ICC tanking seam less exciting than other raids ?

[mightyquinn]

I have been tanking since tBC (Kara, ZA, and Gruuls) and all of this expansion. With the release of ICC I have found most of the bosses to be less exciting than those of previous raids. I feel that alot the bosses this content are pretty much stand still and take a beating, with the exception of PP and LK. and add CCs on LD and Dreamwalker. I am kind of disappointment in the dullness of the tanking IIC offers. IF you look at Uld, tanks needed alot more raid awareness and had to actually move.

Razerscale - had to kite in phase 2 and had a taunt rotation.
Ignis - postion him for scorches
Council - interrupts, positioning, AoE Blasts to be run out of, CD's used for specific ability
Cat Lady - initial pull, postiioning, interrupts, fear to be broken
Hodir - watch out for falling ice, kiting, CDs saved for specific ability (frozen blows), moving onto ice
Thorim - (very unique fight imo) for the actual boss fight not much to do, but hallway/arena made it different
Freya - boring for MT til phase 2 but add spawns made the OT work
Mimiron - just awesome overall, bombs, fire, more fire, more bombs = dont pay attention and die
General - interrupt or good chance of wipeing, optional kiting (depending on strat)
yogg - tons of movement and raid awarness needed

As shown, Uld tanking was much more fun and required more than standing still. Now, some could say I should just reroll DPS, (which i do dps sometimes when only 2 tanks are needed) but I enjoy the role tanks play. And for the trolls, this is not a ICC is easy raid, I just wanted to see if any other tanks are feeling the same and that the awareness and such of tanking has lots its touch in ICC.

Lastly, what i hope to see in future raids would to be more of a diverse encounters. The tank and spank DPS check is always going to be there but I hope to see some more fights similar to Hodir, where tanks need to be moving, using CDs, holding threat. Also woulnt mind seeing bosses with more than one or 2 phases. Ive always been a fan of multiple phase fights, just makes the fight feel more epic and keeps players on their toes, ie. Mimiron.

So if you disagree or agree, post your reasons why or why not you feel ICC wasnt as fun/exciting for tanking.

[zeo]

[...]
Razerscale - had to kite in phase 2 and had a taunt rotation. Stay the whole fight in the same zone tanking same adds and then just stepping backwards in P2 with a no-complex-at-all taunting rotation.

Ignis - postion him for scorches Move between 3 spots over and over OR use zerg tactic and stand still near a pool (overgearing the content for the latter).
Council - interrupts, positioning, AoE Blasts to be run out of, CD's used for specific ability Stand still with the boss assigned to you and move in case of Rune of Power to let the raid benefit from it.
Cat Lady - initial pull, postiioning, interrupts, fear to be broken Let a warrior MT her with Zerker Rage for fear, stand still in a spot and move if Feral Defender dies where you're tanking.
Hodir - watch out for falling ice, kiting, CDs saved for specific ability (frozen blows), moving onto ice Just move few yards/jump not to let the debuff stack up, stay near a beam for melee's haste buff and 5 secs to move away from ice.
Thorim - (very unique fight imo) for the actual boss fight not much to do, but hallway/arena made it different In arena: Stand still, wait for adds, gather small ones, keep Champions out. In hallway: Move left and right, 2 mini bosses are tank 'n spank apart from 2 little abilities. Boss is over boring from tanking pov.
Freya - boring for MT til phase 2 but add spawns made the OT work I agree here.
Mimiron - just awesome overall, bombs, fire, more fire, more bombs = dont pay attention and die P1: CD's rotation on Blast, don't die to Shock Blast and don't be such a retard running through 3-4 mines. P2 and P3 were easy from a tanking PoV. P4: Check P1 + don't face him on Laser Barrage.
General - interrupt or good chance of wipeing, optional kiting (depending on strat) Build high tps and chain CD's on Surge of Darkness OR run away for like 10 seconds.
yogg - tons More than usual movement and raid awarness needed

[...]

I made my mind about normal modes since HM's aren't mentioned anywhere.

To be honest you talked about fights from a Raid PoV instead of single tanking PoV (ie Mimiron and Yogg) but if you stop tunnel visioning you'll get that Ulduar wasn't that great compared to ICC about tanking movement.

[darkwingdot]

I made my mind about normal modes since HM's aren't mentioned anywhere.

To be honest you talked about fights from a Raid PoV instead of single tanking PoV (ie Mimiron and Yogg) but if you stop tunnel visioning you'll get that Ulduar wasn't that great compared to ICC about tanking movement.

Not sure why you Crossed out:
1) the kiting for Razorscale & Ignis
2) Interupts for Cat Lady, General
3) Thorim's Gauntlet ( you did need a tank in there buddy)
4) Mimiron ( even tanks needed to move and have raid awareness. HM took a lot of raid awareness)

All the above stuff were things done by the tanks in those zones. Personally I can not think of many ICC fights that require that stuff.

Marrowgar = Stand there
Lady Death = Stand There (you can let the adds rush the stage to you, standing next to her), interrupt if needed.
Deathbringer = Stand There
Festergut = Stand There
Rotface = Minimal Kiting, then just stand there
Proff Putrid = Kiting
Blood Council = Stand there
BQL = Stand there, or AFK if you are the OT
Dream = Stand there between the gates
Sindragosa = Minimal movement between phases and tank switches
LK = Bunch of movement and taunts.

Really, the whole of Ulduar required a lot more from thanks in terms of movement and interupts.

[mightyquinn]

In ICC you have

marrowgar - side step when blue stuff comes your way
lootship - kill adds where they spawn or jump and tank a single guy for 10 secs
Deathbringer - taunt back and forwarth
fester- nothing but standing still
rotface - MT - stand still til oozes hit the middle
BQ - majority of the time standing still

At least in Uld you had to have awareness half the bosses in ICC you can stand still and not have to pay attention to much going on around you, is what i was trying to get at.

[Yoshimiko]

I made my mind about normal modes since HM's aren't mentioned anywhere.

To be honest you talked about fights from a Raid PoV instead of single tanking PoV (ie Mimiron and Yogg) but if you stop tunnel visioning you'll get that Ulduar wasn't that great compared to ICC about tanking movement.

Tanks perspective:

Marrowgar- Stay outa blue fire, LRL.
Lady D- kill a few trash pulls, then tank and spank.
Gunship- 1 tank never moves...just holds agro in trash, other tank actually gets to move on this fight! jumps and holds a guy for a few seconds.
Saurfang- Tank & spank.
Rotface-one tank gets to do something! Kites something around the corner, the other one stands their all fight, doing nothing special.
Festergut-Tank and spank.
Putricide-Tank and spank for 1 tank, other one gets to do something! Runs around eating goo and spitting it at mobs.

These are the fights I've tanked, and I find them stupidly boring. Most of the fights are tank and spank from a tanks perspective. There is pretty much nothing to do- You just sit their staring off into space for 15-18 seconds, then hit your taunt button, and you're pretty much free to afk for the next 30-40 seconds until you need to taunt again. Marrowgar you actually have to get out of blue stuff, but that's about it.

One tank gets something fun to do, and the other is stuck with something terribly boring.

[zeo]

Not sure why you Crossed out:
1) the kiting for Razorscale & Ignis
2) Interupts for Cat Lady, General
3) Thorim's Gauntlet ( you did need a tank in there buddy)
4) Mimiron ( even tanks needed to move and have raid awareness. HM took a lot of raid awareness)

I crossed them out and put my answer near the them if you can read carefully.

And yes ICC might be a bit boring from a tanking PoV but there must be a lot of raid awareness from whole raid's pov.
A nice example:

LDW HC: Here 2 tanks have to handle 6+1 adds, plus a 3rd tank who has to taunt and kite the Deformed (not big deal). In P2 2 tanks on the boss (Major deal is about TPS but 2 MD's and you're done, big problem is DPSers' aggro) and a 3rd tank handing the adds. All this with ghosts running around and if you're unlucky, having 1-2 of them each wave on the tanking spots can really make you move whole time (expecially adds' tank). Plus CC's and FBs/aoe FBs.

But to me still both istances have their "ohi here you can't slack" bosses and "you can go brb 10 secs if you want to" ones.

[Triston]

Hey now, just because nearly every fight in ICC is stand here, keep threat, maybe move once doesn't mean it's boring...

Ok, it kinda is.

[TheWho?]

Bring back tanking needs such as Al'ar where we actually have to run around, race the clock kinda things.

[mightyquinn]

Bring back tanking needs such as Al'ar where we actually have to run around, race the clock kinda things.

Now i didnt do this fight at lvl 70 but still got to experience it while at lvl 80 and thought it was a great mechanic. I would love to see some more boss fights where using the environment more is implemented (like Al'ar and using the ramps and ledges)

[omidmash]

Try out heroics and try to give some utillity to raid.

[SilkforCalde]

Only going to discuss hard modes:

Marrowgar - tanks spend time moving during bone storm phase to minimize bone storm damage on the raid, otherwise move out of fires. Fun to tank.

Deathwhisper - tanks spend time picking up adds and then kiting Deathwhisper to the stairs during phase 2 while picking up adds. Also a considerable threat mechanic that is very fun. Awesome fight to tank.

Gunship - non-jumping tank picks up adds and avoids rockets, jumping tank simply pulls the boss and stands still. Non-jumping tank has the more fun job. Boring fight for all roles.

Saurfang - tanks have taunt rotation, also have to deal with cooldowns during soft enrage as well as helping keep the adds under control with well timed taunts and stuns. Very engaging for a tank.

Festergut - simple tank swap, boring fight to tank.

Rotface - boss tank is relatively boring, only move out of explosion, slime tank however is a very engaging and fun fight to tank.

PP - abom is fun, kiting the boss around the room is fun. Very fun fight to tank.

Blood princes - lots of tank movement for the caster tank, very fun role. Other tank tanking the two bosses will primarily stand in place except to avoid shit, still fun.

Deathwhisper - boring tank fight

Dreamwalker - fun to tank adds, lots of different things to do. Fun tank fight.

Sindragosa - lots and lots of tank movement and swaps. Very fun tank fight.

Arthas - quite possibly the most fun tank fight of all time.

I very, very, VERY strongly disagree with you. Only Gunship, Festergut, and Blood Queen are boring tank fights.

[Atty]

Deathbringer: you need to be able to taunt instantly, not 1 second after the debuff is applied on the other tank. In other words, you actually need to be able to press the taunt button before the debuff is cast.

Try solo tanking Vali10 heroic (i.e. 4 healers), an add gets a single swing off on a healer (the healers will pull healing aggro) and you got a dead healer.

Sindragosa: hf with the cooldown maps here.

LK: same as Sindra except you need to be really good at moving and you get to pick up adds that dps switch to instantly.

[sicness]

I very, very, VERY strongly disagree with you. Only Gunship, Festergut, and Blood Queen are boring tank fights.

/agreed, especially on heroic modes, but even on Festergut you have to pay attention with stacks which makes it kind of fun to dps.

[xeroxide]

part of me agree's with you about ulduar, although i hated freya and catlady, razerscale was a bore too.

mimiron is probably my most favorite tank fight of all time.

now... with icc, LK is epic. sindragosa is epic. others are ok... i love blood princes being the tank on orb duty.

gunship is a bit of fun, especially with the jump tank as a druid...

dreamwalker is probably more fun for healers, however it's quite enjoyable tanking as well.

in my mind it's like this

uld > icc > togc

[Sparkyl]

Lady Deathwhisper - had to kite in phase 2 and had a taunt rotation.
Marrowgar - postion him for scorches
Valithira - interrupts, positioning, AoE Blasts to be run out of, CD's used for specific ability
Blood Council - initial pull, postiioning, interrupts, fear to be broken
Sindragosa - watch out for falling ice, kiting, CDs saved for specific ability (frozen blows), moving onto ice
Gunship - (very unique fight imo) for the actual boss fight not much to do, but hallway/arena made it different
Rotface - boring for MT til phase 2 but add spawns made the OT work
Putricide - just awesome overall, bombs, fire, more fire, more bombs = dont pay attention and die
Deathbringer - interrupt or good chance of wipeing, optional kiting (depending on strat)
Lich King - tons of movement and raid awarness needed

Admittedly some of these dont line up exactly but id deffinately not say its less exciting in terms of actual mechanics. Imo its less exciting because its all been done before, they have had 5+ years of raiding to fill in so things are bound to cycle around. Also I guess you could spin it back around to difficuilty, as everyone has said how much easier ICC HM is than Ulduar, however you want to compare them is up to you.

[Ormula]

I agree. I dunno what the OP means about Putricide, even if you're the boss tank there is a lot of repositioning between slimes, oozes and choking gas bombs.

[Deleted]

I disagree. On most fights there are many things you can do to fulfill your role better.

I can only talk from a Warrior's PoV, but if you give it some thought I'm sure you can do a lot more and a lot better things than "just standing still".

[mightyquinn]

I disagree. On most fights there are many things you can do to fulfill your role better.

I can only talk from a Warrior's PoV, but if you give it some thought I'm sure you can do a lot more and a lot better things than "just standing still".

on a tank spank fight, stack sunders thunderclap and Demo shout all while spamming HS.

[Deleted]

on a tank spank fight, stack sunders thunderclap and Demo shout all while spamming HS.

y halo thar, tunnelvisioning.

If you really can't find anything else to do on a "tank and spank"-fight, well, then I guess that's as far you can get. :-)

[mightyquinn]

then what are these plenty of better things you can be doing than just standing still? please enlighten me

my point of this was that i feel the ICC bosses dont require as much tank movement or raid awareness as previous raids have.

I used Uld as an example b/c most of the bosses in there required moving, interrupts, being alert, etc.