fire to almost every fight alone makes it more difficult than vanilla wow where all dps and healers mainly had to do was stand there and do their job.

[Izenhart]

Nostalgia and the "lol one friend of mine told me Vanilla was epic now suxx" are the only things that keep the 60s in a decent impression, because they utterly sucked compared to now.


As someone already said, the more you have the more is the error margin you can have.

I had BWL raids with 5 people AFK and 5 people in /follow and yet we were managing to clear everything EZMODE.

Try to have 5 people afk with the Burning Bile at Beasts, or with the mark of Anub.

[ELYPOP]

I just cannot stand this Vanilla glorifying anymore. Do you have any Hardmode achievements? Do you have any proof that you have even faced any hard encounter at the current content? Stuff now is alot harder than it used to be, so stop complaining. People who haven't even entered Ulduar or ToC and have geared up from Heroics seem to continuously come out with this crap.

[sulfuric]

I had BWL raids with 5 people AFK and 5 people in /follow and yet we were managing to clear everything EZMODE.

You should have tried the instance the month it came out, before all the nerfs instead of a year later.

[Hyponic]

Jeez, another one of these threads. However, there are now both easy and hard versions of the same bosses. Fyi, try clearing ToTGC 25.

If I'm not wrong, that can be compared to the bosses pre-tbc. Also, pre-tbc you needed 40 people to use their brains. Now you only need 25. That says it all.

[sicness]

You should have tried the instance the month it came out, before all the nerfs instead of a year later.

You mean before enough people in the raid had the gear to get through it? Because that's what held up guilds then, not people not knowing the fights or being bad players but the gear.

[sulfuric]

You mean before enough people in the raid had the gear to get through it? Because that's what held up guilds then, not people not knowing the fights or being bad players but the gear.

When 85% of the raid had full T1 is a good start.

[Klarth]

You should have tried the instance the month it came out, before all the nerfs instead of a year later.

Wasn't everything besides Nef and Chromagus killed in the first two days? And this was with no PTR.

[remendejo]

sure your raid wear addons.... turn them off
sure your read boss strategies.... go unknowing the bosses

[seam]

Wasn't everything besides Nef and Chromagus killed in the first two days? And this was with no PTR.

Yes.

And Chromagus didnt die due to being bugged.

Once he was fixed, both he and Nef died in the same day.

[Sigmundus]

Im wondering where did alle the nice hard bosses go?? today most of the boss fights are just focusing on gear not skills.. ???

As other people have said, turn your raid addons off (like dbm) and don't read the strategies beforehand. Bet you wouldn't complain then.

I'm also willing to bet you're like the other people who whine about boss difficulty that haven't even done Ulduar hardmodes, let alone totgc ones.

[ripponesan]

the bosses were not hard, you just were terrifying bad back then, so it seemed quite hard.

The hardest thing in vanilla was getting 40 people together, if you managed this the bosses went down.

[Vongimi]

You weren't there, don't bother talking about shit you never saw. I doubt you've seen Yogg 0 but when did we start comparing normal mode old world stuff to hardmode Wrath shit? Compare Yogg 4 time-to-clear or any normal mode WotLK raid to normal mode vanilla and TBC and you start to see why content is a joke.

Ya sorry, didnt bother raiding in the horrid endgame that was vanilla wow. Raided for like a few weeks at 60 then quit. Way to much farming. I may not have been there, but look up C'thun anywhere and you will see the stories of how he was bugged. I dont have to be there to know that he was very very bugged and impossible to kill due to said bugs. Yes I have seen yogg+0. Its a great fight. And there are no hardmode old world stuff. Hardmode in wrath is there as a continuation of the raids we are used to, the easy modes are the new style of raiding. Hardmodes in WOTLK = Bosses in Vanilla/BC. Easy modes = no equivalent in Vanilla/BC, they are a new concept.

when did we start comparing normal mode old world stuff to hardmode Wrath shit?

Since the begininning of hard mode implementation? Like have you been living under a rock for all this time or what? Yes, the EASY MODES will be easier then what we are used to, they were created for the vast majority of players, which are very bad. Thats why they are there. Like, this is possibly the worst arguement I have seen for vanilla elitism.... You are just clinging on to some last desperate attempt to claim that you are right, when you know you are backed up against the corner when actaul facts are brought to light that completely debunk your entire arguement. Complaning about easy modes being easy is like complaining that oranges taste like oranges, not applies.

Yes, its an inconviencence to have to kill the same boss twice on 2 different difficulties. But its not really that bad ata all. It would be very stupid for blizzard to just make super hard raids, because then you would have a game with an INCREDIBELY strong learning curve, and guess what happens to games like those? They die, quickly. Having the 2 different difficulties is a nice middle ground in between the two player bases. Gotta think about people other then yourself sometimes.

[velourea]

it was easy when you had 40 friends with brains and motivation. unfortunately this wasn't always the case.

[Strages]

Lawl Classic wasn't hard. People only thought it was because you had 10-20 tagalongs that did nothing but afk on autofollow the entire raid hoping to come back in time to get loot.

[playersup]

Lawl Classic wasn't hard. People only thought it was because you had 10-20 tagalongs that did nothing but afk on autofollow the entire raid hoping to come back in time to get loot.

Tell me what guild you was in, in Vanilla and your char name, and i will tell you exaclty how easy you found it

[darxide]

11 pages is TLDR at 9am so forgive me if I'm repeating somebody.

Vanilla raiding seemed harder and more epic because they were the first raids and there were so few people doing them. Why so few people? Because as I did see mentioned it required a LOT of time commitment. Farming was retarded and took up more time than the actual raids. Only the most dedicated, hardcore and unemployed were able to devote that much time. Second, you had to figure out how to get 40 people online at the same time and work (somewhat) as a team. Not very easy at all. That was challenging in itself.

Then you have to think that the raids themselves were a NEW thing. All this time we had been doing quests and 5 or 10 man instances and then all of a sudden you mean we need FORTY PEOPLE to go kill this massive dragon/fire elemental/giant eyeball? In these HUGE dungeons? That made it feel extremely epic. Not the boss encounters themselves.

Nowadays, everybody is in full epic gear and has pugged a 10 or 25 man normal raid from the moment they hit level 80. It has lost the epic feeling because everybody can raid now with the farm requirements gone and the access to epic gear from brainless 5 man dungeons and emblems. Any twit who spends the first 2 weeks of level 80 running 5 mans and saving his emblems can clear Naxx without much effort on his 3rd week of level 80.

The epic feeling is gone because EVERYBODY is doing it now. How can you feel epic when you're just another fish in the sea?

[Offhand]

Ya sorry, didnt bother raiding in the horrid endgame that was vanilla wow. Raided for like a few weeks at 60 then quit. Way to much farming. I may not have been there, but look up C'thun anywhere and you will see the stories of how he was bugged. I dont have to be there to know that he was very very bugged and impossible to kill due to said bugs. Yes I have seen yogg+0. Its a great fight. And there are no hardmode old world stuff. Hardmode in wrath is there as a continuation of the raids we are used to, the easy modes are the new style of raiding. Hardmodes in WOTLK = Bosses in Vanilla/BC. Easy modes = no equivalent in Vanilla/BC, they are a new concept.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-a...s+no+cow+level
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-a...s+no+cow+level

You've seen Yogg 0? On ten man maybe, and on the floor if that's the case. Don't compare things you never even tried to do (t2-t3) to things you've failed to do (Yogg 0). According to your armory, you did one light 10 man this November, that means you stomped a t8 10 man hardmode in 245 gear. If you think that's a fair comparison (or that 10 man is remotely difficult), adjust your helmet a bit, it's on too tight. I've solo tanked that joke of an achievement. In fact, finishing up someones rusted proto last week, we got into phase 3 in ONE brain phase. Please don't tell me you found that achievement hard in your current gear.

Even when you compare "normal mode" Vanilla/TBC bosses to "hardmode" WotLK bosses, there's still something to be desired. Especially when people arguing the opposite call crushing a tier old 10 man hardmode they haven't done a "great fight".

[Pieterman]

u do realize why the bosses in vanilla were hard right? there was no aoe tanking, no aoe healing, minimal aoe damage...we just had a fuckload less tools. think sapphiron without wild growth (and probably some priest spells aswell, but i cant remember which ones were and werent there in vanilla)