Run ICC 10 Heroic without a shaman?

[adilina]

Has anyone tried this? It seems very difficult for certain fights. But my guild is running very low on good shamans. I have a list of really good dps waiting to join my 10 man team, unfortunately I had to reserve one spot for a shaman. Any suggestions? Bring the shaman or the player?

We have:
1 pally tank who can heal
1 druid tank who can dps
1 holy pally
1 resto druid who can dps
1 holy priest
1 rogue
1 mage
1 warlock
1 enchance shaman
1 DK(unholy/frost) or 1 warrior or 1 ret pally

[Mrisacc]

All depends on your dps really. If your have great dps that can make then enrage timers without heroism / bloodlust then you shouldn't need the shaman, but if you're having trouble making the timer and only missing it by a few seconds maybe the shaman is needed. Personally we always bring an ele shaman to buff the casters :>

[Shadowtrans]

My group never had a shaman because of the same reason you posted. That was a while back but we didn't need one for Firefighetr/1 Light pre-nerf. I don't think ICC HM's are that hard but I've yet to see them. And get the DK and the warrior.

[ComputerNerd]

Bloodlust/Heroism are too often seen as mandatory buffs because the group is often lacking elsewhere.
Rarely should there be a fight where they are truly needed, but most players demand them because they are too shortsighted, or just too stupid to realise that.

[Wingwraith]

We also have issues with having a Shaman available in our 10man group.
No Hero/Bloodlust is annoying on some fights, but we manage when our Shaman is awol.

7/12 10 man hardmodes

Although, I doubt we would have gotten Dreamwalker w/o it...

[Jamara]

I see no class as "required" shammy got a great ability, but so does so many other classes, palas buffs, druid moonkins 13% spellpower + 5% crit, hunter 10% more ap, and those are permanent. What i mean is that every buff is useful, but hero/bloodlust isen't permanent so it shouldn't be a requirement, but i believe we will see a lot more shammies on ally side atleast when we can be dwarf shammy. My experience is that a lot of people don't like draenei

[Trims]

This is why blizz should have never taken out drums from LW'ers

[adilina]

Thanks guys. We haven't tried without a shaman therefore I was asking. On the Saurfang fight, I told the resto druid to go balance in offset gear. All dps except the druid (including the enhance shaman) pulled 8500+ dps, with the rogue did 10K+, and a couple of 9K's. of course with the shaman's buff. I am wondering how much dps drop we will get by getting a DK or warrior.

You may say 8.5K for a shaman is good, but he does nothing but chop chop. Enhance shamans are not good at movement fights. You know what I mean.

[Wavern13]

While having a Shammy is icing on the cake they aren't MUST haves with todays content =(

[Miauly]

You will lose not only heroism, but 20% melee haste + 10% ap (unless you will get frost dk, and i doubt he could overdps this shammy). I doubt your rogue will go great without them tbh. Your group lacks alot of buffs, so shammy is doing good dps for this setup imo.

[Iosif]

We also have issues with having a Shaman available in our 10man group.
No Hero/Bloodlust is annoying on some fights, but we manage when our Shaman is awol.

7/12 10 man hardmodes

Although, I doubt we would have gotten Dreamwalker w/o it...

7/12 10-HM

LM,LD,GS,VD,BP,BQL,RF,FG

All with out Hero, Although Gunship was REALLY hard w/o hero...

The other will come once we get a little more time on them.

[herpecin]

lust/hero doesnt make as big of a differance as alot of people seem to believe it does.

if your in icc10HM its safe to say as a caster DPS you are close to the haste cap and only need 10-15% of the haste that lust/hero gives.

and as a melee the haste only affects your white swings. while some may get more out of this then others(rogues, warriors) for the most part its really just a buff to ~25-30% of your damage.

does lust help? yes. is bringing a shamman just for lust worth it if he only does 4k DPS? no.

[Malania]

Personally I think Shamans are the only class Blizzard likes. The whole "Bring the player, not the class" is obviously bullshit since no other class was given Heroism/Bloodlust when all the other buffs were forked out and shared around.

How about restoring Drums of haste Blizzard and just make it Heroism with a 15 minute debuff instead of 10. This would make people prefer a shaman like people prefer a Paladin for 10% kings instead of 8% drums.

[Wingwraith]

7/12 10-HM

LM,LD,GS,VD,BP,BQL,RF,FG

All with out Hero, Although Gunship was REALLY hard w/o hero...

The other will come once we get a little more time on them.

Gunship... tehehe. that made me giggle irl.

[Spartanoble]

Arthas defeated without Heroism :O

[Wingwraith]

Arthas defeated without Heroism :O

Now that's just not right.
One of, if not the only fight were you can use it twice, and you don't use it at all... lol

[conscript]

Has anyone tried this? It seems very difficult for certain fights. But getting a good shaman of any kind from my guild is impossible. I have a list of really good dps waiting to join my 10 man team, unfortunately I had to reserve one spot for a shaman. Any suggestions? Bring the shaman or the player?

We have:
1 pally tank who can heal
1 druid tank who can dps
1 holy pally
1 resto druid who can dps
1 holy priest
1 rogue
1 mage
1 warlock
1 enchance shaman (soft spot)
1 DK(unholy/frost) or 1 warrior or 1 ret pally

If the Shaman isn't one of those players you would consider worthy of being a dps in your 10 man maybe you should find one who actually puts out good damage. Enhance Shaman are great dps and bring 10% ap which I don't see being brought in your current make up or 20% melee haste which is only also brought by the Frost if he comes, and I doubt he is typically Frost.

Edit: Hell even if you brought an Elemental Shaman he would be a great addition as you are running all the caster buffs except theirs. Assuming the DK is Unholy you will have 13% spell damage, 5% crit, and ToW/DP depending on the Locks spec. I think your main problem is you need to find a good Shaman you are happy bringing rather than one you feel forced to take.

[Eyerai]

Personally I think Shamans are the only class Blizzard likes. The whole "Bring the player, not the class" is obviously bullshit since no other class was given Heroism/Bloodlust when all the other buffs were forked out and shared around.

How about restoring Drums of haste Blizzard and just make it Heroism with a 15 minute debuff instead of 10. This would make people prefer a shaman like people prefer a Paladin for 10% kings instead of 8% drums.

Not this shit again.

And lol Blizz only likes shamans. /pat

[Dogfight]

10 mans are never balanced the way that it makes a buff mandatory, it really is there the player and not the class makes the difference.

[conscript]

Not this shit again.

And lol Blizz only likes shamans. /pat

Anyone who says that has clearly never played a Shaman lol. One spec that has been abused through lack of itemized gear all expansion and one spec that has been abused through lack of weaponry for most of the expansion. Ya sounds real loved lol.