A few words to say to you “Game too easy” people.

[krillianlol]

The current healing situation is unchallenging. Yes, PvE is easier from a healer pov.

Nah, dps is way easier, the raid doesnt rely on you as much. Take lich king 10 heroic, you have to keep track of everything a dps does while keeping tanks alive through all kinds of shit. This coming from a shaman who has played both elemental and resto endgame.

[Lebored]

You forgotten that videogames have come out with selectable difficulty level for about 25 years or so? I think the original Doom (most of the readers here never seen since it came before they were born) was the first game where players chose to set up difficulty for themselves and keep on raising the bar for artificial achievements because people liked it. A lot.

That's why games like WoW have achievements because a lot of people like to make the game artificially harder for themselves for shits & giggles and increased replayability. It's not a bad thing to have that option.

Lol Doom was most definitely not the first game to do that
And that isnt artificially harder, thats an actual setting, artificially harder would be if you decided to beat the game using only the pistol

[Herecius]

The percentage of people who are enjoying this game, it's current difficulty, and current state and direction, is significantly higher (very significantly) than those that are extremely displeased and find everything way too easy. Thing is, the second group is just fifty times louder and makes umpteen times more posts about it on forums.

[Astray]

[saberon]

I like how you so eloquently summed up everything through use of Pie-Chart.
If more people Pie-Charted, I think the world would be a far nicer place.

[Herecius]

I like how you so eloquently summed up everything through use of Pie-Chart.
If more people Pie-Charted, I think the world would be a far nicer place.

Had I room in my sig, this would be there.

[vesseblah]

Lol Doom was most definitely not the first game to do that
And that isnt artificially harder, thats an actual setting, artificially harder would be if you decided to beat the game using only the pistol

That's exactly what I meant. People first cleared whole game with only pistol, then whole game with only fists, then whole game with only fists on hardest mode... Then whole game with only fists in hardest mode and never dying. There wasn't anything else after that to make it artificially harder, but there was a whole gaming community who did these things, and competed over who can clear the game fastest with just fists on whatever difficulty. Besides modding having the option to choose artificially harder game mode added years to the replay value.

[Memory]

I like how you so eloquently summed up everything through use of Pie-Chart.
If more people Pie-Charted, I think the world would be a far nicer place.

I think it would suck. There's enough simplifications and generalizations without pie-charts. The one above, far from being interesting or enlightening, is just another one, based on some mass-produced opinion: you don't like WoW? Oh, you didn't kill the LK 25 HM!!111oneoneone. Do you really feel the need for more? Well, good luck with looking at the world through pie-charts, I find it creepy.

[saberon]

I think it would suck. There's enough simplifications and generalizations without pie-charts. The one above, far from being interesting or enlightening, is just another one, based on some mass-produced opinion: you don't like WoW? Oh, you didn't kill the LK 25 HM!!111oneoneone. Do you really feel the need for more? Well, good luck with looking at the world through pie-charts, I find it creepy.

You... dislike Pie-chart?


Hmph! You probably do all your charting via Scatter-plot... Casual.

[underdogba]

Were I to invoke logic, however, logic clearly dictates that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

-Spock (Star Treck II: The Wrath of Khan)

This assertion requires one to assume that the ethics of Utilitarianism (specifically the original Jeremy Bentham formulation) are correct. That's a very very bad assumption.

[Memory]

You... dislike Pie-chart?


Hmph! You probably do all your charting via Scatter-plot...

True that.

[GennGreymane]

wut i would say to them is

take off the training wheels
take off the icc buff
do heroic mode

go play ninja gaiden

[Lebored]

That's exactly what I meant. People first cleared whole game with only pistol, then whole game with only fists, then whole game with only fists on hardest mode... Then whole game with only fists in hardest mode and never dying. There wasn't anything else after that to make it artificially harder, but there was a whole gaming community who did these things, and competed over who can clear the game fastest with just fists on whatever difficulty. Besides modding having the option to choose artificially harder game mode added years to the replay value.

Im not sure if youre implying thats how things should be or just how they are.
If we were designing from scratch the better idea would just to have scaling intentional difficulty without needing it to be artificial. Artificial is fine for people who want that sort of thing but it shouldnt be the only way to have it be difficult.

[Lazertrooper]

I cannot respect anyone who doesn't like pie charts >< gtfo you freaking pie chart haters ><

[Lebored]

I think what people tend to forget that there hardly is a 100% objective way to measure skill and set one skill as the default skill to measure everything else against.

You know..even Paragon needed a 5% buff to kill LK after 4 weeks..maybe in 8 weeks they could have done it without a buff. Does that mean 25 man HMs should have stayed 8 weeks without a buff, Some ppl will advocate there should have ONLY be a 25 man HM setting for ICC...even if that means by now maybe 3 guilds have Arthas killed.

Sure..you can sie with game decisions like that..but WoW isn't that kind of game and never will be. I know people who need the 20% buff to even kill Arthas on 10 man normal..and it makes them happy without going around bragging. Blizzard is aware of the incredible scope of skill among the player base. A 16 year old who spends 4 hrs just has a different hand-eye coordination and access to the game than a 20, 30 or even 40 year old guy spending the same time. Does that mean the game has to be tuned to 16 year old wizkids?

I can only repeat myself..if you start disagreeing with the most basic of game design decisons made in this game..it probably is not your game anymore.

Im not sure if that was directed at me or if you were just quoting me.
Id say we are both on the same page.

The game is going in the right direction, I dont care how hard they make hard modes just as long as they allow another mode for people who play this game for entertainment and not as a sport.

[Crathsor]

I think both things can be true. My guild is far, far behind on progression but I still don't think WoW is difficult on an individual basis.

I don't think there is really that big a gulf in player skill; WoW is complex, but it's not difficult enough for there to be much of one. How hard is it to get out of fire, really? I believe that there are hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions of players who could be in a world first guild, given the chance. The real gulf is in level of skill at the guild level. If you have eight Paragon raiders and the GM's boyfriend is fucking terrible, you're not killing Lich King anytime soon and nothing short of a guild disband will fix it in the meantime. Most guilds aren't able to field their "A" Team at will, and that's the real problem. On most servers, the really good players (several guilds' worth, in most cases) are scattered among the top 20-30 guilds and so none of them are world beaters. The exceptions are home to Paragon and the like.

The Attendance Boss is the hardest heroic encounter in the game for the vast majority of guilds. If there is a truly difficult aspect to WoW, it's putting together and keeping together a guild of quality players. For that, and for actually coming up with strategies instead of watching Tankspot videos, I do admire Paragon and the like. Their actual gameplay? Many, many guilds have people who can do that.

[Zoros]

Lady Vashj was hard.
Arthas is just random.