So what's the point of inquisition?

[Badpaladin]

Maybe somebody's seeing something I'm not, but inquisition seems pretty stupid an ability right now.

[Brashara]

I know its good for paladin tanks when they're AoE tanking. With the ridiculously low amount of Ret damage that is holy, i'm almost entirely sure i'd rather ignore it for more Templar's Verdict. Even if its a small amount of DPS increase to keep it up (which seems unfathomable to me) I'd rather just not bother with it, since TV is guaranteed damage and Inquisition is hurt by having to move.

[talitu]

hmm... its pretty much what it says on the tin boosts holy damage by 30% what part dont you get?

[Brashara]

hmm... its pretty much what it says on the tin boosts holy damage by 30% what part dont you get?

Ret does very little holy damage. He's wondering if there's a point to using it, not what it physically does.

Many retadins are complaining about feeling like warriors because of their holy damage, so its obvious one begins to wonder what the point of a holy damage increase is.

[Badpaladin]

It was an increase over TV if you were able to get 17+ seconds of use, but now that the tooltip reflects the SoT change it's evident that it'll require more than 17 seconds of use to equal a TV.

[BDF]

Leave it in, maybe devs will change it to increase holy damage AND healing done....and then make ret's mastery increase it's effectiveness by a % per point.

and then we have both a damage increase and a healing utility (without it making ret OP healing due to our limited mana pools).

and where does that leave ret pvp? Worse off, but I'd rather get the mechanics issues fixed first before we worry about how pvp affects pve and vice versa.

[Foibles]

Not too much now it seems, besides buffing HoW during wings. If it was a longer duration or refreshed by something like a 3HoPo TV it would be a lot better.

I mean, they did add Holy Shield to GBtL's WoG, so maybe the same could happen to Inquisition.

[Nillo]

Maybe somebody's seeing something I'm not, but inquisition seems pretty stupid an ability right now.

It already was from the very beginning they intruced this ability, just like Zealotry.
Chances are pretty damn high, that ret is going to suck pretty damn hard at the start of the expension (maybe not DPS wise, but rather skill-wise with quite a few of our abilities being useless)

[godofslack]

Ret does very little holy damage. He's wondering if there's a point to using it, not what it physically does.

Many retadins are complaining about feeling like warriors because of their holy damage, so its obvious one begins to wonder what the point of a holy damage increase is.

Do you even play a ret pally? http://www.youtube.com/user/tgnWorld.../2/6IGRpPbFMrM

[cFortyfive]

I am by no means an retri paladine expert but even a quick glimpse at some logs shows me that about 25% pve damage is still holy and it seems mandatory to keep it up so what exactly is the problem with it ?

[Badpaladin]

Do you even play a ret pally? http://www.youtube.com/user/tgnWorld.../2/6IGRpPbFMrM

The guy says "free Templar's Verdict", "you don't have to refresh inquisition until you're at 3HP so long as you don't use holy abilities", "use zealotry and then avenging wrath". What he reported(~50% holy damage) was only with inquisition up, meaning he only saw ~38.5% holy damage without it. Keep in mind, that number will go down quite a bit with better weapons and the t11 2pc.

I think Brashara was certainly exaggerating, but Holy Damage isn't exactly something special anymore. Definitely not what it was in 3.3.

---------- Post added 2010-11-11 at 02:31 AM ----------

I am by no means an retri paladine expert but even a quick glimpse at some logs shows me that about 25% pve damage is still holy and it seems mandatory to keep it up so what exactly is the problem with it ?

It's fucking bland, pain in the ass to keep up due to short duration and it's not much better than just using TV instead(when SoT was at 15% damage you needed 17 or more seconds of Inquisition to make it worth it, this number is down now that it's at 9%).

[godofslack]

The guy says "free Templar's Verdict", "you don't have to refresh inquisition until you're at 3HP so long as you don't use holy abilities", "use zealotry and then avenging wrath". What he reported(~50% holy damage) was only with inquisition up, meaning he only saw ~38.5% holy damage without it. Keep in mind, that number will go down quite a bit with better weapons and the t11 2pc.

I think Brashara was certainly exaggerating, but Holy Damage isn't exactly something special anymore. Definitely not what it was in 3.3.

True, but even in 359 gear it still makes up a huge amount of your damage, and it scales with gear (directly off attack power), to a lesser extent than melee, but it would still pull more DPS than the extra TV.

[Badpaladin]

Weapon-based mechanics like CS/TV/SoT/SoC scale far better with gear than AP-based meachnics. It's also a matter of spell coefficients. How good is Censure/Exo/HW/J the more gear you get? I'm too lazy to look, but I'll bet top dollar it's far less than physical scaling of TV/CS/SoT.((yes, I know I listed SoT, which is affected by Inquisition))

[Eladrin]

True, but even in 359 gear it still makes up a huge amount of your damage, and it scales with gear (directly off attack power), to a lesser extent than melee, but it would still pull more DPS than the extra TV.

I think you missed the part where it will take 17 seconds of inq w/ 15% SoT. With the change it will be like 30 seconds of inq to make up the damage from just one TV. If that is the case then inq is no longer worth hitting at all. I don't have zealotry in my spec either, because it is simply not worth it to hit that button from a DPS stand point unless something has changed the last week or so.

[Badpaladin]

I think you missed the part where it will take 17 seconds of inq w/ 15% SoT. With the change it will be like 30 seconds of inq to make up the damage from just one TV. If that is the case then inq is no longer worth hitting at all. I don't have zealotry in my spec either, because it is simply not worth it to hit that button from a DPS stand point unless something has changed the last week or so.

I still think Inquisition will be a DPS increase to use, but nothing spectacular at all. Hence is why I'm wondering why it's even there in the first place when they could just up spell coefficients. It's not like ret's mechanics are super faceroll without it to begin with.

[cFortyfive]

It's fucking bland, pain in the ass to keep up due to short duration and it's not much better than just using TV instead(when SoT was at 15% damage you needed 17 or more seconds of Inquisition to make it worth it, this number is down now that it's at 9%).

I am really not sure how something that lasts like what 30 seconds is so annoying to keep up it's about the same as slice and dice. And of course I didn't do any math on it but I it's hardly imaginable for me that a single tv every 30 seconds can outweigh the gain of the buff and if it really is that tight they probably would have been better off not going through with the last changes.

[Eladrin]

I am really not sure how something that lasts like what 30 seconds is so annoying to keep up it's about the same as slice and dice. And of course I didn't do any math on it but I it's hardly imaginable for me that a single tv every 30 seconds can outweigh the gain of the buff and if it really is that tight they probably would have been better off not going through with the last changes.

it is completely imaginable. The buff buffs two spells above 20% health: Exorcism and Seal of Truth. Go run a test dummy session and let me know how much censure and exorcism are as a total portion of damage done at 85. If I had to guess it's about 20% so your going to tell me that an extra TV every 30 seconds is less valuable than 30% of exorcism and censure damage? I'd have to math it out, but if exorcism and censure don't do like 25K each in 30 seconds you won't be outdamaging that extra TV in that time frame between the two with inq up.

[Archmage Arugal]

Perhaps you should bring up the uselessness of this ability on the official boards, since this seems more like something Blizzard hates and would change

[Foibles]

I am really not sure how something that lasts like what 30 seconds is so annoying to keep up it's about the same as slice and dice. And of course I didn't do any math on it but I it's hardly imaginable for me that a single tv every 30 seconds can outweigh the gain of the buff and if it really is that tight they probably would have been better off not going through with the last changes.

The wowhead tooltip has it at 12 seconds max. It might be wrong, but that's all I have to go on atm.

[cFortyfive]

it is completely imaginable. The buff buffs two spells above 20% health: Exorcism and Seal of Truth. Go run a test dummy session and let me know how much censure and exorcism are as a total portion of damage done at 85. If I had to guess it's about 20% so your going to tell me that an extra TV every 30 seconds is less valuable than 30% of exorcism and censure damage? I'd have to math it out, but if exorcism and censure don't do like 25K each in 30 seconds you won't be outdamaging that extra TV in that time frame between the two with inq up.

I probably try that after I can stop laughing at that male human premade paladin.