[ELE] New Fire Nova Spell

[Tunak]

I am pro the new fire nova ... on a lot of fights there are more than one target and if you can predict where they will stack it can be a nice dps boost ... with a spec like this http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?sham...PwZz,ka9,10958 ofc

Chain lightning will do more damage and cost you ALOT less mana throughout the length of a fight. The only time FN gets an advantage is when there are more than 3 targets within 10 yards of eachother and dont move. Have fun wasting 2 talent points.

[Deathmstr]

"Have fun wasting 2 talent points."

I think this is funny. You know, those almost useless points in first tier (mana efficiency), you can place them elsewhere.

Plus, FN is FUN.

[Tunak]

"Have fun wasting 2 talent points."

I think this is funny. You know, those almost useless points in first tier (mana efficiency), you can place them elsewhere.

Plus, FN is FUN.

Ya mana efficiency is terrible for DPS you're right. Taking points out of mana efficiency to make room for a worthless talent on anything but trash is an awsome idea!

I mean really! 2% mana off of elemental spells over the length of an entire boss fight, that cant possibly save you TONS of mana! No way! Mana is for newbs, we need to spam more 1000 mana base cost spells with very little utility outside of trash that also has proven to be a DPS loss if put into a rotation over shocks and CL!

You're right dude, sorry for being so newb.

[Deathmstr]

Wow, just wow!

I haven't started ICC yet, but did 3/5 HM 25M with my shaman. In ANY fight, I don't go near OOM (50%). If so, i'll start TS while moving.

Those talents are nice. Trash is part of the instance. Get over it.

Plus, you can quit the childish act. Mana efficiency isn't a problem for Ele. We can always go all out.

[Tunak]

Wow, just wow!

I haven't started ICC yet, but did 3/5 HM 25M with my shaman. In ANY fight, I don't go near OOM (50%). If so, i'll start TS while moving.

Those talents are nice. Trash is part of the instance. Get over it.

Plus, you can quit the childish act. Mana efficiency isn't a problem for Ele. We can always go all out.

ya cause 10 mans always have replenishment buff right? Do you cast CL every time its off CD to max DPS? You're logic is flawed. Typical newb. Btw how much DPS you pull in 25m raids, I'd love to know.

[Deleted]

Gosh, again....
First I'll quote something interesting:

ya cause 10 mans always have replenishment buff right?

Wow... just wow...
You know... you should play a different spec. Elemental main, but why not put 22 points into Enhancement so Melee get 20% haste from your Totem instead of 16%? Cause 10mans don't always have an Enhancer/Frost-DK, right?

"Hey, this talent isn't good because when x and y are missing, but z and q are out and when the planets aren't in >this< order, than through talents m and i I'd lose 0.0157 DPS using the talent."
If you don't have Replenishment, then you better adjust or are screwed.
You flame people for using Trash-speccs (well, FN is also good for some boss fights, but let's just go with it and call it a Trash-specc, seeing as it really shines there) but talk about a specc with a talent that is only useful when you lack the most important caster buff. Doesn't look weird to you?


This "CL every time its off CD"-thingy is also not always correct. Wrote about it in another thread, too lazy to do it again.
http://www.mmo-champion.com/class-shaman/(ele)-just-need-you-oppinion/msg1867743/#msg1867743

And, as I wrote there:
Yes, you use a shock when you have to move. But who the hell told you that you always have to move only for a GCD? Remember Mimiron P2? Or Hodir Flash Freeze when it's rather far away. Or Thorim, those Lightning-things. There are several more situations, just too lazy too write 'em all right now.
The point is: When you have to avoid something or move somewhere and it takes more than 1 GCD, then FN is a DPS-increase. Yes, you could also cast TS or renew your Water Shield, but FN would still increase your DPS more than those two do. (if you're running oom without WS/TS, than those increase the DPS by a bit more of course)

You should come out of your box where there are only x situations and everything else doesn't exist. Look at the bigger picture, more bossfights, more situations, etc.
Just to give you an example of what I mean:

The DPS loss of having to keep a totem in range of the boss is also a major reason why its completely innefective in 99% of encounters and not worthing throwing points into the talent.

Which fights did you think of? I mean... 99% is a really huuuuge number. So lets say 90%... that would mean 9 of 10 fights, where you would always have to run to the enemy to put down your >>>>>5min<<<<< totems and therefore lose DPS. Bosses where that is not the case:
Malygos (he gets called, so you can place your totems beforehand), Patchwerk (no use though), Thaddius, Noth after he teleported, Heigan for when he teleports (huuuge use for FN in that fight), Goth, Kel'thuzad.
Ignis, Razorscale, Iron Council (you should aim for the circles, so you'll always have to move into the room), Auriaya, Thorim, Freya, Mimiron (problematic in HM, but meh), Algalon, Yogg-Saron.
Northrend Beasts, Lord Jaraxxus, Faction Champs (they'll come to your totems and you'll always want your Tremor Totem to cover the most possible space), Anub'arak.

Won't start with ICC, cause I only know some of the fights from PTR and some things have changed.
But, you should get the picture... it's not 99%, nor 90%, hell it's only close to 50% of the fights where you can't put down your totems in boss range because that would mean that you've lost DPS.



There's one more thing I don't really get...

Chain lightning will do more damage and cost you ALOT less mana throughout the length of a fight. The only time FN gets an advantage is when there are more than 3 targets within 10 yards of eachother and dont move. Have fun wasting 2 talent points.

Why? Why the hell would CL cost less mana?
You do know that CL is the more expensive spell, right? And that CL has a lower CD than FN (except for specced and glyphed), which means that CL will be used more often.
And you also know that FN has been changed from the PTR and now works with Elemental Focus, right?

So in EVERY situation, CL costs more mana than FN. Always. Yes, on 3-4 targets it does more damage, but it still costs more mana. Weird that you didn't see that.


And another thing, whch Deathmstr also answered:

I mean really! 2% mana off of elemental spells over the length of an entire boss fight, that cant possibly save you TONS of mana!

Congratz on saving TONS of mana. TONS of mana that weren't needed. Ending the fight with 50% mana is the same as ending the fight with 20% mana. Those whole 30% difference are worth NO DPS.
If you always end every fight on <10% mana, than congratz, you're doing good. If you only end 20% of your fights this way, than you're doing something wrong and should think about using more than one specc. (Dual-Specc wass a great invention)
Because if that's the case, than you're fighting 80% of your fights with a WRONG or MEDIOCRE specc. This would equal the word "FAIL".

[Deleted]

ya cause 10 mans always have replenishment buff right? Do you cast CL every time its off CD to max DPS? You're logic is flawed. Typical newb. Btw how much DPS you pull in 25m raids, I'd love to know.

Not everyone specs for 10 mans assuming no replenishment. I don't really see how Ele Shamans go OoM on trash anyway, CL and FN will keep clearcasting up so much.

[Nirual]

It's pretty simple, really. It's an AoE. Unlike Chain Lightning, which does the most damage on the first hit and can actually be worthwhile for single targets, Fire Nova is only good for AoE situations, or alternatively for encounters that involve a lot of movement (preferably for you, not the boss).

Personally, I try to drop my totems close to the boss anyway (unless the setup requires me to do otherwise) and I use FN whenever it seems beneficial (sometimes even as resto, if I can afford the mana and GCD).
It's definitely better than the old totem but it's not going to be a spell you use regularly.

[Gilian]

I'm bored i will tell you guys a story..

I tried out fire nova,
Dropped totems at boss feet Theres alot of walking at lord marrowgar,
Everytime i had to move.. i used fire nova while moving(ITS INSTANT AMG)
And ended up with 7700 dps When he died.
Id show you recount but sadly i'm at work and didn't bother saving it..

Basically if your going to be next to the boss and the boss happens to force you into walking every now and then you can use instant casts(without proper talents frost shocks can be awwfully crap +share cooldown with flameshock) you to make up for the walking or atleast lower the loss of dps..

And before you go Lol 7700 dps shit low dps rofl mode...
Its my offspec kkthx.

Wow, you do more dps in your offspec then i do in my mainspec with full thriump set and ilvl 258 non-set items, except trinkets and waist. Rwar calculated that i can do a max of around 8200 dps. That's in perfect conditions. But you, in offspec, can pull off a "shit low" dps of 7700 on a high mobility fight. GG

[Tunak]

Wow, you do more dps in your offspec then i do in my mainspec with full thriump set and ilvl 258 non-set items, except trinkets and waist. Rwar calculated that i can do a max of around 8200 dps. That's in perfect conditions. But you, in offspec, can pull off a "shit low" dps of 7700 on a high mobility fight. GG

AKA he's a lier.

WTB armory link. No chance your doing 7k+ in an off-specc.