Moonkin raid spec? Which one?

[Deleted]

I'm going instance/raiding for the first time ever as balance.

I've read 2 guides, but they have 2 different specs. Which one would you recomend I use?

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#0xG0uiIocdhVhohZbxczb

or

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?drui...,kdfR3O,9901¨

or neither?

[nexttosmelly]

well the spec really depends on your gear so i would suggest linking your armoury please with your moonkin gear on thanks

[glosoli]

Considering both don't have all the points spent... neither.
(however, I assume they're both frameworks)

Here:
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?drui...Fc,kdfR3O,9901

Imp MF is good to take with the 2pc t9 bonus. All of this leave you with 2pts to play with. These can be put plenty of places. Brambles, Gale Winds, Typhoon.
Personally, I take typhoon and put 1pt in Gale Winds. People hate to take typhoon - I just glyph it so it doesn't knock back. I use it frequently when I'm running out of fire because it's instant, particularly if it's more than one mob (run across room for said aoe fire thingy, refresh dots, use typhoon)

[Deleted]

I would like you to post your armory before you ask for advice. Your spec depends on your gear, and you would gain little from us guessing how well your character has been pimped out.

[Stiggie]

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#0xRru...uZbxczb:ruizmM

That's what I use(you can move the points in thorns to something else if you want, but I like it. Doesn't up my dps much, but for fights like Algalon, thorns does a significant amount of damage). Qieth is right though, without knowing your gear we can't really suggest a spec.

[Deleted]

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#0xRru...uZbxczb:ruizmM

That's what I use(you can move the points in thorns to something else if you want, but I like it. Doesn't up my dps much, but for fights like Algalon, thorns does a significant amount of damage). Qieth is right though, without knowing your gear we can't really suggest a spec.

Damage to what? You are not supposed to be taking melee damage from anything. If you are referring to your treants, then it doesn't really make much difference on Algalon or any other fight. The increase would still be static :P

[jtstormrage]

Qieth can you link your spec please?

Do you use Owlkin frenzy?

I am very sceptical about it and find it hardly procs at all.

Treants do about 75k damage and do an extra 10% is not much every three minutes.

I have the extra two points in Intensity although I am thinking about moving them to aoe talents (1 in typhoon and 1 in gale winds) for ICC.

[Raissmo]

I don't really have a point in Owlkin Frenzy. I don't expect do get hit in raids. And if you do, it's a boss AOE which means your Owlkin Frenzy won't make a difference.

Here's my built:
http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sh...lyon&n=Raissmo

[izihbo]

This is my spec:

http://eu.wowarmory.com/talent-calc....00000000000000

- OMG no Balance of Power ??
Because I have over 400 hitrating, this way I can put points into Genesis to increase damage on my dots which is nice in the long run.
I also don't have any points in any manacost reducing/mana regen talents because I simply never have mana issues, leaving more room for dps improvement. Learn to manage your mana.

Owlkin Frenzy is NOT a pve talent, don't waste your talents :
Treants are nice for some burst damage. Don't underestimate them!

In my guild, the mages always come first in dps the first 15-20 seconds, but once my dots/eclipses start going off for real, I quickly catch up and usually end up among top 3 dps. Above me are usually the warlocks. At the end of a raid, I'm usually between 5 and 6k dps.

Brambles is alse more for pvp, again; don't waste your talents!

Moonglow is also a waste talent, I see again and again moonkins putting that 1 point in it, it's seriously not worth it, don't underestimate Genesis! I mean c'mon... How often are you not able to do dps @ the end of a bossfight because your manapool has been drained?

With T8+T9 gear (dual 2set bonus ofc!) (or average itemlevel 230+) you shouldn't have to waste any talents in manaregen and moonglow talents, increase your dps instead.

Offtopic: Check your (and others) average itemlevel with this simple macro:

/cleartarget [mod:alt]
/ins
/run local t,c,u=0,0,UnitExists("target") and "target" or "player" for i =1,18 do if i~=4 then local k=GetInventoryItemLink(u,i) if k then local _,_,_,l=GetItemInfo(k) t=t+l c=c+1 end end end if c>0 then print(t/c) end

[Deleted]

I'll post a link to my druid when I get the chance... (Can't logon to WoW and put on the right gear right now)

But I have horrible balance gear. As I said, I'm only just about to start going to instances and raiding ... I really only wanted to resto PvP with this character, but my friends talked me into joining some og their raids as balance...

So I've got all the BG gear and some of the better WG gear.

Don't know if this info helped.

[izihbo]

Yes this info helped, this tells us that your have sucky gear and will need the manaregen/manareducing talents because you won't last 5 minutes with your blue gear (I'm just assuming).

Gear up and suck in those epics then read my reply again ^^

[Deleted]

The suckyness of my gear was never in question... I know it sucks, but then again... always just PvP'ed with this charcter and we're all just getting started.

There's the gear. So what's the best spec for my sucky gear?

http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sh...rhood&n=Morhbo

[izihbo]

Try this spec:

p://eu.wowarmory.com/talent-calc.xml?cid=11&tal=5012203125331303213305300031000000000000000000000000000000205003012000 000000000000000

There's 3 unused points. And here's why:

- Typhoon may not be as important as mana regen.
- Force of Nature (Treants) is also something you may have to sacrifice if you have mana issues.
- Gale Winds - Do you need to do alot of AOE'ing in your raiding content? Personally I can only allow myself to use 1/2. (Consider 2/3 Intensity and 1/2 Gale Winds).
- Consider 3/3 Intensity if you have mana issues in PVE.

So as you may understand, there's 4 talents where you could put those 3 points in; Typhoon, Force of Nature, Gale Winds and Intensity.
As stated before; Consider 3/3 in Intensity if you run into mana issues.

[izihbo]

Oh! And for glyphs:

Glyph of Insect Swarm
Glyph of Moonfire
Glyph of Starfire

[Cerelli]

- OMG no Balance of Power ??
Because I have over 400 hitrating, this way I can put points into Genesis to increase damage on my dots which is nice in the long run.

so... you would rather waste a ton of your item budget on hit rating gear when you can spend 2 talent points and get a lot more haste/crit? oh yeah and you are doing this in favor the weakest set of DPS talents in the entire Balance tree? Even if you have absolutely zero mana issues, genesis is the last place you would want to put points. But Balance of power is absolutely mandatory. 144 hit rating (that is 3 items worth of hit rating BTW) for 2 talent points spent frees up so much item budget for more DPS stats. It is by far one of the strongest overall DPS talents in the entire Balance tree.

Genesis equates to be something along the lines of less than 1% DPS gain per talent point, which is a pretty horrible conversion rate IMO. unless you are relying on your DOTs to do an inappropriately large amount of your overall damage done.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/g...?s=1274&e=1528

This is the highest Moonkin DPS posted for 25N Anub'Arak on this site. IS/MF DOTs made up 12.3% of his overall damage with no points in genesis. http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-ta...hinaha&group=2

So taking those numbers and putting the 2 points from gale winds into genesis

230251 total damage from both dots
2% increase off that from genesis
adds an additional 4600 damage
for a grand total of...
1.02% increased damage

still liking genesis? I sincerely hope not.

Owlkin Frenzy is NOT a pve talent, don't waste your talents :

You underestimate how often this spell procs from unavoidable raid damage. It is low priority, but i'll take points in Frenzy over Genesis any day of the week.

Beasts - snobold fires, Burning bile, Arctic Breath, and Massive Crash can proc Frenzy

Jaraxus - Chain lightning, legion flame, the infernals hitting you after they drop aggro on the tanks, the Mistresses pile driving you into the ground

Faction Champs - well... just about everything procs it here

Twins - eating the wrong color orb which happens almost constantly. Last time i got to DPS on that fight i had 15% uptime on frenzy but there was some (bad) luck involved there. I had to eat some orbs when trying to clear the debuff off me at the portals.

Anub - Penetrating cold, getting clipped by a small add, and the leaching swarm

Pretty much any fight, I will have +5% up time on frenzy which easily equals 5 points in genesis if not surpasses it. This is with 2/3 points in the talent.

[Rabbitalope]

Damage to what? You are not supposed to be taking melee damage from anything. If you are referring to your treants, then it doesn't really make much difference on Algalon or any other fight. The increase would still be static :P

He probably meant that Algalon hits tank fast and takes higher reflected damage from improved thorns. It is barely noticable in 25 man, but it can be very useful in Algalon 10 if your group needs all the dps it can squeeze out.

To OP, there is a basic moonkin guild sticked in the forum with the essential spec outlined and it also explains the leftover points. I would suggest reading that guide first, but you can pick any of these specs in this thread- all the differences in the specs won't really mount up to a huge dps loss or dps gain as it is simply swapped points around between weak talents (unless you need AE).

[Rabbitalope]

Cerelli, I just finished typing out wall of text and then realized your post said pretty much the same thing....delete key sigh.

[izihbo]

I get 128 hitrating from the triumph trinket alone, so no... its not 3 items worth of hitrating. And the USE effect is 520 (or something) hasterating which is nice to squeeze in a couple of extra Starfire crits in lunar eclipse. The 3 points in Genesis is 3% extra dot damage that I always have... Owlkin Frenzy has a 15% chance on damage taken for a proc, I'm not taking damage that often for it to be worth it. I might end up never getting a proc the 5-6 times I'm getting damage throughout an encounter.

[Cerelli]

I get 128 hitrating from the triumph trinket alone, so no... its not 3 items worth of hitrating. And the USE effect is 520 (or something) hasterating which is nice to squeeze in a couple of extra Starfire crits. The 3 points in Genesis is 3% extra dot damage that I always have... Owlkin Frenzy has a 15% chance on damage taken for a proc, I'm not taking damage that often for it to be worth it. I might end up never getting a proc the 5-6 times I'm getting damage throughout an encounter.

fair enough, but there are numerous other trinkets out there that are better.

so i guess you are ignoring the plain and simple math and logic as to why genesis is a garbage talent. Can lead a horse to water, but you cant make him drink. In the end, you are the one gimping yourself. If you are content in that, good for you.

[Rabbitalope]

I'm not taking damage that often for it to be worth it. I might end up never getting a proc the 5-6 times I'm getting damage throughout an encounter.

How are you not taking damage often? I am assuming here that you are raiding ToGC, and every fight has unavoidable damage, mostly in the form of raid damage, that 1. occurs more than 5-6 times per fight and 2, can and will proc frenzy. The only fight where consistent raid damage doesn't proc Frenzy for me, and this boogles my mind, is Xt.