Medivh what a freakin tard...

[Zatheyll]

Hmm but if Medivh never did what he did, the wars would never have happend, the orcs would have never left draenor... that doesnt seem so bad..

The whole cavern of time creeps me out tbh.. And the dragons seemse so unwilling to give us answers.. They just: do that, or its game over for us all.. Saving Thrall from durnholde keep was epic, and Thrall is badass, but near the end the whole dragon shit gave me chills, and then wiping out their memories.. crap..

Basically, every scenario in CoT would doom Azeroth if the Infinite Dragonflight succeeded.

Escape from Durnholde Keep - If Thrall remained imprisoned, the horde would never recover and ally with the Alliance and Night Elves against the Burning Legion
Opening the Dark Portal - With no orc invasion, there would be no Alliance as it was created for the purpose of driving back the invaders. The humans would just fight amongs themselves, weakening them too much to be a threat to the Burning Legion, as already mentioned.
Culling of Stratholme - If Arthas was killed during the culling, neither the Night Elves(through Illidan) or Ner'zhul would gain the advantage over the Burning Legion.

The only oddball is the Battle for Mount Hyjal, as there's little to no influence from the Infinite Dragonflight. You're mainly just reliving the final mission of Reign of Chaos.

You want to know my take on the story? Nozdormu actually controls the Infinite Dragonflight, and as he is master of time, he knows how everything will end, he just CAN'T TELL anyone, and he is everywhere at once. I think he is sending the Infinite Dragonflight back in time to screw with time to SAVE the world, and the Bronze Dragonflight are enlisting us to FIGHT the Infinite Dragonflight. Nozdormu is battling with his own flight in a way. So, we are basically screwing ourselves over. That's what I think anyways, would create a very interesting turn of events.

[Forsedar]

First of all, how would the legion find their way to azeroth without the portal?

In an all open war alliance vs horde, the alliance would win pretty comfortable. The alliance has a better military, tactics, boats, weapons, technology and the list goes on.

With no orcs in azeroth, important lives from the wars would still live, and things would been better, for the alliance.
Im not an alliance fanboy, i like the horde, but The alliance is some lvls above the horde when it comes to this.

Without the horde, the alliance wouldn't really be an alliance. There would be disputes within each other over land, minerals, etc.

[Honeybadger]

Please dont get me wrong, i like the horde lore.. Im just saying that the alliance has a bigger and more organized military. Tactical advantage etc.
Infact Thrall might be my favorite wow character inline with Sylvanas and Arthas.

No one could have known what would have happend if the orcs dident invade azeroth.

How can you say that? Have you seen the Hordes military in Durotar and Azhara (the huge goblin cannon).

Alliance on the other hand has never stood as good as they are now, with all factions backing eachother.

Noticed any changes in Ironforge lately? Would have to say the alliance are having some political problems there.

It's hard to take your arguments seriously dude, seems like you have no knowledge of Warcraft lore etc...

[Davrun]

You want to know my take on the story? Nozdormu actually controls the Infinite Dragonflight, and as he is master of time, he knows how everything will end, he just CAN'T TELL anyone, and he is everywhere at once. I think he is sending the Infinite Dragonflight back in time to screw with time to SAVE the world, and the Bronze Dragonflight are enlisting us to FIGHT the Infinite Dragonflight. Nozdormu is battling with his own flight in a way. So, we are basically screwing ourselves over. That's what I think anyways, would create a very interesting turn of events.

Cool theory

---------- Post added 2010-12-03 at 05:45 AM ----------

How can you say that? Have you seen the Hordes military in Durotar and Azhara (the huge goblin cannon).
...

I have. Goblin technoloy is decent, but its not perfect, the failure rate is big, and the canon in azhara might backfire, and blow lets say ogrimmar instead of its intended target. You cant argue with this..

Also if u take a look off the shores of barrens you see heavily armed alliance boats surrending the barrens, incase something happen, lets say they decide to nuke stormwind, those boats are ready to sail in and take ogrimmar.

[Honeybadger]

Cool theory

---------- Post added 2010-12-03 at 05:45 AM ----------



I have. Goblin technoloy is decent, but its not perfect, the failure rate is big, and the canon in azhara might backfire, and blow lets say ogrimmar instead of its intended target. You cant argue with this..

Also if u take a look off the shores of barrens you see heavily armed alliance boats surrending the barrens, incase something happen, lets say they decide to nuke stormwind, those boats are ready to sail in and take ogrimmar.

You do know there is a huge Horde defense line all along the coast there. Theramore got a nice offensive against the Horde in Southern Barrens, but in the end those ships wouldn't be able to just "sail in and take Orgrimmar".

[Duncanîdaho]

Also if u take a look off the shores of barrens you see heavily armed alliance boats surrending the barrens, incase something happen, lets say they decide to nuke stormwind, those boats are ready to sail in and take ogrimmar.

Org has no harbor.... the mountains block it from the sea, its part of the reason its built there. Only way in is flying, or through the gates.

Anyway, this threads so far off topic now... and your original posts have been answered.

[Jadora]

Excuse me? The alliance aka the humans have won all the wars against the orcs. The orcs come and they die.
But lets stop talking about the past. Even now the alliance is far far supreme then the horde.

On horde side, the most beloved person has left them( Thrall), a idiot leader with an iq of 50 is leading them, but it doesnt stop there.. Garrosh exiles Voljin one of Thralls closest friends out of ogrimmar, he kills Cairne, and tbh the whole horde is not a unit of allies atm, just 6 faction that stays togheter just because they have nowhere else to go, THEY are WEAK.

Alliance on the other hand has never stood as good as they are now, with all factions backing each other.

Not even going to touch the fanaticism of the first part.

You are wrong about the unified horde, which you would know if you read the shattering.

[Rugz]

Why did the Orcs drink the blood? Because the agents of the Burning Legion told the Orcs that the Draenei were going to wage war on them, and the orcs submitted in return for protection. They "made a deal with the devil, Jimmy." Before the Burning Legion tricked them, the Orcs and Draenei were at an uneasy peace, I believe. I'm sure Darkside will correct me if I'm wrong :P

If I recall, the peace between the Draenei and Orcs pre-demon was pretty stable, they had trade relations and the orcs also taught the Draenei the art of shamanism(?). The Draenei were so decimated by the orc attack because they were completely unprepared (also they were no physical match for the bloodcrazed orcs)

[Coress]

You want to know my take on the story? Nozdormu actually controls the Infinite Dragonflight, and as he is master of time, he knows how everything will end, he just CAN'T TELL anyone, and he is everywhere at once. I think he is sending the Infinite Dragonflight back in time to screw with time to SAVE the world, and the Bronze Dragonflight are enlisting us to FIGHT the Infinite Dragonflight. Nozdormu is battling with his own flight in a way. So, we are basically screwing ourselves over. That's what I think anyways, would create a very interesting turn of events.

In the sundering I believe it was, or maybe it was the demon soul, Nozdormu says to Krasus and Rhonin that he understands what it is like, being able to know the future and do nothing about it. Also when krasus is put back in time, he says that he saw Nozdormu fighting to keep the rift stable, and i forget the quote but he said that all the Nozdormus, of every time period are fighting the rift, so essentially Nozormu is everywhere at once. Your theory has a lot to back it up. Also nice portrait ;o

[pickley]

I just did black morass, yeah i know im 4 years late, anyways Medivh was the reason why orcs came to azeroth?? freakin tard... opening the portal for them.. whats his deal anyway? isent he human? why would he do such a thing..

He was possessed by Sargeras at the time.
After he was killed (And revived) He was purely Medivh. When he had his mind straight he decided to try and right the wrongs he caused while possessed. (So, when he lead Jaina to Theramore, and Thrall to Durotar he was in his right mind)

[stpat]

dear op wowpedia is a great tool to use before you make a useless thread

[unholyskipper]

No, the wars wouldnt have started. But the world wouldnt have lived that much longer anyway. Im not kidding, the legion would have just steamrolled over everything if it werent for medivh opening the dark portal

I wouldnt stay steamrolled i saw the turning points of the war were the night elves
The rest of the alliance were much more involved than the horde were at the time.
But yes i believe we lose without medivhs actions

[Space Troll]

Cool theory

---------- Post added 2010-12-03 at 05:45 AM ----------

This guy is a major troll.

Cool theory? Nozdormu knows all that is and all that will ever be - up until his death that is. This includes alternate timelines and you can't say it doesn't. We actively prevent several break off points of timeshifts.

[Torahn]

This guy is a major troll.

Sums up this thread. I'm just gonna sit here with my cookie and watch.

[Braven]

he was possessed, duh

[Spartenjak]

You want to know my take on the story? Nozdormu actually controls the Infinite Dragonflight, and as he is master of time, he knows how everything will end, he just CAN'T TELL anyone, and he is everywhere at once. I think he is sending the Infinite Dragonflight back in time to screw with time to SAVE the world, and the Bronze Dragonflight are enlisting us to FIGHT the Infinite Dragonflight. Nozdormu is battling with his own flight in a way. So, we are basically screwing ourselves over. That's what I think anyways, would create a very interesting turn of events.

This is a pretty common theory. I actually had it for quite awhile and decided to do some research. Check out the article on the infinite dragonflight, its a pretty interesting read. It seems to me that Nozdormu has been corrupted by something. In every instance that contains the infinite dragonflight they are attempting to do something that would in the end benefit the burning legion and thus would cause the destruction of the races of azeroth. Something could also be causing Nozdormu to simply believe that its the best thing for azeroth, which can be seen as something beneficial in a certain light, much like Malygos' attempt to usurp magic from the mortal races.

OT: Medivh was possessed by Sargeras and he wished to unleash the blood crazed horde upon azeroth.

[Copain]

Yeah i read somewhere that he has alittle sargeras blood in him, why would the humans let him live? They should have known what he was capable of.. And why the f.. do we help him succeed in black morass....

Because Medivh was the strongest person in all of Azeroth? He was THE GUARDIAN. His mother took on entire demon hordes including Sargeras with a few flickers of her hands.

[Ralamus]

speaking of which, why does the Infinite dragonflight wanna mess with the timeline so bad?

[Jaitee]

As others said, the Orcs were mind-controlled AFTER drinking Mannoroth's blood. When Grom and Thrall killed Mannoroth, the Orcs were freed.

Why did the Orcs drink the blood? Because the agents of the Burning Legion told the Orcs that the Draenei were going to wage war on them, and the orcs submitted in return for protection. They "made a deal with the devil, Jimmy." Before the Burning Legion tricked them, the Orcs and Draenei were at an uneasy peace, I believe. I'm sure Darkside will correct me if I'm wrong :P

the orcs didnt know about the burning legion though, kiljadean pretended to be their ancestors spirits and told them the draeni where preparing to attack (the orcs where very shamanistic and listened to what their ancestors said) then said here quick drink this itll give you the power to stop them! after they drank that demonic blood it fast become a massive orgy of violence and power with the orcs unable to stop themself. the second time they drank it was when the nelfs and cenarius where attacking them and grom drank more demon blood he then went on a rampage killed a demigod and one shotted a pit lord before dieing undefeated.

i do wonder what would have happened if the draeni had warned the orcs that that a guy whos title is "the deceiver" is coming for them

[Torahn]

This thread makes my head hurt with all the bad lore in it.

Medivh was the child of Aegwynn and Aran. Sargeras was hiding a part of himself within Aegwynn, and possessed Medivh before birth. Medivh, while possessed, opened the dark portal with the help of Gul'dan. And the rest is history.

Any arguments on whether we'd be in worse/better shape now is useless.