Lock's need more lore!

[volrat]

As title, i was considering our position within alliance and horde, and i was wondering if anyone else were feeling that our position is somewhat "suspended"...

I mean, even death knights got some introduction within the ranks of each faction, have an order that somewhat unite them, druids got a lot of this kind of stuff, along with paladins and mages; we as warlocks are merely tollereted, there is nothing justifing Thrall or Wrynn from giving the order of complete extermination of all warlocks, we are in the end without any carsmatic figure, apart those who have betrayed and have been disposed, from Gul'dan to Medhiv, and we are very "lone dogs", everyone for himself without any real point outside the legion itself.

I do believe that some "introduction" may be made for our class in the ranks of each faction, with some important NPC granting that demons will be kept in control, and offering some major point in the world where we can go when we search some kind of demonology knowledge and understanding.

I was expecting for us to have a small part in the Dalaran's underbelly, with some arcanist dwelling in dark arts, but we have been totally ignored as magic wielders and spellcasters in the development of wotlk, and even in tbc, we got very few lore for us, and that was surely a great chance.

I wanted to ask the comunity here if this feeling is just me, or others do believe this will benefit a lot the class in flavour and not feeling totally outside of place running around cities with a felguard or imp besides....

[Garrim]

Warlocks brought the Horde to Azeroth, that's why the Alliance wants them killed. They feel it's magic is too dangerous and could open a up portal with who knows what popping out.

Thrall hates warlocks because one of them was a shaman, turned lock, turned LK. Gul'dan manipulated the entire orc race and lead them in a war against Azeroth and the Shadow Council basically broke the world of Draenor. It's a hunk of rock floating in space, yup that was us.

Alliance locks (unlike druids/paladins/mages) decided to train in warlock ways because they wanted to exterminate the Horde's warlocks. The mages wanted to understand the shadow so they could find out the weaknesses and exploit them. So Alliance warlocks were created entirely to kill off warlocks of the Horde. Yeah I doubt they'd make some circle type deal like the druids and what not.

Also since they are basically outlaws, there are small groups of them here and there, but they're basically outnumbered by everyone. No one likes them, DK probably understand them, tolerate them and have no real hatred towards the practice, but other then that, everyone hates them.

So outnumbered, out muscled, outlawed and hated makes it very hard for them to unite to be lead by one person. In such cases in history when this did happen, an outlaw forming a small ragtag type army, the leader was killed asap and the rest fell apart.

Also warlocks are very distrustful of everyone, even other warlocks. They fear betrayal and strive to better themselves above others. They do not want to share their knowledge of magic with each other for fear of it being used against them. In this regard they are holding themselves back, but individually, only worthy warlocks ever make it to maturity (lvl 80 in game).

I do agree though that some more lore, or maybe a warlock quest giver type guy (doesn't need to be a badass but really takes charge for maybe a quest chain or two) would be nice.

[DerpderpHAMMA]

Gul'dan and ner'zhul not enough?

[Zelious]

I'd like more warlock lore characters in game other than wilfred fizzlebang and the other less notable ones.... but I'm ok with the current warlock lore, of in the shadows dwelling in basements. I think it suits the class.

[Deleted]

Gul'dan and ner'zhul not enough?

Opened this thread to say the same. The freakin' Lich King!

[adynn]

Warlocks brought the Horde to Azeroth, that's why the Alliance wants them killed. They feel it's magic is too dangerous and could open a up portal with who knows what popping out.

Thrall hates warlocks because one of them was a shaman, turned lock, turned LK. Gul'dan manipulated the entire orc race and lead them in a war against Azeroth and the Shadow Council basically broke the world of Draenor. It's a hunk of rock floating in space, yup that was us.

Alliance locks (unlike druids/paladins/mages) decided to train in warlock ways because they wanted to exterminate the Horde's warlocks. The mages wanted to understand the shadow so they could find out the weaknesses and exploit them. So Alliance warlocks were created entirely to kill off warlocks of the Horde. Yeah I doubt they'd make some circle type deal like the druids and what not.

Also since they are basically outlaws, there are small groups of them here and there, but they're basically outnumbered by everyone. No one likes them, DK probably understand them, tolerate them and have no real hatred towards the practice, but other then that, everyone hates them.

So outnumbered, out muscled, outlawed and hated makes it very hard for them to unite to be lead by one person. In such cases in history when this did happen, an outlaw forming a small ragtag type army, the leader was killed asap and the rest fell apart.

Also warlocks are very distrustful of everyone, even other warlocks. They fear betrayal and strive to better themselves above others. They do not want to share their knowledge of magic with each other for fear of it being used against them. In this regard they are holding themselves back, but individually, only worthy warlocks ever make it to maturity (lvl 80 in game).

I do agree though that some more lore, or maybe a warlock quest giver type guy (doesn't need to be a badass but really takes charge for maybe a quest chain or two) would be nice.

Personally I view this type of situation as having some great lore potential. The warlock trainers in SW are awesome (hiding under a tavern), but we haven't really had any cool lore since cata hit. Also, Wilfred Fizzlebang must surely be a warlock and he seemed accepted by Tirion, until he turned into a puddle that is. I would like to see a powerful warlock running around that doesn't turn into a raid boss, I mean people love sylvannas and she seems to be quite evil atm, I think the same sort of character type would fit a powerful warlock.

---------- Post added 2010-08-19 at 12:52 PM ----------

Opened this thread to say the same. The freakin' Lich King!

It's a little hard to define the LK, while ner'zhul was a warlock, arthas was a DK. Most of his common abilities seem more in keeping with defining him as a DK imo.

[Jessicka]

Take a look outside right outside the Tournament stadium by the steps, there's a whole bunch of Alliance and Horde Warlocks right there. Speak to them, they tell you that while they're not accepted in the major cities, but out on the battlefield they're actually accepted and genuinely respected.

[volrat]

Take a look outside right outside the Tournament stadium by the steps, there's a whole bunch of Alliance and Horde Warlocks right there. Speak to them, they tell you that while they're not accepted in the major cities, but out on the battlefield they're actually accepted and genuinely respected.

....and u're ok with that?

[Jessicka]

I'd like to see more sure, but it does somewhat widen the role from 'Evul Magic User'. More depth = good.

Also, Warlocks weren't "created", they studied and learnt. I'd argue they were a damn site more scholarly than Mages.

[volrat]

I'm not telling we're without important characters in WC history, hell, the very story is based upon warlock magic; a major part of my concern is probably that any single warlock in the lore is a major villain or a demon, is a kind of "bug" of the story that we can run freely in cities.

PS

Nerzul was not a warlock, he was a shaman somewhat twisted, but the very warlock of orc history is Gul'dan.
Also, before i stated that Medivh was a warlock, it wasn't accurate, he was the pet of the greatest warlock ever, or so i think... he was Sargeras when opening the dark portal.

[Deleted]

Kil'jaedan world's number 1 warlock

[Ravasha]

I think warlock's lore is fine. Mages searching for more power in the demonic arts. We also have notable warlocks like Kil'Jaeden, Gul'Dan and Medivh. Most of the Burning Legion lore is warlock lore too. Like Jessicka said: More depth = good, but that's about it. Nothing really special has to be done.

[Deleted]

Warlocks are superawesome, superimportant badasses. But that's not the point at all (to all your who read the title, went in and posted and went on trolling).

After seeing some of your points, I kinda agree. There are "orders" of paladins, mages, druids, shamans, rogues (although minor, but that's understandable). These are established clans where all the classes work together to actually achieve something. Warlocks are just screwing things up wherever we go.

If I was Thrall/Wrynn/Garrosh I'd purge the world out of Warlocks tbh. There's no real reason not too. It's a way too dangerous art for what the rewards are. But then again, IF all the Warlocks banded together, I'm sure they could bring an end to both the Horde and the Alliance by some form of dark trade/summoning ritual. That might be the reason.

[bahumut5]

I don't know...
We are kinda that "Underground" group that operate when Mages can't handle it alone and when the Kingdom of Stormwind or the ... uhm... City(?) of Orggrimar feel that it is necessary to use Demonic Magic. We are not accepted in the world, because Demons basically destroyed everything we know of (Draenor, they are also hated for what they did on Azeroth).

And I feel totally fine about this.

There are 2 pieces of Lore and how you can look at it.
Some classes get a special intro. Explaining how awesome good they are.

Warlocks on the other hand, need to travel the world to learn about demonic powers, because the people who can teach us are all outcasts for practicing "new" fel magic. This on itself is a piece of Lore for us.
Not to mention that the Warlocks of the Alliance have been "pushed" away and that they are only welcome in Dark Places where no other living being comes.

The first thing we hear as a Warlock is that the wounds are to fresh to be fully accepted as a Class.
We are send all over the World to learn more about Demonology and Shadow Magic. We are send to places where no other mortal being dares to set foot (unless epics are involved. <3 you purples).

Thats what I meant with: we are the Underground Group. We move on our own, and we take care of all the dirty work.

[volrat]

Warlocks are superawesome, superimportant badasses. But that's not the point at all (to all your who read the title, went in and posted and went on trolling).

After seeing some of your points, I kinda agree. There are "orders" of paladins, mages, druids, shamans, rogues (although minor, but that's understandable). These are established clans where all the classes work together to actually achieve something. Warlocks are just screwing things up wherever we go.

If I was Thrall/Wrynn/Garrosh I'd purge the world out of Warlocks tbh. There's no real reason not too. It's a way too dangerous art for what the rewards are. But then again, IF all the Warlocks banded together, I'm sure they could bring an end to both the Horde and the Alliance by some form of dark trade/summoning ritual. That might be the reason.

You catch my points (perhaps i put the wrong title..)i totally agree we are an underground class, i do not think we need a big door with upon marked "warlock school of magic", but a little more info/lore on about what we're doing, and some sort of explanation why we are running in Stormwind or Orgrimar with an imp without guards ready to impale us. Lorewise, you must admit it feels a lil strange...

If you ever go to Exodar (none really need to, but there are some seasonal event, or rep farming purpose that drove me there the first times) you can find a large room with olograms of the most known demonic races, it is quiet awesome, and when i've seen the felguard i turned to mine and said:
"hey Thoodun, they've got a picture of you here"
"..Oh, yes master, it was quiet a bad moonday when they took that one, like today"
"You didn't like the massacre at Arathy Basin, Thoo?"
"We camped Lumber Mill for almost all the time, Master..."
"You meathead, a good defense is the key to victory, how many times i need to tell you?"
"The rogue undead feasted upon your flesh twice sir"
"That goes on your faults, stupid minion"
"My opinion, master, is for you to respec affliction and use the dumb Blue fat for such annoing task"
"You read forums now? go back in that hole i piked you from"...
wellthe rest of my day in Exodar isn't none of you busines, but i liked to share^^

Back to topic, i really think is a sort of "bug" to the story...we shouldn't be there, but, for the sake of the game, who cares? Demon master roams freely, and everybody is acting like,mm,who? demons? where? i've never seen a demon since the end of third war.(i'm in fron of him with a felguard polishing teeth with arcanite reaper)

More, for those who states warlocks are badasses that goes lonely, i would remember that even the most evil of us, were able to form one of the most formidable group, the shadow council; so, why those who, at least as a facade, want to use the dark arts to defend theyr homelands do not forge any form of alliance or shared knowledge?

[Jessicka]

The Dark Arts are a very specialised and dangerous practice; those who do it are the ones who are most aware of just how nasty it can be so they're not just going to teach it to just anyone. Thus they end up distancing themselves, and with it being new and even the practitioners not fully understanding it, there just adds more to the mystique.

Like any cutting edge science, they'll probably share things amongst themselves who actually have a grasp of what they're talking about, to the layman though it can be end up horribly misconstrued - take a look at genetic engineering and cloning today as an example, and the early days of nuclear technology, also 'New, Powerful, and not fully understood'.

On the battlefield though, any edge is a good one so the likes of Tirion and Varian will be more than happy to use it - over time that will filter back to the masses. A Felguard walking around Stormwind with it's master probably would unease the locals, but the guards are probably used to it - and ready to deal with it should it go loose. The people may well be aware of the Demons of the Burning Legion, but they're probably also aware 'We can control them too'.

Ultimately, it's the practitioners who keep it to themselves by necessity, it's many unknowns and reputation from those who went too far that keep the image of the evil Warlock in place. In more modern stories, you could replace the Evil Warlock with the Mad Scientist and come up with a very similar story.

[Deleted]

I think we could do with a "hero" as it were, or a publicly acknowledged group at least. Try and see where we stand on the whole accepted/not thing.

The ToC thing was a bit refreshing, showing that Warlocks are starting to be accepted (even by Crusaders) once we show what we can do on the battlefield and that we're not all powerhungry megalomaniacs.

Then it was all spoilt by that stupid Gnome demonstrating exactly why we should be persecuted, what if he had tried that at home? Without a group of heros and an army on hand to clean up (literally) after him?

Also, to one of the post above commenting that we're more scholarly than mages, I don't see it like that.

Mages aquire all their power by research and understanding, how much they can do is directly proportional to how long they spend in a library.

Warlocks on the otherhand, do it mostly through shear willpower. We take the raw source of magic and point it at our enemies. Yes, there is research, understanding and teaching, but there is also alot of (mental) brute force and deals. So whilst a typical powerful mage will probably beat a warlock in terms of "scholarlyness", the warlock will win on sheer willpower as the mage won't have his soul torn to shreads if he tries something above his station.

PS. Exhausted atm. So sorry if i'm a bit rambling and incoherant.

[Florena]

Warlocks have Wilfred Fizzlebang, what more do you want?

[Jessicka]

Also, to one of the post above commenting that we're more scholarly than mages, I don't see it like that.

Mages aquire all their power by research and understanding, how much they can do is directly proportional to how long they spend in a library.

Warlocks on the otherhand, do it mostly through shear willpower. We take the raw source of magic and point it at our enemies. Yes, there is research, understanding and teaching, but there is also alot of (mental) brute force and deals. So whilst a typical powerful mage will probably beat a warlock in terms of "scholarlyness", the warlock will win on sheer willpower as the mage won't have his soul torn to shreads if he tries something above his station.

PS. Exhausted atm. So sorry if i'm a bit rambling and incoherant.

Mages learn accepted doctrine. Warlocks go out there and look for something else.

[Garrim]

Warlocks tend to stay to small circles because they are very leary of outsiders. So for example, the SW locks might not share knowledge, talismans or books about the Fel magic with the gnomes in Iron Forge. The thing to remember though is that all races that are warlocks came about them in different manners and the way their culture works depends on how warlocks work.

Example: Human warlocks appeared when they first fought the Horde and wanted to understand what type of magic the orcs were wielding. Humans began to hate and distrust any practicionar (spelling?) of the art.

Gnomes have no belief in god(s) or any super natural being. They view the warlock as someone simply learning about the most dangerous of known schools of magic. They really do not harbor any animosity towards them, they simply avoid them due to the events and mishaps that are known to form around those practicing Fel magic. If distrust is amongst the race it's probably been instilled from the other races of the Alliance.

Orcs remember Gul'dan and what he did to everyone, so they are very apprehensive about them, but understand the power of a warlock. They do not openly accept them because they fear a massive influx in the warlock population and dread the possibility of a returning Shadow Council. So by keeping them illegeal but not really persuing them, it allows the orcs to use the warlocks at their disposal w/o every openly supporting them. In case of a summoning gone wrong they can simply said 'You weren't suppose to do that in the first place,' and redirect blame, from the perspective of Thrall/Garrosh.

UD obviously find it a perfectly acceptable practice and advocate many of it's denizens to practice and study Fel magic, it's what keeps them living past their experation date. So obviously they do not have a negitive view of it. Of all the races I would see a circle or another type of offical order starting in UC over any other place.

BE I'm unsure about, it's a race I never cared to learn much about. I suspect though that they find it to be legitment means of obtaining energy to quench their thirst for powerful energies.

We know nothing of troll/dwarf warlocks yet so we cannot really know the lore of their race.

So you see, the two largest groups of each faction take a negitive view of the warlock. So that will trickle down to their allies, as they are held together mostly by one leading race; Human and Orc respectively.