Jaina: What?

[DrgnDancer]

I know a lot of people have never really liked the character, but I've always have kind of a soft spot for her. She was probably my favorite WCIII character to play, and she is certainly one of Blizzard's better attempts at a strong female. She's always had her annoying points, but a character that no one dislikes is probably a character that no one is particularly going to like either.

In WCIII I saw Jaina as having been written as a foil to Arthas. Both characters were intelligent, strong willed, and emotional; but Arthas took these traits to extremes in a way that eventually led to his corruption, whereas Jaina tempered them with with wisdom, compassion, and a willingness to take advice. She was also an extremely intuitive character, whose "instincts" tended to be very good. These traits served her fairly well, and by the end of the game she's shown as a decisive, confident leader whose troops are willing to follow her into creating and entirely new country on Theramore Island.

We know from source material and in game stuff that she was born the second child of the leader of the City-State of Kul'Tiras (the Grand Admiral), that she was born with a powerful affinity to magic that led her becoming one of the few female wizards of the Kirin Tor, and that she and Arthas had some sort of thing going on prior to WCIII. We know that she reject Arthas before the Culling of Strat, because she refused to take part in the mass slaughter. We know that she was smart enough to see the threat of the Legion, and brave enough to lead her people in toe to toe battle with the most powerful destructive force in the Universe. We know she founded and now leads Theramore, and that her devotion to laws and treaties of Theramore are sufficient that she was willing to let her father die rather than betray them.

Now, ICC. WTF is up with her? First of all, she's suddenly obsessed with Arthas. She rejected him like ten years ago, before he was even corrupted, because she couldn't countenance his actions. She's shown no particular sign in those ten years that she regretted her actions any more than anyone else thinking back sadly on a failed relationship. Arthas: Rise of the Lich King certainly implies that she feels kind of guilty about the whole thing, but she's not really let that affect her actions in the last ten years. She's spent those ten years doing anything and everything BUT looking for Arhtas, trying to find out hat happened to him, or trying to redeem him. Yet now, suddenly, Arthas is her all consuming passion. She'll sacrifice anyone and anything to get to him and try to redeem his soul. Seriously, where did this come from?

Plus she's suddenly unwilling to listen to anyone or follow her instincts. Tirion, Uther and her gut all tell her that Arthas is gone, but she has to go have a quick convo anyway? The woman who took half her father's fleet across the unknown ocean, to a continent no one knew existed, on the advice of a guy who can turn into a crow she's never seen before, simply because it "felt right", is suddenly unable to trust her gut? Love makes people do strange things (though you'd think if she loved him so much she might have wandered out to Northrend before now), but it rarely completely changes how someone thinks.

Then there's the way she deals with the whole thing. She's a decisive military commander and one of the most powerful (if not the most powerful) Mages on Azeroth. She personally commanded, from the front, the human forces in the battle of Mt Hyjal. She's gone toe to toe with a demon lord (possibly THE demon lord, depending on whether you consider Saragas a demon or something more) without flinching. And she stands there looking weepy while that scrub Tyrannus kills her soldiers and raises them as undead? Really? Like some untried Lieutenant trying to find her ass? And she doesn't even think to have her people take cover when Sindragosa flies up to kill everybody?

Finally there's the matter of her personal history and her dialog in both HoR and the ICC raid.

"Frostmourne, the blade that destroyed our kingdom."

"Our kingdom"? What Kingdom? Kul'tiras is still there, and it's a city-state not a kingdom, so she can't be talking about her place of birth. Dalaran was beaten but not broken by the Scourge, and is also a city-state not a kingdom, so she can't be taking about the place where she trained and served. Theramore wouldn't even exist without the Scourge and Legion invasion, and is ALSO a city-state not a kingdom, so she can't be talking about the nation she founded and has shown herself to be utterly loyal to. What? Lorderon? A place she *visited* a few times? Seriously? Don't get me wrong, I'm sure she'd feel the tragedy of Lorderon's fall, and feel it keenly. Had things been different, she might have one day been queen there, but it's no more "her" kingdom than California is "my" state because I spent a few months in Silicon Valley a couple years ago.

"It was nothing, your majesty. Just... I'm proud of my king."

Her king? She's the founder and ruler of a full member state of the Alliance. She refused to surrender sovereignty of that nation even her own father, to the point of letting him die rather than give up Theramore's independence and treaties. She regularly goes her own way, even to the point of physically ending the fight between Varian and Thrall in the Undercity against "her king's" expressed wishes. Now suddenly he's "her king"? Her friend? Sure. A fellow ruler? Definitely. Even first among equals as the leader of the Alliance? Yes. But he's no more her king than Magni Bronzebeard is.

I dunno. I just hate what they did with her in this patch. She's always been a bit emotional (which Blizzard seems to require in its female characters), but she nearly always lets her head rule her heart when it's important. It's like they needed a character to do and say certain things, couldn't find one, and dressed up an entirely new NPC in the clothes, name and powers of Jaina Proudmore. Is it really THAT hard to keep track of character development? I mean it's not like this is the Wheel of Time, and she has a thousand pages of development spread over 12 novels or anything. She has a bit of background from the manual and WCII games, a few scenes in Rise of the Lick King , and makes a few appearances in the comic and the current game.

[Bloodhead]

The name is spelled Jaina not Jania.

[painweaver]

will someone read this and sum it up for me. i got ur point about DALARAN IS A CITY STATE NOT A KINGDOM OMGZGEEZEBLIZZGETURSOCIETIESRIGHTWTF but you lost me somewhere

[Stings]

i read the start and the end, and seeing what i got out from is that you want Jaina be a cold and heartless... either way beats me tbh.

[Frozenbeef]

traitorous witch needs to die

Jaina : HAI HORDEZ GUYS AM ALLYYIN U COZ I R SUPR SPECILZ

then the alliance just take her back after she left lordaeron to rot...?

[Jeare]

fanboi who cant even spell her name right

[Muraske]

traitorous witch needs to die

Jaina : HAI HORDEZ GUYS AM ALLYYIN U COZ I R SUPR SPECILZ

then the alliance just take her back after she left lordaeron to rot...?

25v1 Comp Stomp No BackStabz?

[Lightfist]

traitorous witch needs to die

Jaina : HAI HORDEZ GUYS AM ALLYYIN U COZ I R SUPR SPECILZ

then the alliance just take her back after she left Lordaeron to it's doom appointed to it by it's own leaders for not listening to the Prophet Medivh so she could follow his advice and go to Kalimdor, saving the world from the Legion.

[tjanson]

will someone read this and sum it up for me. i got ur point about DALARAN IS A CITY STATE NOT A KINGDOM OMGZGEEZEBLIZZGETURSOCIETIESRIGHTWTF but you lost me somewhere

Basically he's saying Jaina went from a strong leader who along with Thrall and Malfurion/Tyrande essentially saved the world from the threat of the Burning Legion to a wishy washy emo Valley girl in the space of an expansion. Even though the wall of text was somewhat torturous, I agree with the OP here. Jaina is a joke. I wouldn't follow her down the street, much less into Icecrown.

I especially agree with how odd the "I'm proud of my king" line sounded. Your points were all pretty valid... just try and organize them a little bit better next time.

[DrgnDancer]

The name is spelled Jaina not Jania.

Meh. Stupid Spell-checker, my bad.

fanboi who cant even spell her name right

Again, Meh, stupid spell checker. I don't think it so much fanboi, as much that I like consistency in characters. If she'd been a "wishy washy emo Valley girl" from the beginning, and still was, well that's the character. She seems to be a completely different character with the same name.

[Lightfist]

On topic, as far as Varian being "her King" - he's the king of the VAST majority of the human population. Her people. That's how I take it, anyway.

As for her being a much weaker character...I agree, but this entire expansion has been centered around her former lover being an evil bastard that must be destroyed. Hopefully she'll shape up.

[Windspast]

It's a good post. I hate what blizzard has done with her character . It's like they're catering this game to 11 year olds... I can't have a strong mature woman, they need a weak crying little girl. But as long as she has big breasts, it's okay.


I used to like her character alot through WC2 and WC3 as well but in WoW, her character has just gotten more and more stupid and annoying. She used to be intelligent but I guess blizzard thinks everyone likes brainless meat heads like Varian and Garrosh.

Oh and it's funny how little people on MMO-Champion know how to read anything over 10 sentences. Don't comment if you didn't bother to read the post

[Zanathos]

I dunno, I can see sort of what the OP is saying, about her change in character. But I think of it like this. A persons first love, and the person who took their virginity (obviously not always the same person). These are two things that make most people retarded. They will forever act differently because of these things. Sure, Jaina did other stuff, she was in love, but she STILL HAD A NATION depending on her, and had to make the hard sacrifices. As for her sudden weepiness when they plan to kill the Lich king. Well, that's exactly like suddenly knowing for SURE you will never get back with your first love, etc. She is going to try to do anything to get that chance back.

As for it being 'her king'. I'd agree with SPF18 in the fact that he is basically the king of Humanity.

[tjanson]

On topic, as far as Varian being "her King" - he's the king of the VAST majority of the human population. Her people. That's how I take it, anyway.

He's the king of Stormwind. She leads Theramore. As far as anyone knows now Gilneas is still human(even if completely isolated and now turning into worgen, but she doesn't know that), and Kul Tiras didn't just sink into the sea.

It's hard to guesstimate exactly how big proportionately these places are, because gameplay takes a front seat over realism, but calling Stormwind the VAST majority of humanity is an assumption. Obviously Blizzard has set Varian up as the de facto leader of the Alliance, but Jaina has always been her own person - allowing her own father to die rather than break faith with the Horde. I'm not really a Jaina fanboy, but the sudden, unexplained character changes are a little disconcerting.

Along the same lines, would it have been too much to ask for a quest or two(or even a mini event that occurs periodically in the SW Throne room) explaining how Magni, Jaina, Tyrande and Velen suddenly defer to a man who has been missing for so long? It's rather similar to Garrosh's instant elevation to Thrall's second... maybe I'm just sick of Blizzard's shitty storytelling.

[AnotherPaladin]

Jaina is an okay character. She's weird and outlandish though. I mean if she wants to have sex with an orc thats her thing, but why does so much lore revolve around her? Arthas is a lost cause. Move on Jaina.

[Lightfist]

He's the king of Stormwind. She leads Theramore. As far as anyone knows now Gilneas is still human(even if completely isolated and now turning into worgen, but she doesn't know that), and Kul Tiras didn't just sink into the sea.

It's hard to guesstimate exactly how big proportionately these places are, because gameplay takes a front seat over realism, but calling Stormwind the VAST majority of humanity is an assumption.

It's stated very clearly that Stormwind is the last bastion of human (not Worgen...because they're half-breeds if anything) power. Without SW, all the other human nations (if they can still be called that) wouldn't even be CLOSE to a World Power.

Jaina is an okay character. She's weird and outlandish though. I mean if she wants to have sex with an orc thats her thing, but why does so much lore revolve around her? Arthas is a lost cause. Move on Jaina.

It's hard to just 'move on' from your first and only love. As for her having sex with an Orc...*ahem*

THRALL AND JAINA ARE FRIENDS!

[Mmrdkm]

Yeah, i see th OP intent, from cool headed to weeping girl all in one patch, yet i would have been surprised if she hadn't search for arthas in the first place. maybe a bit over the dramma side, but Blizz needed someone to transmit this sense of loss to the players.

Regarding Varyan is King of stormwind and leader of the alliance, so in practical terms he rules all of the alliance forces, not the nations, but the military power, think of him as a roman emperator, so in practical term he is King, of all human nations. At least from this perspective.

Regarding how Varyan gets where he is, it´s all explained in the comic book, at least the first 20 issues, and many many things become clear there, including how powerfull Jaina really is and how stupid Garrosh really is, also it brings everything into proportion, since the geography aint limited by gameing convinience

[Lolretadin]

The OP thinks Jaina has met Sargeras. I lol'd at this epic trollage.

[SoupOfTheDay]

Hopefully she regains what made her a good character in Cataclysm.

[Daginni]

The first 2-3 posts should be banned for trolling.

Anyways, I found Jaina to be a respectful character in WCIII. Sure I liked other characters more, but she is on of the few that are not mindlessly saying that the Alliance and Horde should go to battle until they're both dead, or too weak to fight off another invasion.