[OLD] Retribution Cataclysm Discussion

[Deleted]

Other classes with it folded in will cover for you.

You might be one of those that are used to WotLK sipmlicity. As far as i know, Cataclysm won't be such a kindergarden. Instances will require you to actually watch what's happening instead of pressing random AOE buttons and fuck all. I want to play the game to its full without waiting for people to do things for me.

IF i have to interrupt, i want to be able to interrupt. IF i have to spot heal, i want to be able to do so. That's why i chose paladin in the first place.

[Deleted]

Just seen the new Talent calculator/spec, and found no Divine purpose 1/2 (Reduces your chance to be hit by spells and ranged attacks by 2%/4% and gives your Hand of Freedom a 50%/100% chance to remove any stun effects on the target) Any news/rumours on this actually being taken out, seeing as it`s still beta.

[Deleted]

There is a mastery bonus NYI that is called divine purpose. Might that be the one? I feel it improbable, as it's mainly pvp used.

As it is now, in the talent spec, the stun removal from HoF has been removed. Anyone confirms?

[Deleted]

There is a mastery bonus NYI that is called divine purpose. Might that be the one? I feel it improbable, as it's mainly pvp used.

As it is now, in the talent spec, the stun removal from HoF has been removed. Anyone confirms?

I find it handy in PvE also :P

[Krekko]

You might be one of those that are used to WotLK sipmlicity. As far as i know, Cataclysm won't be such a kindergarden. Instances will require you to actually watch what's happening instead of pressing random AOE buttons and fuck all. I want to play the game to its full without waiting for people to do things for me.

IF i have to interrupt, i want to be able to interrupt. IF i have to spot heal, i want to be able to do so. That's why i chose paladin in the first place.

Haha, if I wanted simplicity I wouldn't have played Ret through Vanilla and TBC, long before ret was in it's current state but thats not the point. My point is, is that the interrupt is added utility, but not groundbreaking and that if you're unwilling into to spec into it then you hardly deserve it. Other classes have it, if you want to take it take it and great for you! If you're more preoccupied with speccing into other things, and don't want to give up something for it then there are other classes to cover it for you, it's all a matter of choice, and hardly a do or die situation. If you're in a 10 man group and they don't have any interrupters and you refuse to go for it then thats a different story however when it's more readily available elsewhere and you feel you'd be better off putting points elsewhere, then not too many tears will be shed. It's all about choices and wether or not you're willing to give something else up for it, thats the whole point.

And you yourself are willing to go ahead and put up that point for that utility, without complaining about the loss otherwise. I respect and very much like this. What gets me though are the people who aren't willing to do that and expect it to just be handed to them.

[Wyrus]

Is the spell "Templar’s Verdict" the new main ability we are getting? From the twitter chat I assumed so, but i still cant see it either in the talent tree or the spell list... Any news on this, or is it still being worked on?

[Highlight]

Is the spell "Templar’s Verdict" the new main ability we are getting? From the twitter chat I assumed so, but i still cant see it either in the talent tree or the spell list... Any news on this, or is it still being worked on?

It's in the talent tree. Has Conviction's icon.

[Anderone]

Just seen the new Talent calculator/spec, and found no Divine purpose 1/2 (Reduces your chance to be hit by spells and ranged attacks by 2%/4% and gives your Hand of Freedom a 50%/100% chance to remove any stun effects on the target) Any news/rumours on this actually being taken out, seeing as it`s still beta.

There are many talents not yet implemented. For example the Instant cast Blinding Shield talent in protection and the increased critical strike chance of Blinding Shield in Holy that they talked about. Perhaps it was scrapped or they're planning/polishing the builds up before implementing them in.

[Astray]

"It's my party and I cry if I want to, cryyy if I want to, cryyyyyy if I want to..you would cry too if it happened to yooouu!"
I'm sorry, but this song is stuck in my head, now.^^

A great song =D

No seriously, I think I agree with everything I didn't quote, but making the gap between average and extraordinary rets wider is probably the best thing that could happen to our beloved spec.

In a way, it is. Maybe i will play my pally as ret a bit more (i...got a special /love/ for interrupts)

The "bad day for ret" is not that ret are getting a bit more complicated. Its sad that raiders, who will most likely go for max dps are forced into a stupid "all dps, no utility" spec.

I like how other talent trees are "hey, you can have this or that utility" which cpould make players think about "hrm, whats the way i wanna be useful?" but ret is "hey, you can get utilitys and CC or you can have ZOMG AOE DAMAGE!" thats just wrong!

[Doylez]

A great song =D


In a way, it is. Maybe i will play my pally as ret a bit more (i...got a special /love/ for interrupts)

The "bad day for ret" is not that ret are getting a bit more complicated. Its sad that raiders, who will most likely go for max dps are forced into a stupid "all dps, no utility" spec.

I like how other talent trees are "hey, you can have this or that utility" which cpould make players think about "hrm, whats the way i wanna be useful?" but ret is "hey, you can get utilitys and CC or you can have ZOMG AOE DAMAGE!" thats just wrong!

Yeah they have said several times that they want players to choose between utility and utility (for example do you want Repentance or the interrupt) and not between utility or damage. But so far the ret tree is nothing like that, most of the talents are still boring damage talents.

[Grimbold]

Sup with the talents specificly for Exorcism? Its like they're saying that it will be a must in our rotation.

[Azshira]

Sup with the talents specificly for Exorcism? Its like they're saying that it will be a must in our rotation.

I agree lots of talents for it, but it WILL be a MUST in the rotation. It is the will of Blizz.

[Xypherftw]

It seems Blizzard is removing the cooldown on Crusader Strike.
Well, we'll see...

[The Good Captain]

I suppose the margin for error on Wrath of the Lightbringer could be somewhat bigger. It either:

• Reduces the CD on Hammer of Wrath by a second, as formerly proposed.
• Reduces the CD on Holy Wrath by around 10 seconds.
or
• Reduces the CD on Avenging Wrath by around a minute. Somewhat unlikely, but more unlikely just a second as it is now.

[Nöx]

I suppose the margin for error on Wrath of the Lightbringer could be somewhat bigger. It either:

• Reduces the CD on Hammer of Wrath by a second, as formerly proposed.
• Reduces the CD on Holy Wrath by around 10 seconds.
or
• Reduces the CD on Avenging Wrath by around a minute. Somewhat unlikely, but more unlikely just a second as it is now.

I agree with the last idea. Atm frost dk's Unbreakable armor as a 1 minute cooldown and is a powerful cooldown.

I'm loving what they are doing with rets, the tree makes you choose between Cc, raid benefit, damage output.

[The Good Captain]

I'm loving what they are doing with rets, the tree makes you choose between Cc, raid benefit, damage output.

Blizzard claimed the design goal was to leave us multiple talents for extra utilities after priority DPS talents. There are too many DPS bolstering modifiers. Some would be reasonable, such as choosing between the interrupt and perhaps repentance, but the way the tree is leaves us little to no room. GC's word mends that a bit, though. But will HotC be done away with, or made something else to choose?

So far, this is the best mesh 'twixt the two ideals, assuming HotC is abandoned entirely, and we've a decent movement speed enchant. Otherwise, I'd be more interested in PoJ.

[Azurewraith]

I imagine that CS will be closer to the top of our priority (if not the top), considering that it's our Holy Power builder.

However, as Inquisition is implemented right now, the way its duration scales with Holy Power is very problematic. If we pop Inquisition at 1 or 2 Holy Power to get the buff up ASAP, it doesn't last long enough for us to build up to 3 Holy Power to put up a maximum duration Holy Power. This is how kitties work right now: they throw up Savage Roar as soon as possible, even with very few combo points, and then just refresh it before it falls off. But keeping a 100% uptime with Inquisition won't be possible unless you're using it at 3 Holy Power, and even if you do that, you will literally never get a chance to use Templar's Verdict - any time you do, Inquisition will fall off. Essentially, as implemented at the moment, Inquisition and Templar's Verdict are mutually exclusive.

This suggests to me one of two possibilities. First, it's possible that Retribution is not going to be expected to keep 100% Inquisition uptime, and Inquisition is more intended for Prot paladins; i.e., Ret will gain more dps from using Templar's Verdict than from using Inquisition (with the possible exception of while HoW is available; having that extra holy damage attack may push Inquisition above TV in dps). Second, they may simply extend Inquisition's duration per Holy Power (probably to about 15 seconds per).

Edit: when I wrote this post I hadn't seen the change to CS's cooldown. That gets rid of the Inquisition duration problem, but it makes our rotation really, really weird. I... don't really see that lasting, honestly.

Imp judmenty is now imp CS (makes it a 1second CD aka a global) so it will take 3cs to get max holy power which will take a minimum (even if we just spam CS to get inqustion up) 4.5 seconds the buff is then up for 30seconds i belive at max duration, should hoepfully allow for soem TVs if not we will only use this during zealotry and bash out huge numbers (its CD is being changed id put money on it i mean 30mins yes its an awsome abilty but 30mins is stupid we could use it what once in a heroic and maybe twice in a raid no ty).

[The Good Captain]

(its CD is being changed id put money on it i mean 30mins yes its an awsome abilty but 30mins is stupid we could use it what once in a heroic and maybe twice in a raid no ty).

Aye, we've proceeded under the assumption it's a typo.

In any case, I've just realized this thread has run its course.

[Alcsaar]

I bet the devs make those "typos" on purpose just to watch us rage a bit.