Prayer of Mending and Echo of Light?

[Kelesti]

That would mean that you would see a jump to a sixth target in the combat log (if damage, then jump). It would heal the fifth target (as it currently does), then it would check to see if jump=5 and the spell would end. However, that jump never happens in the combat log. Instead, it fades and never comes back.

It "fades" 5 times.

The only way the tooltip could be accurate in the current implementation is if you consider the original casting of the spell the first jump

Or...

Thisuglyguy casts Prayer of Mending at Thisuglyguy.
Thisuglyguy's Prayer of Mending fades from Thisuglyguy.
Thisuglyguy's Prayer of Mending heals Thisuglyguy for 1478(2021 Overhealed)

Whichuglyguy gains Thisuglyguy's Prayer of Mending

If harky's logic was correct, then you would absolutely see that in the combat log, followed by it fading away (without any healing)... that just doesn't happen, no matter how much we wish on pixie sticks it does.

If harky's logic is correct, which it is, it's already happening. Someone has Mending fade from them, it heals, then it lands on someone else. The "jump" doesn't refer to a "land".

If someone "jumps" off a bridge, you don't disqualify that if they have a bungee cord that stops them from hitting the bottom. The act of "Jump" in harky's logic is dictated by it leaving a target, which has the context of adding a heal. It does this 5 times.

[Owltoid]

The tooltip clearly states that it jumps to another party or raid member. It says this will happen 5 times. The jump to nowhere argument is rubbish. Save some face and say that we though the initial casting of the spell was considered a jump. Otherwise the tooltip is incorrect and the jump to nowhere theory isn't supported in the combat log, the tooltip, nor logic.

[harky]

Actually it is. Last time I'll try to explain, not that it will work:

When you are hit and buffed by PoM it will heal you. When it heals you it will jump at the same time. If it jumps then it will select a new party/raid member in 20 yards. If it jumps 5 times then it will end and fade.

The only argument anyone could possibly have is that the spell fades before it selects a new player, which is rubbish. All your'e arguing is that there's no buff granted to a sixth player before it fades. It would be nothing but combat log clutter. The sixth target would gain the buff, then it would fade because it has jumped 5 times. It would still only heal 5 targets. Here's what happens:

Jump 1: Player 1 healed, PoM jumps first time, PoM lands on Player 2.
Jump 2: Player 2 healed, PoM jumps second time, PoM lands on Player 3.
Jump 3: Player 3 healed, PoM jumps third time, PoM lands on Player 4.
Jump 4: Player 4 healed, PoM jumps fourth time, PoM lands on Player 5.
Jump 5: Player 5 healed, PoM jumps fifth time, PoM ends.

The combat log and tooltip agree. WoW is a computer program following a system of checks. To make it work in game the check to see if the spell ends comes before the spell selects a new target.

And again:

Thisuglyguy's Prayer of Mending fades from Thisuglyguy. (Start of Jump)
Thisuglyguy's Prayer of Mending heals Thisuglyguy for 1478(2021 Overhealed)

Whichuglyguy gains Thisuglyguy's Prayer of Mending (End of Jump)

You're angry because the spell ends at the start of the jump, instead of ending at the end of the jump? Why?

Seriously though, if you want it to say 'healed 5 times' instead of 'jumped 5 times' that's fine. It doesn't change the meaning of the tooltip at all.

[Darkener]

OK, so here is the video I made of it. This video actually points out another interesting and weird oddity of PoM - the Echo of Light procs whenever it heals me even though PoM was originally cast by a Discipline priest. Something else to notice, one of the times PoM heals me it crits, giving me both an Echo of Light proc AND a Divine Aegis bubble. That's both a Holy and Disc specific proc on me simultaneously from one spell cast by a Disc priest. Clearly this thing is operating strangely (not just the tooltip being wrong).

Kelesti - the last PoM fades away without a jump even though there is still 1 left on the jump counter. You can even see the 1 counter on the PoM icon in my raid frames in the video. The PoM buff should fade when there are 0 (zero) jumps left on the jump counter, not 1 (one). This proves that the mechanic allows only 4 jumps, not 5 and that is exactly the point I was making. It's this whole dynamic of counting down to zero that causes 1 more heal than the number of jumps. If you count from 5 to 1 that's 5 heals, if you count from 5 to 0 that's 6 heals. They probably intended for it to heal 5 times, but the tooltip writer guy is not a programmer, so the way he wrote it by using "jumps 5 times" he accidentally introduced a counter that counts to 6, instead of "has 5 charges" which would have been a counter that counts to 5.

Video: PoM Jumps Only 4 Times

[Dianthe]

If the PoM proccs echoes of light when it heals *you* even if cast by a disc priest it means that the assumptions made at the start of the thread that PoM counts as a heal cast by the person that it heals is correct.
In this case PoM healed you so it counted as it was cast by you, while if it heals someone else but a holy priest it won't procc EoL- which is garbage. I hope they fix this...

[Darkener]

If the PoM proccs echoes of light when it heals *you* even if cast by a disc priest it means that the assumptions made at the start of the thread that PoM counts as a heal cast by the person that it heals is correct.
In this case PoM healed you so it counted as it was cast by you, while if it heals someone else but a holy priest it won't procc EoL- which is garbage. I hope they fix this...

That's right, and it is rubbish. A Disc priest that casts PoM will get a Divine Aegis bubble added to the heal if it crits on any player. If a Holy Priest casts PoM they will not get any Echo of Light added to the heal unless it happens to proc on themselves.

[Theonehit]

Echo echo echo.....

[harky]

Video: PoM Jumps Only 4 Times

This shows absolutely nothing new. The spell healed 5 times and therefor jumped 5 times. The spell ends as soon as it jumps the fifth time. Since this happens at the same time you will never see any graphic representation of it jumping from target to target. This is because as soon as the fifth jump began the spell ended. This is working exactly as described by the tooltip. You're essentially arguing that because it is phrased in a manner which details who the spell jumps to before detailing how many jumps occur that it isn't working as described. News flash: The order of those two arguments doesn't matter. Congratulations on making a useless video that shows us exactly what we already knew though, that's a dedication to stating the obvious that I can't compete with. It's too bad that the commentary on the video is useless as it incorrectly does not show the buff bar of the last target as they take damage, which would have shown the final jump taking place and the spell ending.

[Darkener]

Harky - I noticed you tend to bully people on this forum and you act like you are always infallible. It sets a bad example and encourages others to behave that way as well. I am not infallible, I was wrong. I interpreted the spell incorrectly. It jumps 5 times, and on the 5th jump it fades without jumping exactly like the tooltip explains. My apologies, you were right, I was wrong.

[Kelesti]

harky is far from infallible. I think the biggest bit of that spite is still directed at Owltoid, even though it shouldn't be directed at anyone.

*hint*

[zito]

I like how this went from:

Should PoM proc echos of light to how many times PoM bounches.

Now on topic PoM should proc mastery imo because it seems more like a direct heal with a trick. It puts a buff on people but then heals them for a set amount and jumps to the next person. Its not an immediate heal casted like circle of healing but it should still count as a direct heal.

[Owltoid]

The only argument anyone could possibly have is that the spell fades before it selects a new player, which is rubbish. All your'e arguing is that there's no buff granted to a sixth player before it fades. It would be nothing but combat log clutter. The sixth target would gain the buff, then it would fade because it has jumped 5 times.

this is golden! The reason why you don't see a leap to a new target in the combat log is because they were worried about combat log clutter. Now it makes perfect sense! I think there are actually 13 jumps, but you can't see the last 9 because they don't heal and don't get applied to anything (visually or in the combat log).

I mean do you guys seriously believe what you're saying? You're able to ignore the absence in the combat log and the fact the tooltip says it jumps to another player? You have actually created the logic that a jump means to leave the target and doesn't have to land and this jump is never recorded or able to be seen visually. Lock this thread, please... someone on the internetz is wrong!!!

And that someone is you -- Kel

[Deleted]

This shows absolutely nothing new. The spell healed 5 times and therefor jumped 5 times.

Oh, what an ignorance. Either you can't read the tooltip or you are blinded with your "truth". To make it simpler for you, the keywords are JUMPS/TOOLTIP and not FADES/COMBAT LOG. The tooltip is simply wrong .. it states => heal first -> jump after -> 5 jumps -> 6 heals. This isnt about combat log and reality, cause we all know PoM heals 5 times max. It's about wrong tooltip.

Jump 5: Player 5 healed, PoM jumps fifth time, PoM ends. ... Seriously though, if you want it to say 'healed 5 times' instead of 'jumped 5 times' that's fine. It doesn't change the meaning of the tooltip at all.

Tooltip saying PoM "JUMPS TO A PARTY OR RAID MEMBER". Tho in your opinion 5th jump jumps "NOWHERE aka to OBLIVION aka to POM graveyard". And thats the logic flaw in your opinion. PoM CAN JUMP ONLY TO PARTY OR RAID MEMBER. It can't jump NOWHERE. At least i couldnt find such an info on tooltip. Can you? If 5th jump can jump to nowhere why couldnt the 1st one? Makes no sense. Wouldn't it be easier to change tootip to 4 jumps instead of halucinating about 5th jump jumping to no man's land? And please, stop writing/arguing about combat log, we all know whats reality. Just focus on tooltip readings/meanings next time. That's the issue here, not combat log and fades.

So Owltoid was definitely right. Darkener too (nice vid). Harky and Kel were wrong. And thats the last word, end of story.
But there's a hope Blizzard will create some animation for "your" 5th PoM jump to oblivion. Like PoM flying to the skies, would be cool.

Hostile trolling gets no one anywhere. You're welcome back when you're not trying to be condescending. -- Kel

[Izzirez]

Only read the first page so far, but one thing I would like to say is if blizzard did make Echoes proc from PoM bounces and Renew tick, it would strengthen mastery for us quite a bit. I tried to stack mastery on Beta to see how it would work and I went from 13% to 17% with full mastery gems; definitely not worth it. Currently I see Echoes doing around 1-2% of my healing, but if it worked off of Renew ticks/PoM bounces/GPoH ticks, then I could see that jumping up to 4-5% on certain fights, making mastery not nearly as useless as it seems so far.

[Arrelliana]

This thread discussion reminds me about the riddle of a loaf of bread..how many times must you cut (jump) a loaf of bread to get 5 slices (heals) of bread. Alot of semantics..Imho..the jump is the heal..you place pom on the tank..it jumps/heals the tank..to the next target..the 5th jump/heal ends the spell..or you could say the initial cast is the first jump....since it jumps from your spellbook to your target.

I think it should proc echo of light also..this is staple of priest healing and misses out on a great mastery..it would be a good way to buff our output without being gamebreaking.

[HDPriest]

If I cast PoM as Disc and the crits proc DA, why on Azeroth wouldn't it proc Echo when I'm in Holy spec? Like Arrelliana said, it's a staple of Priest healing, and it's sad that it's not affected by our Mastery. I'm actually against making it work with HoTs, but activating on PoM seems fitting imo.