Blizzard backs down for DK's, shaft for the Shaman as usual.

[mistersister]

Just wait;
Hunters will now have Dual-wield-ranged talents, Paladins will Dual-wield shields and hammers and Mages will dual-wield sheep. ;D

Give mages Titan's Grip for staves!
Please!?

On topic: It's shamans turn for the shaft? Everyone gets to have their pleas ignored at some point, while watching others get their wishes granted.

[Novarian]

Give mages Titan's Grip for staves!
Please!?

On topic: It's shamans turn for the shaft? Everyone gets to have their pleas ignored at some point, while watching others get their wishes granted.

Our pleas have been ignored for 5 years ever since we didn't get a full class review during vanilla...the only class to not get a full one

[Rugz]

DK:
Tank
2H DPS
DW DPS

Shaman:
Heal
Caster DPS
DW DPS


Why exactly do you want 2H DPS except to just bump your post count?

Nothing is stopping you playing 2H enhancement, oh and please Blizzard make frost the spec of choice for raiding mages like it was back in Molten Core, I don't like fire or arcane as much.

[Axial]

You also have to realize with the Def stat being taken away, that leaves tanking weapons with STR, STAM and maybe hit/expertise and what not!

A DW dk or 1h fury warrior will be able to use tanking weapons successfully!

Although that does worry me about tanks getting weapons. :P

[uka]

a lot of enhance shamans were and are still crying for 2h. it was a different feeling swinging a big fat axe and there are a lot 2h using shaman npcs lorewise.
i dont see why they cant add 2h support into talents. it would be nearly enough to normalize maelstrom procc with weapon speed, change the dual weild specialization to "improve hit with all weapons" and let stormstrike/lavalash work with 2h (again, normalized).

[Augrelle]

DK:
Tank
2H DPS
DW DPS

Shaman:
Heal
Caster DPS
DW DPS


Why exactly do you want 2H DPS except to just bump your post count?

Nothing is stopping you playing 2H enhancement, oh and please Blizzard make frost the spec of choice for raiding mages like it was back in Molten Core, I don't like fire or arcane as much.

Stop complaining about frost mages since they are trying to up frost raid DPS. Perma Water elemental helped and I am guessing they are doing more with Cata. However for pure DPS classes, there will always be a "best tree" for PvE or PvP.

Our pleas have been ignored for 5 years ever since we didn't get a full class review during vanilla...the only class to not get a full one

I wouldn't say completly ignored, just around 80-90% ignored.

[Hexxidecimal]

If you never played in Vanilla do not act or talk like you did. Shamans used to an off tank class that could tank 5 min dungeons and even UBRS. They had talents that helped support their tanking ability like increased dodge, shield spec, increased armor and parry. They were actually better tanks than paladins at the time since they could actually generate more threat than a pally and keep mobs on them(mind you this was back when health pools were relatively close and there wasn't as much of an armor gap). Earth Shock generated high threat which was then given to frost when enhance became more of a nature oriented class and rockbiter used to increase threat done.

Oh I did, and even did the tanking you are talking about it. Doesn't matter what the devs "intended", fact is unless you vastly out geared UBRS you weren't actually tanking it. Sure you could hold threat but you couldn't survive, even with the talents. Devs may have intended it, it was just never effective. Paladins were pretty shitty back then too as were feral druids.

What I am simply saying is this, shamans sucked at tanking, they were never a tanking class, regardless of what Blizz intended for them. There survival abilities back then only served the purpose of not dying immediately when pulling agro with triple WF crits.

But on topic, while I would love to get support for two handed melee dps, I can deal with it not being there. I think most warriors will continue to go with the titans grip assuming all things are equal dps wise. Meaning that One handed weapons wills till be pretty available unless there is a sudden influx of rogues. May not be WoW wide but on the few servers I play on Rogues almost don't exist and my shammy has enjoyed getting all the one handers with almost no competition.

[Leetbeartank]

I did a random heroic the other day... our tank dropped, and I just told the Enhance Shaman to Frost Shock lots. He tanked the whole instance. SEE SHAMAN CAN STILL TANK! Oh wait... They never could really to tanks. You, good sir, are an idiot OP.

[Milanor]

DK:
Tank
2H DPS
DW DPS

Shaman:
Heal
Caster DPS
DW DPS

Following this logic -

Warrior:
Tank
2H DPS
DW DPS
2H DW DPS.

Er...what?

[grenalden]

Thrall to this day still rocks the 2H.

SS or it didn't happen.

[Evoelle]

This is what is inside the developers minds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YzZ86GYoxE0

Balance does not exist !

Enjoy.

[tofu_soldier]

Oh I did, and even did the tanking you are talking about it. Doesn't matter what the devs "intended", fact is unless you vastly out geared UBRS you weren't actually tanking it. Sure you could hold threat but you couldn't survive, even with the talents. Devs may have intended it, it was just never effective. Paladins were pretty shitty back then too as were feral druids.

It just proves that if they want, they can fix it.
As for survivability -- I don't see why it's so hard to make Shaman gain % armor bonus, like Bear form and Frost presence.

[Rugz]

Stop complaining about frost mages since they are trying to up frost raid DPS. Perma Water elemental helped and I am guessing they are doing more with Cata. However for pure DPS classes, there will always be a "best tree" for PvE or PvP.

Well I guess you missed the point but whatever we'll roll with it. Guess what there will be a "best spec" for hybrid trees, and dual wield is it for enhancement. I'm sorry that Blizzard doesn't wanty to make your nostalgic, super-special-snowflake spec the viable DPS spec but tough luck go reroll a 2H class.

Following this logic -

Warrior:
Tank
2H DPS
DW DPS
2H DW DPS.

Er...what?

Except the OP title'd the thread comparing DKs and shamans, why are warriors relevant?


Shaman have 3 PvEviable tree/specs, lets call them "Delicious Cake", "Scrumptious Pie" and "Bacon Sandwich". The OP has turned to Blizzard and asked for a 2 week old bagel.

[Slayve]

i dont know if it was mentioned yet. But if they let shamans use 2hander in spec, they would have to re itemize thier style now

all 2h axes have str on them now a days,

the only 2hander thats not sword that has agility on them is polearm, which shamans cannot use. and staffs are too fast

[Iceforge]

Shaman have 3 PvEviable tree/specs, lets call them "Delicious Cake", "Scrumptious Pie" and "Bacon Sandwich". The OP has turned to Blizzard and asked for a 2 week old bagel.

<3 Bacon Sammiches.

[MagZero]

i dont know if it was mentioned yet. But if they let shamans use 2hander in spec, they would have to re itemize thier style now

all 2h axes have str on them now a days,

the only 2hander thats not sword that has agility on them is polearm, which shamans cannot use. and staffs are too fast

staves, bit fast but meh.

[Melonberry]

There are almost no agi 2h they can use. 1 axe?

[jontaxe]

If you never played in Vanilla do not act or talk like you did.

I could say the same for you. Shamans could maybe tank Dire Maul, if the rest of your group was flawless. Trying it UBRS/Scholo pre MC/BWL (ie before you completely outgeared it to pointlessness) would get you flattened by the first trash pack.

So someone explain to me why the hard on for 2h enhance? First, it would require almost a total redesign of enhance. Not just the cata talent redesign, but the whole damn thing. And for what? Do you really want 9% hit to go wasted while you cap spell hit? Do you honestly believe that they are ever going to bring back 2h WF 1 shot kills? Ever? I mean, don't get me wrong, it was great... but the devs are 5 years smarter now, and it isn't happening.

I mean... I don't get it. Why in the world do you keep insisting? You aren't getting triple crit double proccing 1 shotting WF back. So what other reason is there?

[Snikdagit]

I am just dreading 1H STR weapons should teh warrior change go thru.

I doubt they will make Str only 1 handers again, even thought there would be 2 classes that benifit from it, it seems like they have been trying to cut down on class specific loot (with the exception of spellpower plate), and there would still be 3 classes that used agi 1 handers over str 1 handers, i just don't see them adding str 1 handers for fury when they won't do it for dk's

[tofu_soldier]

I mean... I don't get it. Why in the world do you keep insisting? You aren't getting triple crit double proccing 1 shotting WF back. So what other reason is there?

Different play style to suit different taste ? Same reason why Blood DPS, Frost and Unholy Tank players are pissed off ?