Arcane Build

[SpoD]

Hi, i have a question about the arcane build.
Most mages use this talent build 57/3/11

But can't understand why u use talent points in Magic Attumenent.Never use Dampen Magic in pve
It ll be more useful if u use these talents in Student of the Mind for extra spirit,that means extra critical chance with Molten Armor(and extra mana renegr).
Also more useful if you don't spend talents in Magic Absorption and use the one talent point in Incanter's Absorption.That because when you are in pve some mobs cast fire,frost spells like onyxia,lady deathwishper,voa boss.That means if you have there 1 point and use Fire/Frost Ward you absorb damage and gain extra sp.I think it is more useful...

/discuss

[Grondath]

"Increases the range of your Arcane spells by 6 yards"

This is why you take points in that talent. Really useful in so many encounters to minimise movement/create more space.

I didn't think Magic Absorbtion was a common talent choice tbh...that would be better spent in Incanter's Absorption as you say.

[ProTech]

Magic Attumenent: Increases the range of your Arcane spells by 6 yards and the effect of your Amplify Magic and Dampen Magic spells by 50%.


Student of the Mind is only adds little dps/mana regen. It's generally considered as not worth it. Check Elitistjerks for the math.

Incanter's Absorption was nerfed to the ground in 3.3.3, so it's now not worth to take it. The points are much better spent in Magic Absorption instead. The Frost Warding talent proc doesn't trigger Incanter's Absorption anymore (no 17k absorbs converted to Spell Power, only the base 4k counts). The GCD used to put up Frost Ward is a dps loss, and I'm not sure that the Spell Power boost compensates for it. Plus it really situational as it only works on Fire/Frost damage. Again check Elitistjerks on the math.

[Twoflower]

I didn't think Magic Absorbtion was a common talent choice tbh...that would be better spent in Incanter's Absorption as you say.

It is commonly used, as i learned yesterday from Swizzle It is used to minimise incoming magic damage ( around 10% ) . Your healers will love you for it.



Actualy, i asked the exactly same questions yesterday in the sticky FAQ. You may wanna read it.

[ripponesan]

It´s about range.

Like you probably noticed, and arcane mage doesnt do DMG when moving. Well yeah we have ABarr and Flameshock, but compared to the DMG we do when NOT moving you can neglect this.

So 6 yards range is VERY VERY powerful. Cause it enables you a lot of times NOT to move and rather stand still and cast, or you dont need to move that far and so cast earlier again and make more DMG.
Studen of the mind, is really not worth it. Especially since you dont have spirit on End game gear. So spending points into something that increases the spirit you hardly have, by 10% is not a good idea.

[SpoD]

Yeah range is good but...Extra spell power is super for mages.Also healers focus on other targets as you don't need so much heale.they ll love you as our friend said. I think is very useful to use these tallents.Also 10% spirit is very good.Why mages choose items with + spirit?For Critical chance.When you need a stat increase it.Do not balance with other stats.

[ProTech]

Spell Power, Hit (if under hitcap), Haste, Crit are all better stats than Spirit. So mage should only take items with spirit if you don't find anything with better stats on it. So you don't have a lot of spirit to begin with, and the 10% boost is a minimal. I have 400 spirit, 10% is 40, that converted to 20 crit rating, that not worth three talent points.

Magic Absorption is a constant 10% damage reduction on all magic damage, which is on all the time. So no dps lost casting Frost Ward all the time.

[WesM63]

/waits for Swizzle to unleash the fury.

Really... It's all in the PvE FAQ. Also, Spirit sucks, and the reason we take items with it, is because there is simply no better options. If the item doesn't have spirit, it has critical strike rating, which is far better.

Frost Ward DOES proc IA, as it is an absorb and specifically stated in the patch notes. It doesn't work from Priests Bubbles and Environmental Encounters (Twins), hence the reason it's pointless now.

[ProTech]

Frost Ward DOES proc IA, as it is an absorb and specifically stated in the patch notes. It doesn't work from Priests Bubbles and Environmental Encounters (Twins), hence the reason it's pointless now.

Frost Warding: Increases the armor and resistances given by your Frost Armor and Ice Armor spells by 50%. In addition, gives your Frost Ward and Fire Ward a 30% chance to negate the warded damage spell and restore mana equal to the damage caused.

I said that Frost Warding the frost talent does not work with IA, not the original Frost Ward spell. I did not checked myself in live, but people said it was not working in the ptr. Frost Warding is nice because I was able to absorb 17k damage on Sindagrosa, when I failed to move behind the Ice Block. Which filled up my mana pool instantly. But that 17k damage absorption is not working with IA, because it's negated by the Frost Warding talent and not the Frost Ward spell. Otherwise it would be overpowered because there is no Spell Power limit on IA now, so 17k absorb would mean 2.5k spell power boost.

[Mammel]

10% spirit is nothing at ICC. You don't have 2p t9 anymore (At last you shouldn't have) and BiS gear from icc has almost no spirit in it thus reducing value of spirit even futher. With all buffs i have 640 spirit (Still have cloak from 25Saurfang, wand from 10BQL and bracers from 10LDW) so SotM would give me 59 extra spirit (Doesn't scale with BoK). That is 32.45 extra crit rating and some negligible amount of regen. As you need 45.91 rating for 1% of crit, it would give me 0.7% crit which would increase my dps by ~60 in rawr (Fire gear and gems and didn't bother to change them so it might be bit more or less for you). In 5min fight, it's 24000 extra dmg which is pretty close to 1 extra spell.
You're very likely going to miss few spells just due to range during those 5mins, and so making SotM worse than Magic Attunement.

Not to even mention fights like Saurfang/BQL where you need to either spread out or be as far from boss as possible and Putricide/LDW/Marrowgar where either boss or adds might run out of range, thus reducing your dps.
Taking SotM at cost of range is never worth it.

Magic Absorption isn't really needed if you just raid normal mode,s but it really helps reducing constant raid dmg you take at Sindra/Putricide P3/Festergut/BQL and obviously can save your life at many other occasions aswell.

[Swizzle]

SotM has been, and will continue to be, a marginal DPS increase to a TtW/fire build. you are increasing your spirit by 1.1. let's just go out on a limb and say you have 400 spirit from gear, well now you have 440. previously you would have gotten 220 crit from your spirit, but now you get 242. so your 3 talent points increased your crit rating by 22, which is less than a percentage point. for arcane, this is a miniscule DPS increase (roughly in the low teens), but when you couple it with the point investment, it becomes a far shittier talent.



DON'T TAKE STUDENT OF THE MIND.

[WesM63]

~snip~

D'oh, Guess i should of read the rest of your post. I just saw "Frost Warding doesn't proc IA" and was like.. wait what?

[SpoD]

i have the frost warding tallent and glyff for fw.The SP that have after absorb is like 250~300 more.