Buying relentless weapon (sword vs axe)

[Lloret]

Hello guys .. ive searched alot about this really.. but i still cant decide.

First of all , the use of the weapon will be exclusive for pvp .. arenas 2v2 and 5v5 and also world pvp i love to go arround the world and killing guys hehe :P

The weapon will be the 1400 + 50k honor and i dont know if i take the sword or axe..
quote from landsoul @ arenajunkies :

Pros with axe:
Crits can't be dodged or parried
Deep wounds damage unaffected by armor
Crits don't eat up SS charges
benefits more the overall damage of bladestorm and SS
more reliable trauma and blood frenzy uptime
More effective on high armor targets


Pros with Sword:
more effective when your specialization ICD is being cooled down repeatedly by kiting or CC
Chance to roflpwn your target with double crits
More effective on low armor targets

The final ruling:
-Swords is much more effective when soloing or single targetting due to the cooling down of the ICD between your on-target uptime. It also has a higher chance of killing someone in a lucky burst.
-Axes is more reliable consistent damage, and also is more beneficial for unmitigatable damage and AoE effects. If you want to have high damage on multiple targets or bleed someone down, then Axe is the way to go.



any advice?

[Bananengurke]

I'm not gonna lie, I took swords because everyone I asked (high rated warriors) and warriors on arena junkies have it.

I have to say it's wayy wayy better than axe. I mean 5 % crit.. what is that? you get more crit on every single piece of gear. Next season you will have more crit. get a new piece of gear, and you will have more crit. On the other hand, your enemies will have more and more resilience, so that crit kinda equals out.
I just think it's a waste to spend 5 points in something that gear can give you, I feel that it's like speccing into a talent with the tooltip: "increases all dmg done by 2%"
this seems very pve oriented

sword I think is definitely 100% pvp.
the sick thing I didn't know before is that it can procc EVERY ability, so even Mortal strike can come up twice, or overpower. so it's very RNG based, but I think that is what pvp is about. If you want long sustained dps, then play a dk.
Arms is about catching the right moment when the 75% healing is up, your trinkets procced, the other partners are cc'd and you have enough rage to smack that healer down

my vote:
sword.

[Lloret]

I'm not gonna lie, I took swords because everyone I asked (high rated warriors) and warriors on arena junkies have it.

I have to say it's wayy wayy better than axe. I mean 5 % crit.. what is that? you get more crit on every single piece of gear. Next season you will have more crit. get a new piece of gear, and you will have more crit. On the other hand, your enemies will have more and more resilience, so that crit kinda equals out.
I just think it's a waste to spend 5 points in something that gear can give you, I feel that it's like speccing into a talent with the tooltip: "increases all dmg done by 2%"
this seems very pve oriented

sword I think is definitely 100% pvp.
the sick thing I didn't know before is that it can procc EVERY ability, so even Mortal strike can come up twice, or overpower. so it's very RNG based, but I think that is what pvp is about. If you want long sustained dps, then play a dk.
Arms is about catching the right moment when the 75% healing is up, your trinkets procced, the other partners are cc'd and you have enough rage to smack that healer down

my vote:
sword.

hige thanks m8!!! i will pick sword after reading this , it was the one that i wanted but was afraid of making the wrong decision!!

huge thanks )

[Critterbot]

go sword, axe is just an Arcanite Reaper ripoff anyway :3

[Endlaw]

I just got a sword out of totc lol, after a long time of using poleaxe, i can say sword has been such a blast. its different in that the crits aren't as high or as often, but the damage is there... and its burst can be surprising.

[Toobs]

I'm not gonna lie, I took swords because everyone I asked (high rated warriors) and warriors on arena junkies have it.

I have to say it's wayy wayy better than axe. I mean 5 % crit.. what is that? you get more crit on every single piece of gear. Next season you will have more crit. get a new piece of gear, and you will have more crit. On the other hand, your enemies will have more and more resilience, so that crit kinda equals out.
I just think it's a waste to spend 5 points in something that gear can give you, I feel that it's like speccing into a talent with the tooltip: "increases all dmg done by 2%"
this seems very pve oriented

sword I think is definitely 100% pvp.
the sick thing I didn't know before is that it can procc EVERY ability, so even Mortal strike can come up twice, or overpower. so it's very RNG based, but I think that is what pvp is about. If you want long sustained dps, then play a dk.
Arms is about catching the right moment when the 75% healing is up, your trinkets procced, the other partners are cc'd and you have enough rage to smack that healer down

my vote:
sword.

"I'm not gonna lie, I took swords because everyone I asked (high rated warriors) and warriors on arena junkies have it." If you look at the 3v3 top every warrior uses axe.

And isnt the procc just an extra white (but yellow) swing. I STRONGLY doubt it can procc to a extra ms/op? And i still prefer 5% crit over the extra blow.

At least I still uses axe cause of the 5% crit. Proccs are proccs but 5% is allways 5%. And wouldnt it be nice to accually get a ms-crit once in a while. I mean.. I my almost full relentless (lacking chest, gloves and head), i have about 30% crit chance. And since a pvp geared priest removes about 11% crit chance those extra 5% is worth everything in my opinion.

Crit is a savior. One crit could mean one less absorbation blow or a HUGE spike dmg.

I rather have 24% crit chance then 19% with a swordprocc. (25% more crit then a sword-user)

[Pieterman]

without reading all pages i know someone will have said something simular to the following:
pure crit is better than a proc
dont forget guys, if you think about it, a crit is a proc aswell.

other than that, it probably doesnt matter what you pick, axe crits harder n more, swords has cool burst with quite a high procchance

[quez]

I'm pretty sure blizzard changed the sword proc to ONLY proc on white swings back in TBC when swordspec were fotm for a short while, then everyone went mace.

It was way to OP to just keep up MS and spamstring a druid every gcd and see those swordprocs comming up.

IMO axe wins by a long shot, 5% crit AND 5%crit dmg.

edit: Whops, i mixed it up with the old windfury totem. The swordnerf made so a swordproc couldn't proc another proc.

[Zaelot]

i was sword specced pve for a long time in BC and i would always take aggro from the tank cause of that insanse burst. (it was only 5% to proc but it was still better than any other spec in pve)

[Bananengurke]

And isnt the procc just an extra white (but yellow) swing. I STRONGLY doubt it can procc to a extra ms/op? And i still prefer 5% crit over the extra blow.

and no.
see I used to be just as ignorant as you were, so I don't blame you. I thought the exact same, until I did a min of dps to a dummy and recount showed somethign like this:

White hit 277863
Overpower 875434
Mortal strike 75778
Rend(dot) 75245
Deep Wounds(dot) 89849
Heroic Strike 662312
Bladestorm 1234123
Sword Specialization - Mortal Strike 13421
Sword Specialization - Overpower 12634
Sword Specialization - Heroic Strike 18434
Sword Specialization - Bladestorm 34212

obviously the numbers are made up, next time I'll log in I will prove with screenshots

[smartAXE]

sword works great for pvp and isnt to bad for pve(if you can keep a somewhat high crit rate)
if my pc could handle arenas i wouldnt mind doin 2's up to 1800 for the sword just to play with it
if i find enough block gear i might just try it thought >.>
and as for the people saying saying the 5% crit dmg is nice for pvp, all in all its like 500 dmg, and i sure anyone would take a 3k proc over the 1500 dmg(3 swings) :<

[AZXK17]

Hey just wondering but my current arena partner is a warrior and runs with sword spec right now, once we hit 1800 he says is switching to mace spec just how does it compare with the sword / axe spec?
i dont play a warrior but acording to arena partner its supposed to be best with full armour pen gemming and grimtoll? but reading these posts im not exactly sure :-\

[Pieterman]

mace spec does NOT stack with regular ArP. same goes for sunder armor, shattering throw..everything.

example:

dude has 10k armor,
u have 35% arp,
shattering throw is active,
5 stacks sunder armor,
mace spec,
battle stance.
thats 35+20+20+15+20 right? nope. itll work out like this
10000*0.65=6500
6500*0.8=5200
5200*0.8=4160
4160*0.85=3536
3536*0.9=3182.4

(10000-3182.4)/100 = 68.176% ArP

[quez]

mace spec does NOT stack with regular ArP. same goes for sunder armor, shattering throw..everything.

Mace spec DO stack with regular ARP, just like 2p t9 and battlestance.

It is though seperated from sunder, fearie fire, shattering throw.

[Toobs]

sword I think is definitely 100% pvp.
the sick thing I didn't know before is that it can procc EVERY ability, so even Mortal strike can come up twice, or overpower

So it can honestly give me 2 overpower-blows? that each crit ~5k?

[Simbert]

and no.
see I used to be just as ignorant as you were, so I don't blame you. I thought the exact same, until I did a min of dps to a dummy and recount showed somethign like this:

White hit 277863
Overpower 875434
Mortal strike 75778
Rend(dot) 75245
Deep Wounds(dot) 89849
Heroic Strike 662312
Bladestorm 1234123
Sword Specialization - Mortal Strike 13421
Sword Specialization - Overpower 12634
Sword Specialization - Heroic Strike 18434
Sword Specialization - Bladestorm 34212

obviously the numbers are made up, next time I'll log in I will prove with screenshots

This is a very old and known Bug in Recount. Somehow Recount mixes up the Ability that procced the Sword Spec, and the Proc itself. And sometimes it even mixes some totally unrelated strike into it. This is because of the way it appears in the combatlog. Most of the time, it looks somewhat like this:

Sword Spec Procs
You hit blabla with MS for 2345 (This hit procced SS)
You hit blabla for 1234 (This being the real SS-proc)

Recount now falsely thinks that the first hit after the mentioning of the Sword-Spec is the procced hit, but usually, it is not. Usually, the first hit after the mentioning of the Sword Spec is the one that procced the Extra Hit, not the extra hit itself. Sometimes, if your white hits and specials overlap, it is even some totally unrelated hit.

This is a well known fact, at least among rogues. Long story short, do not trust recount in regards of what hit is a SS hit, and which is not. You can not even trust it in how much dmg your sword spec does, since, as mentioned above, it totally fails at telling which Hits are the extra ones.

As a rogue, this is pretty obvious, since there often is nonsensical stuff, like "Sword Spec: Wound Poison" Or "Sword Spec: Deadly Poison" in recount. As a warrior, it is not that easy to see, but nonetheless the issue is the same.

Recount lies.

[omglazor]

mace spec does NOT stack with regular ArP. same goes for sunder armor, shattering throw..everything.

example:

dude has 10k armor,
u have 35% arp,
shattering throw is active,
5 stacks sunder armor,
mace spec,
battle stance.
thats 35+20+20+15+20 right? nope. itll work out like this
10000*0.65=6500
6500*0.8=5200
5200*0.8=4160
4160*0.85=3536
3536*0.9=3182.4

(10000-3182.4)/100 = 68.176% ArP

You are terribly wrong. Please refer to my post in Warrior questions thread on armor reduc vs armor pen.

If anything, it would be
10,000 * (20% from ST + 20% from Sunder) = 6,000 armor post-reduc
6,000 * (35+15+10) = 3,600 armor post-ArP

( I am not using the crazy formula above because I have previously calculated ArP to be 100% efficient sub-7600 armor, i.e. multiplier of 1)

[Master Guns]

mace spec does NOT stack with regular ArP. same goes for sunder armor, shattering throw..everything.

example:

dude has 10k armor,
u have 35% arp,
shattering throw is active,
5 stacks sunder armor,
mace spec,
battle stance.
thats 35+20+20+15+20 right? nope. itll work out like this
10000*0.65=6500
6500*0.8=5200
5200*0.8=4160
4160*0.85=3536
3536*0.9=3182.4

(10000-3182.4)/100 = 68.176% ArP

I lol'd IRL.