Neck-deep in Vile and Boomkins

[exochaft]

This sort of falls outside of my realm of expertise, so I'm throwing the question to the forums.

Our 10man group was debating on bringing a boomkin in for the Lich King fight, specifically for getting the Neck-deep in Vile achievement for 3.3. Now, obviously Starfall is getting a buff, and I know it would not be up for every wave of Vile Spirits. Be that as it may, we've never had a boomkin along with us for the LK fight (even on 25man), so I was curious if Starfall can hit the Vile Spirits while spawning (if not, at what point does it become viable to pop Starfall), and is unglyphed Typhoon a decent method to knockback Vile Spirits as they close in on the raid. I'm not even sure if they can be knocked back/stunned/snared/rooted, since we generally just ignored them and spread out the damage. I'm sure there are plenty of boomkins here that have personal experience with the Vile Spirits, or have actually completed achievement and can offer some advice.

Thanks in advance!

[Deleted]

Yes and yes. Glyphed starfire can be used on every other Vile Spirit phase, and VERY effective. Likewise an Unglyphed Typhoon is usually very nice for LK, unless you are really great at handling the spirits. You would want to use Typhoon after the spirits have become active, preferably when the first one reach the ground. You will hit all of them, knock them back and slow them with the daze. I do this for every Vile Spirit phase, unless our shadowpriests have been too generous with their AOE :P

Typhoon is also useful for Valkyrs, although they are probably a bit trivial on 10 man. Typhoon will daze the Valkyr but *not* knock it back, so its a good thing to use as a slow.

I would say that Typhoon is probably mandatory as a moonkin on LK. If you get sucked into Frostmourne, you will be hard pressed if you can't stop the add from healing. And even so, Typhoon has so many uses. The only place you wouldn't use it, is on ghouls in phase 1 - they *will* get knocked back, and your tanks will be furious.

Really, moonkins are absolutely fine for LK - even moreso in 3.3.3!

[BartolGdH]

Yes and yes. Glyphed starfire can be used on every other Vile Spirit phase, and VERY effective. Likewise an Unglyphed Typhoon is usually very nice for LK, unless you are really great at handling the spirits. You would want to use Typhoon after the spirits have become active, preferably when the first one reach the ground. You will hit all of them, knock them back and slow them with the daze. I do this for every Vile Spirit phase, unless our shadowpriests have been too generous with their AOE :P

Typhoon is also useful for Valkyrs, although they are probably a bit trivial on 10 man. Typhoon will daze the Valkyr but *not* knock it back, so its a good thing to use as a slow.

I would say that Typhoon is probably mandatory as a moonkin on LK. If you get sucked into Frostmourne, you will be hard pressed if you can't stop the add from healing. And even so, Typhoon has so many uses. The only place you wouldn't use it, is on ghouls in phase 1 - they *will* get knocked back, and your tanks will be furious.

Really, moonkins are absolutely fine for LK - even moreso in 3.3.3!

You meant Starfall, Q.

And I'm just pointing this out because exochaft said he didn't have too much expertise regarding boomkins, not because I want to be a smartass

Other than this little mistake (a slip of the pen, I'm sure) I agree entirely. Although I was always frightened to use Typhoon on the Valkyrs because I thought I could knock them to the edge. Good to know that this isn't the case.

[Deleted]

Hee hee, I decided to test just for the heck of it on a 25 man. I was very relieved when they didn't get knocked back :P

And yes indeed, it was a slight slip. We are talking starfall (fall, fall, coming down from the sky), ofcourse :P

[exochaft]

You meant Starfall, Q.

And I'm just pointing this out because exochaft said he didn't have too much expertise regarding boomkins, not because I want to be a smartass

Other than this little mistake (a slip of the pen, I'm sure) I agree entirely. Although I was always frightened to use Typhoon on the Valkyrs because I thought I could knock them to the edge. Good to know that this isn't the case.

LoL, yeah, I just read over that and just saw Starfall instead of Starfire. I was implying that I haven't done boomkin for ICC personally yet, last time was back in ToC/ToGC, so I don't have the expertise of knowing where and when to effectively use abilities in ICC.

More along the topic, we've established the proper use of Starfall and Typhoon. My follow-up question would be the use of Hurricane. Granted group comp will heavily affect this answer, is it wise in terms of mana efficiency or just blatent DPS efficiency to use Hurricane against the Vile Spirits? I will assume that once they're able to be subjected to Typhoon that Hurricane will work, as well. Is it advised to have the raid group up (when there's no Defile danger) so all the adds follow the same path to increase the efficacy of Hurricane? Or do you just kite and pick them off one-by-one with the rest of the range? As a reminder, we've always just ignored them and ate them instead of actually trying to kill them.

Edit: Oh, and if it comes down to single-target nuking, are the Vile Spirits able to be rooted?

[Deleted]

Unless I totally screwed up my positioning, hurricane can't hit the vile spirits. I don't see mages or warlocks use ground targeted AOE spells either. You would want to switch to a spirit and single target them down (switching every few seconds to spread the damage). Unless ofcourse your shadow priests and warlocks (through seeds and whatsitcalled) can get them far enough down to simply have you nuke them once they start moving down.

I've never tried rooting the vile spirits. Roots doesn't last very long with all the damage going about, and if you are able to get one on your own, its better to just let it explode (on you) than to try any fancy stuff..

[Parasha]

how about getting glyph of focus just for that fight(achievement). stand just under LK and pop starfall. 20% more dmg on spirits(10% more after patch) wroth it?

our setup is :
Spriest
Arc Mage
Moonkin
Fury warr
Enh shammy.

so priest channels mind seer all the time, i pop starfall, typhoon and then continiue single target dmg on them, arc mage single target them down also. there are always like 2-3 landing and blowing up. For the ach maybe arc mage should go fire and put living bombs on all spirits? (going for the mount slowly)

[elbouli]

having your mage go fire just for this achievement is probably your best plan, living bomb will do a lot of aoe dmg, and between the mage and the spriest, most of the adds will be pretty low by the time they start coming down,

i'm not sure if they can be affected by piercing howl (from the fury warrior), but its worth a try to give some more time single targeting down the last few,

having everyone stack up on the same side of the room, (being aware of defile), will also allow the mage and spriest to continue to aoe for a bit longer

but if you don't get them all down. you are going to take some serious damage

[juzalol]

The only place you wouldn't use it, is on ghouls in phase 1 - they *will* get knocked back, and your tanks will be furious.

/cast [Target=Shambling Horror] Typhoon
Blows him on the other side of the tank, shambling horror turns around and shockwaves the raid :3

I think moonkins are doing quite well on LK25, tho the throne room kinda sucks(wtb tauren :<)
Typhoon is awesome against the vile spirits and after the starfall change moonkins are gonna be just awesome on p3.

lolwut 5:20... time for sleep i guess.

[Sunfyre]

how about getting glyph of focus just for that fight(achievement). stand just under LK and pop starfall. 20% more dmg on spirits(10% more after patch) wroth it?

our setup is :
Spriest
Arc Mage
Moonkin
Fury warr
Enh shammy.

so priest channels mind seer all the time, i pop starfall, typhoon and then continiue single target dmg on them, arc mage single target them down also. there are always like 2-3 landing and blowing up. For the ach maybe arc mage should go fire and put living bombs on all spirits? (going for the mount slowly)

Save Typhoon until they start to dive bomb. And the glyph really isn't worth it once it's nerfed.

[Sunfyre]

Yes and yes. Glyphed starfire can be used on every other Vile Spirit phase, and VERY effective. Likewise an Unglyphed Typhoon is usually very nice for LK, unless you are really great at handling the spirits. You would want to use Typhoon after the spirits have become active, preferably when the first one reach the ground. You will hit all of them, knock them back and slow them with the daze. I do this for every Vile Spirit phase, unless our shadowpriests have been too generous with their AOE :P

Typhoon is also useful for Valkyrs, although they are probably a bit trivial on 10 man. Typhoon will daze the Valkyr but *not* knock it back, so its a good thing to use as a slow.

I would say that Typhoon is probably mandatory as a moonkin on LK. If you get sucked into Frostmourne, you will be hard pressed if you can't stop the add from healing. And even so, Typhoon has so many uses. The only place you wouldn't use it, is on ghouls in phase 1 - they *will* get knocked back, and your tanks will be furious.

Really, moonkins are absolutely fine for LK - even moreso in 3.3.3!

I've never had an issue in Frostmourne, I just make sure to bash or warstomp the mind flay as that's what really rapes Terenas. Resto druids have a bigger problem (especially night elves) since they are not hitcapped in bear form.