Enhancement 4.0 Summary

[Omanley]

-searing flames buff on the shaman... hmm.. "your searing totem shoots flames at you, setting you on fire, buffing your Lava Lash damage by 20% - stacks 5 times." well.. weird idea, but could be better than now.
-no, please no fire nova with searing totem, I'm sick of casting AOE in my single target rotation.
-MSW is stacking slower because you lost 30% haste (from ratings) and changed all your sockets to agility. Still stacks very fast for me, so no - no Proc-rate increase, please.
-static shock 100% ? why? it's a proc, for more damage with LL and SS. what does this have to do with RNG on cooldowns?

1.)what i meant with searign totem is that you get the searing flames effect on yourself whenever your searing totem attacks a target. means you can stack that stuff up and do not have to worry about target switches ( or at least not in this dimension )
2.) if it bothers you that much ( and i perfectly understand your point, i even share your few to a large degree ) it could share a cooldown with shocks. however, ret still uses divine stoirm in it's single target rotation and warriors use whirlwind.
3.)msw is stacking slower because they reverted the ulduar buff, cut in half the windfury totem raid buff, removed the 3% raid buff, AND did not give us a compensation for other classes getting that haste -> recource regeneration thingy last but not least, also because of longer ll cd. msw stacks slow as shit right now, dont try to sugar coat it. also it does hardly any dmg. on the boss dummy (yes i know that's not like in the raid) it crits for 5-6k. yes... awesome
4.)static shock was a flat 6% proc on every melee hit. now it's a 40% proc chance on two long cooldown abilities. assume you are unlucky and it procs not twice in a row, you wont have a proc in 10 seconds. my math indicates static shock proc 1/3 as often as it did prio patch. no added chance to crit will make up for that. what shaman needs is more reliability. either make it a non 100% on every attack, or a 100% on specific abilities.
4.)

---------- Post added 2010-10-15 at 03:04 PM ----------

I do not agree with adding FN back onto Searing Totem. As has been pointed out in various threads for various classes, Blizzard want the player to make a choice between using AoE or using single target DPS. Throwing FN back onto Searing Totem would only go against that logic.

understandable, my point in adding back fn in was a easy way to bring our dps back up. still, unlike ret/warri we have no cleave, so i keep thinking it wouldn´t be to bad. also we hardly use up any mana anyway... im pretty sure however that they should improve magma/fn dmg, as aoe is really weak right now.

and is also want lvb back, but not as part of msw. it's the same as static shock right now, a proc coupled with a cooldown, bad idea. my idea was to give ll a 100% chance with full sf charges to make the next lvb instant. would tie it to ll cooldown, so ll -> lvb would be a set part in our prio.

[Jimmyx]

I have to agree with you Omanley
I have been playing my enhancement shaman since early TBC and i just can tell you that we have never been "op" :P ...
but it's not a problem for me because it's not cool to "have biiiiig dps" with class that is op. But for 3 years i have been waiting for the day when we'll be as good as other classes are
I know that fury warriors and ret paladins are in horrible place now but it hurts when I can see blue post "War, ret and even feral (that still has good dps) are going to get buff" and nothing about us.
I can understand that enhancement is only one of the 3 specs of one class but I hate how Blizz again forgot about us.
For example-We had to wait a lot of time for our first aoe. We got it 1 patch ago but now we won't need it (less aoe in cata) so its np that they are taking it away.
First i thought - well i have to do something wrong when i lost 4k dps on saurfang (18k->14k) but when i noticed that best enha dps shaman (19,8k on saurfang) n this week did 14k - I looooost motivation :PP
I understood blizz doesn't care about enhancement shamans :| I'm not going to change class just because my shaman is priceless for me - FOS achievements, mounts, titles earned all over the years. So dont make me reroll to DK, Druid or any other class :P
I know we have 10 classes in game and it can be rly hard to balance them without taking away unique playstyles but blizz should open eyes and do it's best to make every players feel happy :P he he he.
Well I'm not going to cry, I just want to take a part in discussion and atm i just hope that blizz will give us some love during this week

[Acidbaron]

My concern with searing is that with CC being touted as a big part of cata, it is going to break crowd control the moment your target dies.

Searing totem was made that it should ignore CC targets, reports from beta confirm that.

If it's fully functional then Searing should attack the target it has your SS or ES on. (dummy bug aside)

[Gray_Matter]

Searing totem was made that it should ignore CC targets, reports from beta confirm that.

If it's fully functional then Searing should attack the target it has your SS or ES on. (dummy bug aside)

And after the target dies?

[deathbleeder]

I never post on forums really cos i hate the no it alls who assasinate people but i view this post as a kind of pertition to get something done for enhance.

Theres some really wild numbers being stated with regards to what people were getting in some fights and i think a lot of it is proper exageration unless a link to a world of logs report for them is given.

Before this patch i wasnt that impressed with my shamen however it is the only class at lvl80 i play and have done since TBC, i dont like being a jack of all master of none so to speak.

Fights like saurfang i used to do roughly 12-15k and it was annoying how it could fluctuate from week to week so i was reading changes proposed with hope that we would get more steady in our dps output.

From what i can see im doing roughly 1-2k less dps on every fight which im not impressed with at all.


Last night our guild had a non heroic run in icc25 so people could play with there setups with a view to getting achieves towards the mount...so no pressure. We all had recount open and everyone was commenting on vent about issues and changes as can be expected. The saurfang fight for example i had top 10 people showing in recount window and i didnt apear in it at all for the whole fight where as before patch i would be around 3rd or 4th.

The issue isnt just that weve lost a little bit of our dps which wasnt great anyway, the issue is that blizz has done a crap job with other classes, we had our guild leader with his offspec boomkin 1st or near top in every fight through the first 7 bosses last night, i think on festergut his dps at end was 26k!!!!!!! i was down at 12k i think. We normally run the whole of icc25 in heroic so god knows how bad itll be then with the extra movement and awareness needed.

Ive been doing some experimenting with trinkets also, been waiting a year for HC TAJ and i got it a month before the patch, gotta say i wasnt to impressed with it but it seems that with this new patch my old 251 whispering fanged skull performs a good 500dps better on dummy, anyone else still using HC TAJ or changing it like me.

Paladins in raid didnt seem much worse than me tbh on dps but holy cow warriors omg what a joke, feel sorry for them although they was too imba before patch but blizz definatly went to far.

Oh and havent even tryed pvp yet ( it was crap but i still tryed before ), but i was standing around before going into voa25 with guild when a fellow guildie preist wanted a duel whilst waiting, i lost within 5 seconds.....thats insane, we were both in pve gear but come on 5 seconds!!!!

I like the fact that fire nova got taken out our single target rotation because i aggree that we should choose, and most guilds would prefer someone speccing for boss fights over trash i reckon.

Rotation is a bit sucky, i find myself putting the odd lava burst in just because i have 3 seconds spare every now and then whilst waiting for the really slowwwwww mw5 to happen.

Anyone thought about possibly speccing when we a couple of lvls higher like 83+ to put 2 points in talents to reduce GCD for shocks by 1 second and then using glyph also, i think it would mean during a FS cycle we would be able to get another earth shock in and maybe with mastery that would be a greater dps increase than stormstrike glyph at later levels.

Peace out.

[Acidbaron]

And after the target dies?

It should still ignore the CC target if that's what you mean.

got a raid tonight probably on halion i'll see how it goes, the boost from Fire nova on adds is gone but used to the shadow realm anyhow.

[myrddinde]

the searing totem is currently bugged. it currently refuses to attack training dummies, and even on pve targets, it's not always working. it costs me 2.4k dps roughly.

Try Melee Target Dummies at Argent Tournament, they work fine.

---------- Post added 2010-10-15 at 04:21 PM ----------

I can only say, that I am mildy said disappointed by the performance on meters. Also my damage (item level 276, 6500 GS) has taken a hit and I am competing with Tanks for DPS. In fact today the warriors and rets have been buffed and are back to 16k+ dps while both our enhancement shamans were at 14-15k. I was having Lava Lashes of 40k and more, but that all doesn't help if the rest of the damage is far behind.

I was expecting so much ... and then this was like a slap in the face.

[Acidbaron]

For those who don't read elitist jerks;

Also the new armor formula won't apply till level 81 and up so change that back to 10643 since that reflects the current armor constant and the amount of armor on the actual bosses.

PS - as an aside that armor DR aspect is why we are doing so badly on the meters in 4.0.1. All melee was low because the armor constant will be changing for 81+ so bosses will have less DR then they do currently but that isn't in effect now. So how low the melee specs ended up was very dependent on their ratio of physical versus magic damage. Problem is that instead of reworking the armor constant to take the Bosses DR to the new lower levels they (for whatever reason) decided to do base damage increases on the classes/specs that they thought were too low. So the buffs are uneven which has thrown us under the bus since we weren't horrible looking initially since we are only about 50% physical so we didn't get any buffs but still our physical is lagging behind because we didn't get any buffs.

Not a very postive note as looks like getting a fix is something we can hope for but not likely unless they pick that up.
But atleast explains our bad damage now and why it will be different higher up.

[Snixs]

Hey deathbleeder, i guess some just didn't take their time to read your post, wich is kinda odd tbh, i found it very interesting.

Me myself can's push more than 15k on Saurfang this release, it's not totally sucky, but compaared to people doing 21k in a fight lasting 5 min is just... meh..

regarding Taiaj i'm going to replace that one aswel, as soon as i get my new BiS item list going, wanna help out anyone out there? Feel free to PM me and i'll have a list ready in a couple of hours.(needs to sim)


And that LB, well.. don't know if it's any good but i guess, aye? I don't see the problem didnt test myself yet tho..



Cumshox.

[Omanley]

my guess is that taiaj isn't any good anymore . sadly i just got it finally to drop (the 277 one) one week before the patch hit.

my guess (pure intitution): halion trinket (284)/death's choice (258) > dbw (277)/halion trinket(271)/death's choice(245) > dbw (264) > dc:g/botog > former arp proc trinkets (nes/mjolnir/grim toll) and dark matter > pyrit infuser > comet's trail > wrath stone > and so on...

as i said, just guessing i think dark matter might outperform comets trail, since crit > haste now... well, it largely depends on hit/crit caps in terms of trinkets with passive hit or crit/agi procs...

---------- Post added 2010-10-15 at 09:15 PM ----------

Try Melee Target Dummies at Argent Tournament, they work fine.

thanks, did just that . the result i posted in the thread about enh dps. i tested different weapon imbues, with surprisingly low differences in dps.

do you know how much dps i gain/lose between the lvl80 melee target and the lvl83 boss dummy? or do i even lose/gain dps since i'm spell/exp capped anyway?

[Acidbaron]

Anyone else getting more single target dmg from using CL instead of LB?

[Lylz]

For those who don't read elitist jerks;

Not a very postive note as looks like getting a fix is something we can hope for but not likely unless they pick that up.
But atleast explains our bad damage now and why it will be different higher up.

This is welcome news and hopefully will calm some panic around here.

On a side note, I've been ripping it up in PvP!

[myrddinde]

For those who don't read elitist jerks;

Not a very postive note as looks like getting a fix is something we can hope for but not likely unless they pick that up.
But atleast explains our bad damage now and why it will be different higher up.

We have only 40% physical damage, the rest is elemental and should not be affected ... thus the effect is even smaller than for the classes who perform way above us.

[Acidbaron]

40% from just white hits is a lot, aren't storm strike and lava lash effected by this aswel?

[myrddinde]

40% from just white hits is a lot, aren't storm strike and lava lash effected by this aswel?

Stormstrike, Windfury + Melee = 39% of my damage last saurfang. Lava lash is a fire attack and ignores armor?

---------- Post added 2010-10-16 at 06:39 AM ----------

my guess is that taiaj isn't any good anymore . sadly i just got it finally to drop (the 277 one) one week before the patch hit.

my guess (pure intitution): halion trinket (284)/death's choice (258) > dbw (277)/halion trinket(271)/death's choice(245) > dbw (264) > dc:g/botog > former arp proc trinkets (nes/mjolnir/grim toll) and dark matter > pyrit infuser > comet's trail > wrath stone > and so on...

do you know how much dps i gain/lose between the lvl80 melee target and the lvl83 boss dummy? or do i even lose/gain dps since i'm spell/exp capped anyway?

Don't think dv is going to rate that high, crit cap is still an issue + you cannot reforge ap.

no idea how much exactly you lose, but it is ore reliable than having searing totem idle around

[Acidbaron]

lava lash is fire school, yes looked it up this morning.

I do not get your reasoning though, our spell damage is okay, our physical damage isn't. Are your writing that off cause it's not all that because our physical damage is only 40% -now-?

Knowing that Windfury and melee white hits pre-patch was 50% of our damage not even counting stormstrike and jar proc what is physical check aswel, combined getting 56%+ of my damage

So i don't get you basing it of our physical damage now, as due to those changes is the reason why physical damage is now a much smaller part of our dps, not the otherway around those rations should atleast be fairly similair. Our physical damage should be upped again so that it makes up for 50% of damage while our spell damage should be left as it is.

That's what needed for us to be on par and not to be buttom crawling in this patch to be competitive again.

All other classes got the multipliers of the base damage increased to compensate it, that's the reason now after the hotfix they are all above us, seeing that retri got about 30%+ on their abilities and feral plus warriors got a 50-55% buff, it's fair to say it's not a small damage loss.

So yes it's a bit more then just 'only' that much %

[Fornaw]

I've seen a couple sources report that a boss's chance to dodge got reduced in 4.01. There's a post on the US forums detailing this http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...03223791&sid=1

I haven't had a chance to test this myself yet, and from the sound of that post it may just be a problem with the training dummies.

[Deleted]

It isnt. I just checked it myself on HM LK and i got 0 dodges for the fight.

I got 87 expertise and i'm orc

[myrddinde]

I've seen a couple sources report that a boss's chance to dodge got reduced in 4.01. There's a post on the US forums detailing this http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...03223791&sid=1

I haven't had a chance to test this myself yet, and from the sound of that post it may just be a problem with the training dummies.

Yep, was jsut about to post that. As Draenei Enhancement Shaman - no xperstise boni - I tried going as low as 111 rating (5.6% -dodge) and don't get any dodges.

[Foxhoundn]

Yep, was jsut about to post that. As Draenei Enhancement Shaman - no xperstise boni - I tried going as low as 111 rating (5.6% -dodge) and don't get any dodges.

So what is the expertise needed with 2/2 UR atm?