We do like harder content!

[Deleted]

Hard = exciting.

Can't wait to dungeon-farm my way to 85 with my guildies! Maybe we'll finally wipe! yaaaay! (And no, I'm not being sarcastic.)

[Naturae]

this, lol. i love all the complaining, despite the fact wotlk had a lot of the hardest fights in WoW history. sure everyone has them now, but link the ach when the content was current.

who cares if dungeons become a face roll over time.. as long as there is hard content in raids people should be happy.

itd be nice if blizzard released some 5 mans over time with hard difficulty until we outgear it though.

difficult content is only fun until you've mastered it. then it's not fun if you're wiping on it anymore. i think myself, and many others found it quite enjoyable to be able to take a fresh 80 alt into faceroll heroics and get gear relatively quickly to be raid ready. as long as heroic 5 mans are challenging at first, and raid content is also very challenging. i'll be a happy cataclysmer.

I think the consensus is that, because only 1 fight per raid was hard, everything seemed way too easy. H Anub, Alone in the Darkness, and H LK were hard fights...but how were the casuals who may have joined raiding guilds supposed to know that it would get so difficult when every other fight in the raid was faceroll. Everything before the hardmode of all the last boss is way too easy. WotLK was pure fail imo. Sure, everyone got to see content...w00t but nobody could complete it...they just got teased with the fact that each of the final bosses on hardmode were right in front of them but unkillable for their guilds.

[Algore]

Like they did in WotlK. Nerfing the HP of every boss in heroics, removing trashpacks, removing abilities, removing mechanics

What abilites, which bosses hp got nerfed? Can you please tell which ones got "nerfed".

Or are you just spitting out random stuff?

[Nexxia]

this, lol. i love all the complaining, despite the fact wotlk had a lot of the hardest fights in WoW history. sure everyone has them now, but link the ach when the content was current.

who cares if dungeons become a face roll over time.. as long as there is hard content in raids people should be happy.

itd be nice if blizzard released some 5 mans over time with hard difficulty until we outgear it though.


difficult content is only fun until you've mastered it. then it's not fun if you're wiping on it anymore. i think myself, and many others found it quite enjoyable to be able to take a fresh 80 alt into faceroll heroics and get gear relatively quickly to be raid ready. as long as heroic 5 mans are challenging at first, and raid content is also very challenging. i'll be a happy cataclysmer.

The thing is WotLK heroics and dungeons were easy day one, I played the whole xpac minus a break of a couple months. Was in the dungeons asap, did all the raids with the exception of full Ulduar as I was moving at the time this was top tier. Tried to get groups to go for achieves, the hardest part of that raid was keeping people in it til the end. The entire design of cata is from the approach of fixing some of the things that were problems in wotlk, heroic difficulty level, lack of variety in raids (or them being so long you burn out before a complete in one session), gearing being too easy, to name a few. I played on beta and ill be very sad if they nerf, but what would be the point of changing dungeon design to that of a 5 man HM raid, and stepping up raid difficulty if you were just going to nerf it? Even though down the road toward the end of the xpac, any really hard content will get nerfed to give casuals more access. That always happens and who cares. And remember when criticizing people for lack of completing X that there are alot of factors involved, this isnt a single player game.

[Vasti]

then to counter the QQ on blizz forums, spam bliz forums with millions of threads saying how gratefull you are for ahrder content, spamm it so much, that the first QQ post is on page 30!

[Mongoose19]

Every QQing player that wants harder content speaks for 10 of his kind

Every QQing casual that wants everything nerfed so he can AoE and stand in fire speaks for 100 of his kind


Now do the math and see for who will Blizz cater.

[Redblade]

I think the consensus is that, because only 1 fight per raid was hard, everything seemed way too easy. H Anub, Alone in the Darkness, and H LK were hard fights...but how were the casuals who may have joined raiding guilds supposed to know that it would get so difficult when every other fight in the raid was faceroll. Everything before the hardmode of all the last boss is way too easy. WotLK was pure fail imo. Sure, everyone got to see content...w00t but nobody could complete it...they just got teased with the fact that each of the final bosses on hardmode were right in front of them but unkillable for their guilds.

Blizz shuld have left heroic ICC alone. No buff, no nerfs and no gateing, a retune of LK would have been needed but besides that it would have been an allright instance. In the long run this is what shuld be done with all raids if Blizz is to keep with the philosophy that everyone shuld get to see the content, make normal mode so the general population can get throu it, nerf it over time if need be, just leave the heroic mode to the people who really want a challenge.

[Algore]

Every QQing player that wants harder content speaks for 10 of his kind

Every QQing casual that wants everything nerfed so he can AoE and stand in fire speaks for 100 of his kind


Now do the math and see for who will Blizz cater.

Just because you are casual doesnt make you a bad player, learn to differ a Casual between someone who are "bad".

[mysticx]

Quite honestly the biggest tidal-wave of whining right now is the QQ-aclysm of "WotLK was too easy! We want hard content NOW and will quit if it gets nerfed!", i understand the sentiment mind you (Did half of UK heroic without a tank in the group today, so yeah a bit undertuned even for 3 tiers later), but stating that "whining causes nerfs" and employing what i can only call an "out-whine the whiners"-strategy by flooding the MMO-champion forums (Which no Blizz employee ever even hinted at reading :P ) with this sort of threads is just outright annoying as well as pointless...

[Nexxia]

Blizzard now has enough money it wouldnt matter if they made another dollar, sort of like Bill Gates. And since when has making a game a mindnumbly easy process sold games? I remember growing up with atari 2600 onward and the games you could beat in a day or a few hours were extremely disappointing. Name one game outside of childrens games that was easy that sold any units? Resident Evil? I dont remember that being easy and it sold quite well I recall. Actually now that I think of it the top selling games of all time were some of the more difficult, Metroid?

[archelios]

Hmm...if QQ gets Blizzard down..shouldn't we see rock hard raids and heroics in Cataclysm, because the amount of "We want harder content, LK was faceroll" topics are a wave of QQ to match any tidalwave? In fact, there are much more "Gief harder content NAU" topics than "PLX NERF!" topics.

People love to brag how much they want real hard stuff...strange that most guilds broke up over said hard content (hint, Muru, hint)

M'uru was a fantastic boss, I loved wiping endlessly on him. Challenges make things fun. Why do people play chess or risk? Because they like the challenge and thought required to achieve victory

[Nexxia]

Doom Lord Kazzak O.o zomg lol healers healing the healers.

[Algore]

Well, Blizzard did infact remove one trashpack before General Vexx and you could say they nerfed the trashpacks in the room before XT. Ofc pulling one pack and the other joining could be considered a bug, but hey..crying "NERF" sounds cooler.

When people are alone in their chamber, they are probably quite pleased with changes like that...but you cannot admit to that openly.



---------- Post added 2010-12-05 at 06:00 PM ----------



Oh, I didn't say he was bad or anything. But since you named chess...yeah..lots of people play it and not all of them are Kasparovs.

Thrash packs? That's it? You are seriously telling me that whenever you remove a pack inside an raid you automatically nerf the whole raid? The reason they removed the thrash packs was not because they were hard(they were quite hard anyways if you didnt sheep/trap) but the fear could stir up some problems which was just annoying.

Thrash before XT got nerfed? I might as well just rest my case since you obviously don't know what really got nerfed except "Thrash Packs" Seriously grow a pair.

[Garkanh]

i do want harder content, i really do.

but a lot of people seems to not see the defirence between hard(er), and time consuming content.

i do not want tons of trash packs to kill, before i get to a boss. i don't mind a few, and cc is a good thing in the trash there is. but i do not have the time nor patience to do trash mobs for hours a day. i used to have that. but with a 40 hours work week, and a lot of stuff to do at home, i don't any longer.

people seem to think, that a dungeon run should take an hour. is an hour challenging? more challenging than a 30 minutes run? even if the bosses takes 15 minutes in both runs, i do not think those last 30 that is the defirence between the runs, is what makes the run hard. but they do make it time consuming. am i a casual? perhaps. that just means i got a life.


give us harder bosses, but less trash. make the trash be hard, but not time consuming. unless you die ofcourse. then it will always be time consuming.

[Trispec]

Hard = exciting.

Can't wait to dungeon-farm my way to 85 with my guildies! Maybe we'll finally wipe! yaaaay! (And no, I'm not being sarcastic.)

I don't understand why people want to wipe, I know we will wipe while learning some new content, but for gods sake how does happiness come from repeated death from bosses?

[Osmeric]

Actually, most players don't like hard content. This is demonstrated by the stats Blizzard collects. Chilton commented on this when they upped the difficulty going from Naxx to Ulduar. He said that (contrary to what you might have expected from the "Naxx is too easy" QQ) there was a "huge" decline in raid participation.

Or compare the number of guilds on the tracking sites that did ToC vs. ToGC. Most guilds stopped at Anub normal.

ICC was much harder, and the only reason most guilds cleared it was they did LK 10 at 30% buff with gear from ICC 25. If ICC had been tuned as it was and 10/25 had the same gear most would not have cleared it.

Your average player has a low tolerance for wipes and frustration. Make the content challenging and they won't step up, they'll start skipping raids, or just /gquit with great drama. I expect lots of unexceptional guilds to die violently once Cata end game is in full swing.

[Algore]

i do want harder content, i really do.

but a lot of people seems to not see the defirence between hard(er), and time consuming content.

i do not want tons of trash packs to kill, before i get to a boss. i don't mind a few, and cc is a good thing in the trash there is. but i do not have the time nor patience to do trash mobs for hours a day. i used to have that. but with a 40 hours work week, and a lot of stuff to do at home, i don't any longer.

people seem to think, that a dungeon run should take an hour. is an hour challenging? more challenging than a 30 minutes run? even if the bosses takes 15 minutes in both runs, i do not think those last 30 that is the defirence between the runs, is what makes the run hard. but they do make it time consuming. am i a casual? perhaps. that just means i got a life.


give us harder bosses, but less trash. make the trash be hard, but not time consuming. unless you die ofcourse. then it will always be time consuming.

Exactly what Im thinking, I hate thrash, and it's not because its hard or you have to use CC abilites nonsense, it's because they are so time consuming and boring when you have done them 100x times already.

If you want harder content(lol why?) Dont hate on the thrash or the "cc" usage, hate on the bosses...but I dont see any reason to hate on wotlk bosses since they all were good in their own way.

[Nexxia]

I like games that make me think, the old Ultima series (I-III) always comes to mind. You actually had to converse with npcs, and ask the right questions to get clues. Mind searing puzzles, to even cast a spell you had to have the correct reagents prepared, etc. I was quite pleasantly surprised they actually put some mild brain teasers in the cata quests, tho they arent on the level of things in Ultima (a game from 20 years ago) The mindless grind of WotlK even killed the fun of making an alt, it was like an assembly line churning out autos.

[Deleted]

I think i speak for most of the people here when I say that Harder is Better!

[Culexus]

Hey!

I am abit worried, together with alot others, that Blizzard will nerf Cata Heroics and Raids alot after a few weeks. If to many baddies (not casuals!) QQ cause they don't want to move out of the fire, I guess Blizz might do this. Therefore I think we need to give them the positive feedback aswell!
I'm pretty sure I will like it tougher. I loved that in TBC. And if this is the case, I'm gonna show Blizzard that. If there's only whining, they might nerf. But if there's alot of positive feedback aswell, I guess they won't. So all who wants the Cataclysm content to stay as hard as it is, show it! Show Blizzard that we like it so we don't end up in another AOE-fest!

Blizzard did nerf instances after a couple weeks/month since release. Get over it. Its not that this is a new concept. Sure they will do that with the cata heroics after some time has passed.