Give "newbs" a chance.

[Jeff Steege]

I think it might be time for more experienced players to reconsider running with new, extremely casual, or just plain bad players of the World of Warcraft. As a disclaimer I am not the most "hardcore uber-leet roflstomper" who has ever waved his e-peen around. I don't raid because I find it boring to run the same dungeon for more than an hour. I have been on a few raids before and performed just fine, but it's not really my cup of tea. Because of this I run a ton of heroics, and try to gear out my character the best that I can in that manner. I decided to heal a random reg last night to get the last two badges I needed for a new piece of badge gear. I joined a group to run Halls of Lightning, with a DK tank, an Spriest, Hunter, and Rogue. All of the players were 78-80, and all but the spriest had issues. The spriest was fine level 78 and tapping the charts at 1.3k which is fine maybe even really good (I've never played one) for someone of his/her level. The tank was earnest and fun, but didn't know the instance and struggled holding aggro in groups. The rogue had a hard time pushing 800 dps, but otherwise not a problem. The hunter was from a different planet entirely, no pet, stood in melee range attemping to fire, volleyed on every pull,trapped seemingly at random, and pulled about 500 dps.
I loved it. It took way longer than it normally does to blow through the instance, whiped once, and struggled on things I haven't struggled on in a long time. It was challenging, exciting, and a bit humorous, it is a great break from the faceroll monotony that most of the runs I am on have become. Before you bail early on your next group of "bads" what I am saying, is give "newbs" a chance.

[Deleted]

what I am saying, is give "newbs" a chance.

No

[Kynttila]

WoW is serious business, you have to give your whole life for it if you want to succeed in it

[Alzagor]

If you like it, sure. Make a battlegroup with people who like wiping etc. I just want to get my 2 EoF asap and I cba to have slackers around

[diseous]

whiped once

[homerunhomer]

I learnt how to play, then they should too.

[foralexlul]

So you had a hard time clearing a normal instance because those players couldn't even be bothered to read they're abilities ,they played horrible, and this was fun for you ?

Haha , well if you like to waste your time like that no1 can stop, and dw the way this game is going you'll find grps like this more often.

[Jeff Steege]

No

Damn you Hasslemoff!

[zox]

So you had a hard time clearing a normal instance because those players couldn't even be bothered to read they're abilities ,they played horrible, and this was fun for you ?

Haha , well if you like to waste your time like that no1 can stop, and dw the way this game is going you'll find grps like this more often.

I think what he really means is that it's fun to run an instance, which is closely tuned to what your group can do, where mobs live more than 3 seconds, and you may actually have time to see stuff...

[Jeff Steege]

I think what he really means is that it's fun to run an instance, which is closely tuned to what your group can do, where mobs live more than 3 seconds, and you may actually have time to see stuff...

/hug

[soonguy]

Here is a great example of why nubs DO NOT get a chance. I que'd up for a random to get my frost (I don't care about Triumph), I am ported to HoL a reasonably easy dungeon that requires little to no skill (especially for a tank like myself). After a few pulls I notice its taking a LONG LONG time to kill the trash, so I take a quick look at recount and to my surprise I am #1 on the DPS chars at a whopping ~1500 DPS (I'm a prot war). I'm like WTF this can't be right and I reset the meeter and do a few more pulls; after the 1st boss I'm convinced my DPS blows nuts, its been nearly 10 minutes and only 1 boss down (0 wipes). To my amazement the DPS' gear isnt that bad, certainly not enough to pull < 1500 after all 2k DPS was quite obtainable DURING TBC! Talking trash didnt seem to motivate them either as by the end of the 45m run I was still #1 DPS. I think if we had wiped once I would have left the group.

The moral of this story is some players just suck or plain dont give a shit about trying hard. Which leads me to my main point...

Blizz has this thing called a raid lockout, so if I choose to take a 'nub' or a lesser geared player and the run dosen't go as intended (a FULL clear), I'M SCREWED UNTIL NEXT WEEK! Since gear = progression its very understandable why you see in trade chat "LFM ICC 25, pst stat/spec/ACHIEVEMENT 5K GS only" Blizz in a sense has helped fuel this elitist attitude by limiting our raiding (even more so now with limited attempts)

Just my $0.02...

[Damax]

I think the op didn't realise that because of the bad dps and bad tank, healing was a challenge because he had to heal more to fix the mess ups of the rest of the group.

yup I agree. having challenge as a healer is nice however dungeons and heroics are not challenging anymore. though for challenge you don't necessarily need to group with baddies.

[Nimoku]

God, those players must've been bad. I mean, i can push over 1.7k dps on my lvl 74 paladin with quest greens.

Really, i want to group with people with greens or blues, but i can't tolerate BAD players, that is the 600 melee hunter or the half prot/ret specced paladin doing 300 dps or a dk in full T9 doing 900 dps ...

I'm not elitist, but I do know when people are just plain bad and are ffing dimwits who can't rotate 3-5 buttons ...
Wasting someone's time is the worst insult you can give, if you aren't capable of pulling off average dps for your gear level, then you are wasting my time and then you can sod off and look for another group.

And if you want a challenging 5man: ICC heroics are there, do them.

[Jeddite]

I'd rather get 70MPH out of my $15 than 45MPH. Bleeding hearts are for candy asses and cardiologists.

[Nartalath]

I give advice to new players. If they're doing something stupid, I'll let them know in a polite way. But there's a difference between new players, who are generally very willing to learn and improve, and jackasses who like to ruin peoples' day on their scrub alts.

I don't pretend to know everything about every class, but if they're wearing gear with bad stats (like hunters with dodge guns), I'll let them know that isn't meant for them. I'm not a jerk about it, but if they make the same mistakes over and over in the same dungeon, yes, I will lose my temper. They deserve it.

I like to run with people whose gear is at the same level as mine. On my rogue, we face-roll dungeons and we have a lot of fun doing silly things, like dragging all the trash to the first boss. On my new priest, it's more fun for me to run with people my gear because, well, I won't learn to heal if nothing lives long enough for my party to take damage!

[Djolisimo]

You are not saying 'give newbs a chance', you are actually saying:
'give totally and completely undeserved random chance to stupid and retarded nabs and
ebayers(even worse), for no particular reason', that way sending them a message:
'just play badly, act retarded, don't make any effort to learn to play better and you will
get everything you want'.

Worst-Message-Ever you could send anyone at all.

Do you really want to do that?

[Lezarin]

Me i do me daily heroic on my shadow priest my raiding toon get me 2 emblems of frost and gone .

then i go back in on my alts and live in heroics if i can ones a protadin others a hunter now you can call me a scrub dont care if blizz didnt want ye playing alts they,d limit you to 1 toon .
i do msot of them on my tankadin not the best geared but enough to pass the weary eye etc only got a gear score of 3.8k so have raised a few eyebrows with that once or twice told them love me or kick me i,ll get a group easy enough generally no complaints after the first pull.

one thing i have discovered on ym tank is i make mistakes (epeen deflater that is)but i,ve not had a single healer complain to me infact msot say thanks and its about time i kept them awake in heroic .

i,ve had the newbs and the scrubs and one thing i learned is gear means shit can have a scrub in gear better then jesus still shit .if i see someone struggling i,ll ask them is everything ok offer advice if they turn into an arse i kick or ignore nothing that gets in the way of a nice calming heroic,

[marrefar]

I'm a fairly good pala healer, I heal raids with my guild and I do heroics.

When I get to a group where people are low geared, I start a conversation. We go through the instance nice and in an average speed, we will keep the humor up if we whipe, and say that done is done. This is a nice run, and I often end up with a smile on my face.

But when I get to groups with good gear, everything all of a sudden will become more serious. I myself need some humor when I'm with other poeple, if i don't get that i'm getting easily bored. So, the thing is, we enter the instance, the tank goes "Buff up". I'm heading for my buffs when I see the tank running in and pulls lots of adds, these will go down fast, I have to heal him, cuz he's no god even if he thinks so. So he keeps pulling, my mana won't go up because I'm always in combat. I tell the guy to stop chain pulling so that I can get my mana up. Then he becomes angry and just keep the pulls coming, then, we whipe. And after the last boss I end up with a sigh and
2 emblems of frost.

So all in all, I will rather prefer a slow, humorous run, with low geared people, than unpatient harcore gamers that don't want anything else than get their emblems of frost as fast as possible. If I meet that kind of people they will taste the boot.

[Nimoku]

I'm a fairly good pala healer, I heal raids with my guild and I do heroics.

When I get to a group where people are low geared, I start a conversation. We go through the instance nice and in an average speed, we will keep the humor up if we whipe, and say that done is done. This is a nice run, and I often end up with a smile on my face.

But when I get to groups with good gear, everything all of a sudden will become more serious. I myself need some humor when I'm with other poeple, if i don't get that i'm getting easily bored. So, the thing is, we enter the instance, the tank goes "Buff up". I'm heading for my buffs when I see the tank running in and pulls lots of adds, these will go down fast, I have to heal him, cuz he's no god even if he thinks so. So he keeps pulling, my mana won't go up because I'm always in combat. I tell the guy to stop chain pulling so that I can get my mana up. Then he becomes angry and just keep the pulls coming, then, we whipe. And after the last boss I end up with a sigh and
2 emblems of frost.

So all in all, I will rather prefer a slow, humorous run, with low geared people, than unpatient harcore gamers that don't want anything else than get their emblems of frost as fast as possible. If I meet that kind of people they will taste the boot.

The better geared players you speak of are the retards i speak of. They have good gear and think they can do anything, such as pulling when you are a clothy and expect the tank to taunt it off you, but in reality, their dps is below mine as a tank. As I said, i don't mind dragging low geared players trough an heroic, but I don't like dragging good geared idiots trough an heroic who think they are IT.

I as a tank, always wait for my healer is mana, if he is over 50% mana, i keep chain pulling while talking. Once my healer goes below 45-50% mana, i stop for a second unless he wants me to keep going. I just want players who know what they are doing, even if they are in greens. If they are gemming with 18 stamina gems in all their sockets as a healer or dps and using cloth spirit gear on a shaman, i'd happily point that out in a rude way to make them leave, everyone can be replaced in the end. Supporting bad behavior is bad, if everyone thinks they can get gear by smashing one button, they are wrong.

[hobokken]

The people generally giving new/bad players shit in random dungeons and such generally arent to great themselves... if they arent good enough to pull your weight in a heroic they have no right to down ya Good tank has no chance at dying and does decent dmg... good dps can pull 45% dmg + in a well geared group... good healers can be a bit of a different story but when you got dps doin 3k puttin down others they are simply being ass holes or trying to look good. Maybe i dont see heroics the same way as some... i mean ret pally 2 piece makes 10k dps easily facerolled on every pull... but either way wotlk heroics where never really hard to begin with :