Arcafrost Build. Comments?

[rodolfopv]

Hello everybody! I'm new to the forum my name's Rodolfo and I'm from Italy.

I just wanted to present you a mage build I created last night and I'm currently testing . It's actually thought to work at its best with level 85 cap but I'll practice till Cata is out.

I wanted to keep ALL the good things of a frost mage (shatter, chills, snares, ice barrier, cold snap, icy veins and fingers of frost) while using arcane spells as nuke.

I'm testing it in BGs and it's very fun to use. I have all the survavibility of a frost + the plus damage of arcane.

I usually open with FB to proc FOF or to freeze then I POM+ICY VEINS+ABX2+AM in order to take advantage of the shatter dmg. I also use other rotations including IL but that's the main concept.

It's quite cool. Let me know what you think!


the link eu.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Crushridge&cn=Kaphael&group=1

[skarsgård]

is this some kind of pvp or pve build? arena or bg? don't really see the point of doing any talent trees for 85 when we don't even have the the new and changed talents yet. But hey! as long you are having fun that's all good m8.

[Swizzle]

i'm so confused as to the point of that tree. since you're testing in BGs, i'm guessing it's a pvp build. you don't get deep freeze or the deeper frost talents to make frost worth it, and you don't pick up the worthwhile arcane talents either. the build is weak to say the least.

[Deleted]

is this some kind of pvp or pve build? arena or bg? don't really see the point of doing any talent trees for 85 when we don't even have the the new and changed talents yet. But hey! as long you are having fun that's all good m8.

I'm testing it in BGs and it's very fun to use.

(Messages must be at least 3 characters =[)

[rodolfopv]

i'm so confused as to the point of that tree. since you're testing in BGs, i'm guessing it's a pvp build. you don't get deep freeze or the deeper frost talents to make frost worth it, and you don't pick up the worthwhile arcane talents either. the build is weak to say the least.

Well it's simple for me. I'll try to explain.

Going deep in the frost is totally useless to me; deep freeze is substituted with the +DMG and CRIT bonuses of the Arcane tree. Water elemental was useful to load a shatter combo but now the whole point is to take advantage of FOF or freeze+arcane spells. I miss AB and MB but the point IS NOT to play as an arcane but as a FROST with a good arcane arsenal. It's really more devastating than a conservative classical frost pvp (that I was using).
Moreover arcane and frost talents have been created to be used together(a lot of arcane talents give bonuses to frost spells).

The point is: you have all the advantages of frost but with more firepower. You also have POM, Incanter's Absorption and a lot of bonuses that also go to frost spells.
I know everytime someone comes out with a new build it's difficult to "understand" because it's totally out of the box. But all those builds going around were, in the beginning, out of the box too . Experimenting is fun.


P.S.
The build you see is for lvl80

[Swizzle]

what spell are you using? a full 3 second frostbolt since you picked up none of the cast time reductions? if you're using arcane spells, you're not getting FoF procs off of anything other than ice armor.

you also pick up student of the mind...the hell for? you're not using molten armor in pvp so you're not getting more crit from it, and no pvp gear has spirit on it other than priest and druid gear...so i have no clue why you're picking up that talent.

also, no FM...i just don't know.

the spec is poor and disjointed and easily destroyed by either a deep frost build or a deep arcane build. hell, even a deep fire build would own it.

[Knowing]

/thread

[Tassir]

I think i can fix this build for PVP...

There, I've done it.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?mage...I,98UReO,11723

given it the speed reduction talents from frost. Picked up Arcane power over arcane empowerment (less DPS from arcane, but enough so that you can swap between both spell schools when interrupted). I've also picked up shattered barrier and cold as ice, which will work well in synergy with frost warding and IA.

This spec also has arcane shielding, magic absorption and magic attunement, meaning buffed mage armor, resists and arcane range (both arc and frost schools have 36 yard range).

The only drawback is the mana consumption will be modestly more then before, but mana shouldn't be an issue unless your fighting someone whos draining you.

[rodolfopv]

I revised it following the suggestions of Tassir. Now it has full FB casting time reductions and damage.

FOF procs very often thanks to Ice Armor and FB nukes. Striking with AB and AM after FOF is nice.

Arcane explosion, frost nova and improved COC are a nice synergy for close range.

But I removed some talents of the arcane trees for others I prefer (removed some points). Also I don't like Arcane power over empowerment since this build isn't done for short mega bursts, so everything is working even better now.
Will be perfect in cata since I'll go deeper in the arcane tree.

Link is edited in the first post

[Heilige]

I still don't see a point in even bothing with AB/AM without all the +AB/AM dmg talents.

Furthermore, if you're using AM in battlegrounds, I should laugh at you. Even in my full PVE haste a non-MBarr proc AM is like 3.5 seconds. You're probably well over 4 - healers can see the missiles coming and heal through it easily.

L2Stick2Frostbolts.

[Bloobyz]

Guys I think I have come up with the master spec!

First you put in 20 points in Arcane, then 0 in Fire, and 51 in Frost!

Wala! You are now viable in arena with very respectable damage, a bunch of control, and amazing survivability (lolbeastcleave).

[rodolfopv]

I still don't see a point in even bothing with AB/AM without all the +AB/AM dmg talents.

Furthermore, if you're using AM in battlegrounds, I should laugh at you. Even in my full PVE haste a non-MBarr proc AM is like 3.5 seconds. You're probably well over 4 - healers can see the missiles coming and heal through it easily.

L2Stick2Frostbolts.

The build doesn't have MB and Abarrage. Simply that.

Put it in this perspective: it's a frost with a bit of arcane firepower. I preferred that to Deep Freeze and Elemental shatter combo that was, imho, a more boring way of playing.

[Swizzle]

what arcane firepower? none of the talents you pick up do anything but buff ice lance.

[rodolfopv]

what arcane firepower? none of the talents you pick up do anything but buff ice lance.

It's not correct. I'll report a pair of talents.

- Arcane Focus - increase chance to hit
- Spell Impact - +DMG on AE, AB, IL and CoC
- TTW - we know
- Arcane Instability - +DMG and CRIT 3% to all spells
- Arcane Empowerment - +DMG on AM and AB

But what is nice is using shatter and FOF with arcane spells. That's the point.

ALL THESE TALENTS ---> substitue nicely the deep freeze or the elemental shatter combo (the most significant frost things you loose with this build).

Don't overanalyize too much guys it's simple. Don't be anal. In WOWiki there's a hybrid spec between 3 talent trees from a skilled player and he likes it even if nobody would use it.

[Swizzle]

look, i'm not the one asking for comments on my random terrible build. if you don't want comments, don't ask for them.

i'll sum up problems with your spec.

1) only one point in magic attunement, so your range on counterspell and sheep will be shorter than any pvp frost or arcane mage, meaning you're at a disadvantage.
2) arcane shielding...why?
3) arcane empowerment only has 2 points in it so it would be over ridden by any ret paladin aura in your BGs and you won't be casting arcane missiles ever so half of the talent is wasted.
4) no cold as ice
5) no winter's chill for dispel protection and crit increase
6) 1 point in frost channeling and only 1 point in shattered barrier. worst talent allocation ever.
7) no prismatic cloak, no arcane power, no improved blink.

let's see what you gained from your spec that affects the frost school which you will be using:
+6% damage to CoC and ice lance
+3% crit and damage
+2% damage

now let's look at what you gave up:
-3% crit to frostbolt
-5% crit
-5% damage to frostbolt, cone of cold, frostfire bolt, and ice lance
brain freeze
5 second stun
replenishment
water elemental

so you've gained 6% damage on ice lance and CoC...and that's about it.

here's my closing comment which is what you asked for: your spec is bad.

[Tassir]

My idea of your talent spread is to place burst on your target with either arcane or frost spells, as we picked up arcane offensive and frost defensive talents.

I respectfully disagree with some points that you've moved:
-Not investing 1 point into arcane power is a bad move: it works REALLY well with icy veins.
-Frost talents like cold as ice and the 2nd point in shattered barrier allocate better defensive strategy (No RNG on the nova when your barrier breaks), and 6 seconds off the CD of your barrier IS a livesaver (as it allows additional damage absorb).
-Since you've gone so far into the arcane tree, not picking up a Incanters Absorption is a poor move too, 8k absorbed (since glyphed barrier is around that) is +400 SP per point.
-Also, grab that 2nd point into magic attunement: getting your spells ranged does put a damper on it.
-Arcane empowerment is a nice talent, but picking it over arcane power and incanters would defeat the purpose of making a shatter combo spec that works with arcane and frost spells.

Also, drop the icy veins glyph. Polymorph, arcane power, blast or missiles would be a better use for it. If you need the movement impairment so badly... USE YOUR RACIAL.

This spec isn't so bad if we were level 85...


EDIT: swizzle... beating me to it once again..

[Swizzle]

my girlfriends have always liked my quick fingers.

[Excellent]

I've noticed a trend on the Mage boards. It goes something like this:

(NEW THREAD)
"Hey guys I was trying something new and I think it works for me but tell me what you guys think, thanks!"

(SWIZZLE REPLY)
"You suck and your idea is bad."

(OP REPLY)
"But I like it, here's why: (insert reasons and numbers)"

(SWIZZLE REPLY)
"You still suck, your idea is still bad. Here are some more numbers, if you aren't min/maxing you suck and your ideas are bad."

So yea...don't feel too bad, its not just you.

[Strykie]

This game is awesome.

[Swizzle]

I've noticed a trend on the Mage boards. It goes something like this:

(NEW THREAD)
"Hey guys I was trying something new and I think it works for me but tell me what you guys think, thanks!"

(SWIZZLE REPLY)
"You suck and your idea is bad."

(OP REPLY)
"But I like it, here's why: (insert reasons and numbers)"

(SWIZZLE REPLY)
"You still suck, your idea is still bad. Here are some more numbers, if you aren't min/maxing you suck and your ideas are bad."

So yea...don't feel too bad, its not just you.

what numbers did he give? it IS a bad spec, and i'm not the only one saying so. i've said it before and i'll say it again: you have the right to post your ideas, and i have the right to call your ideas bad.

welcome to america, have a cookie.