Corruption

[Tinno]

Or you could just run a sim on it and input a line that prioritizes Incinerate over Chaos Bolt if Backdraft is up. You'd find the difference in DPS at normal haste values is infinitesimal. You need to greatly exceed 1406 haste for it to be a noticeable DPS gain. Until then it just doesn't matter which you do. Hitting Chaos Bolt on cooldown is simpler and results in the same DPS. Arguing over it is pointless.

But then again, sims aren't particular accurate either, sure they're regarded that way, but sims are also random, to some extent atleast, and they only account for a perfect and optimal rotation. You will never get that in the game itself, and you need to be aware of that as well, also during a fight you will also get hero and stuff, great diminishing the value of haste during the hero. also I know for a fact that even just with imp. soul fire and backdraft I have an incin with less than 1 sec cast time, making any value of haste absolutely pointless in regards of incins vs. CB absolutely pointless within the first 20% hp in a fight, and even less with a hero, so in those times you SHOULD always be casting CB on cooldown, since that is a bigger damage cast than incin.

Without those, why even bother changing up the rotation, you would change the rotation for something that really doesn't give you anything at all except for one more thing to track.

Btw I have 1285 haste, so not even close to the 1406 haste, and tbh, it doesn't really matter much, during a hero you hardly gain anything from haste, during imp. soul fire you hardly gain anything. so it is only out of those times where you'd actually be using incin over CB during backdraft.

---------- Post added 2010-11-18 at 10:51 PM ----------

As I said, with a backdraftx3 model you never have to look at Chaos Bolt due to the timing of spells.
But as harky and myself have said before, the gain is so small that you can do whichever you want and come out equal, so pick the one that's easiest on you.

Maybe not on paper, but you will still have to watch it, to see when it goes of cooldown, to be able to cast it immediately, UNLESS it's right after a conflag, but, according to my rotation you won't always hit that point, and so you will still have to watch it.

[Takanami]

Huh, I don't understand why some people don't like keeping corruption up in the destro rotation. Call me crazy, but as a warlock, I enjoy keeping up all the dots as well as juggling the burst. I just hate it when they simplify our rotations, so I loved the changes that put corruption back in and allowed us to keep up a curse and a bane, not to mention keeping up the soul fire buff. I enjoy it... Plus the fact that our dots scale with haste is just delicious. :3

...Also don't waste a shard at the pull using soulburn>soulfire, instead hardcast it when tank counts down. ...

Actually, you don't have to hard cast or waist a shard. You can simply use the shard then Soul Harvest just before the pull and you enter combat. ;-]

[nocturnus]

Yes, Gher. It is true that the difference is marginal when simmed. What Tinno is trying to say is that adding another condition (e.g. if backdraft is up cast 3x incin, else cb) to your priority rotation just increases the chance to err in actual content. Therefore it's smarter to just pick the rotation with fewer conditions and be done with it.

Now we can all agree that the proper way to do it is to simply use CB on cooldown. Which was my point from the start.

[Tinno]

Yes, Gher. It is true that the difference is marginal when simmed. What Tinno is trying to say is that adding another condition (e.g. if backdraft is up cast 3x incin, else cb) to your priority rotation just increases the chance to err in actual content. Therefore it's smarter to just pick the rotation with fewer conditions and be done with it.

Now we can all agree that the proper way to do it is to simply use CB on cooldown. Which was my point from the start.

Thank you

[Overwelm]

"Casual" does not mean you're restricted to only doing normal content. You're not forbidden to raid heroics.

Who are you to assume his server doesn't have awesome PuGs?

The definition of casual and hardcore could be debated for long hours - and it has been - but it is not one we'll take today.

Don't want to further in flame the issue, but I consider casual a raider who's raiding times are easily made, basically time he/she wouldn't be using for something more productive persay. If you have free time 3 days a week from 7-10 and raid then, I consider that casual. Hardcore would be making time for that raid. Just my opinion.

Shouldn't be casting chaosbolt from backdraft cast 3 x incinerate then chaosbolt. Also don't waste a shard at the pull using soulburn>soulfire, instead hardcast it when tank counts down. Use minion doom gaurd for solo target infernal for multiple targets with heroism and a pot if possible.

Oh ignore me, I don't run numbers nearly enough.

[Dethh]

Tracking backdraft is easy, for anyone who thinks about Molten Core.

Your test needs to be exactly the same duration to be valid, and over 5 minutes or so to balance things out.

Don't forget ISP it will be up and does make a difference.

---------- Post added 2010-11-19 at 05:55 PM ----------

Actually, you don't have to hard cast or waist a shard. You can simply use the shard then Soul Harvest just before the pull and you enter combat. ;-]

That would take to much time and you could mess up your pre pot alot of things could go wrong. Plus if the tank doesnt pull or something now they have to wait for the warlocks cooldown to reset just doesn't make sense but if it works for you go for it imo. Just not practical.

[harky]

But then again, sims aren't particular accurate either, sure they're regarded that way, but sims are also random, to some extent atleast, and they only account for a perfect and optimal rotation. You will never get that in the game itself, and you need to be aware of that as well, also during a fight you will also get hero and stuff, great diminishing the value of haste during the hero.

Just replying to this because it's so, so inaccurate. Sims are sometimes off slightly, yes, but being slightly off and not being 'particularly accurate' is very different. None of this is really accurate... Sims are off slightly mostly when the abilities are being miscalculated, which generally gets fixed quickly. A properly configured sim will always be taking proper buffs into the equation, so claiming that it doesn't reflect BL/Heroism is silly. The other common misconception is that you can't beat the output of something like Simcraft. You can. Even on Patchwerk with all the settings exactly right. It's why Demo is actually much worse than sims make it seem. People are looking at the DPS average and not the DPS spread at all.

If you look at any top log and compare to simmed output you'll find that they're normally well over what those characters would sim at. Good luck on procs, good luck on crits, etc will push you higher up. This is because it's exceptionally unlikely to ever get your DPS average on a single fight. It's also extremely rare, when playing well, to get a DPS result outside of the DPS spread. So no, I understand sims very well and why they serve the community so well. It's all about sample size. You could run a full raid night one way and a full raid night another way. That's a sample size of 13 per configuration, with each fight only serving as an individual sample. The sample size is miniscule. The likelihood of procs, crits, etc all lining up in the same manner in two fights is virtually nil. That's part of why Afflic and Destro sims are 10,000 iterations, but Demo needs 20-30k before it normalizes in output.

Point being sims less inaccurate because they're random. They're less accurate because they're less random. It's also why they're more important as a tool than simply comparing logs without a constant.

[nocturnus]

Point being sims less inaccurate because they're random. They're less accurate because they're less random. It's also why they're more important as a tool than simply comparing logs without a constant.

Just thought I'd stress the quoted since many people get confused or make incorrect assumptions because they compared logs without having analyzed them.