Shieldbash CD

[Deleted]

So Hello!
In the next balancing patch Paladins get their interrupt as a baseline spell, which is good if you ask me. (Because I havent seen many Paladins interrupt just now even if the had it talented I hope they get the hang of a off-GCD interrupt soon enough.)
Next step would be to give bears the ability to interrupt, preferably on a CD after turning into a bear so that cats cant instashiftinterrupt for it.

Now heres my question:
Do you also often get into the situation where the interrupt timer of 12 seconds conflicts with the spell timer of a mob ability (10sec)?
I noticed it yesterday after tanking with my warrior again. Ive been playing my heal shaman and with an untalented 6 second interrupt Im sometimes even capable of interrupting 2 mobs at the same time.
When it comes to interruptlocking Im pretty sure raid relevant mechanics work so we get by the 12 seconds but it really is annoying to have the CD finish when a mob is at 90% castbar -> lag -> cast + late interrupt.

Now I see that a 10 second CD would not work since we actually have a silence tied to the ability which is great for pre-interrupting (when gathering mobs) and wonderful in pvp. But I still feel that a 10sec CD is more than enough times needed (again I have no raid experience).

So another two questions:
a) how do you feel about our 12 second interrupt against the standard 10 seconds of melees and now Pala/DK tank?
b) what would be your solution with the silence mechanic if you agree that 12seconds sometimes is a problem?


My solution would be to simply make the silence part have an internal 12 second CD. It requires more brains on part of the warrior if he wants to rely on it because you cant nonstop-bash around and expect a silence every time.
We are pretty damn powerful in pvp already when we're focused by people and have enough healers around (6sec spellreflect, 2 silences, 4 stuns, shieldwall for allies, etc.) so that might become an issue.

[Deleted]

In the next balancing patch Paladins get their interrupt as a baseline spell, which is good if you ask me. (Because I havent seen many Paladins interrupt just now even if the had it talented I hope they get the hang of a off-GCD interrupt soon enough.)
Next step would be to give bears the ability to interrupt, preferably on a CD after turning into a bear so that cats cant instashiftinterrupt for it.

This is the part where diversity makes this game great; we actually have a retri pala contributing to interrupts quite frequently. He is indeed one of our more reliable interrupters. On the bears, don't they already have an interrupt? I could swear looking into it back in ICC, where druids of all flavors, if they got pulled into Frostmourne, had to build a macro to quickly jump into bear form and interrupt the mob inside.

a) how do you feel about our 12 second interrupt against the standard 10 seconds of melees and now Pala/DK tank?

I wouldn't call this a problem tbh. I think it is even an intended mechanic on Blizzard's part. First, most interrupts are standard 10 seconds, which is good. Helps out with balancing issues on both pve and pvp. The fact that you, most likely, need two interrupters on a single ability adds a layer of challenge to it because otherwise you would just have the tank solo the interrupting and the mechanic would pretty much be nullified. By needing two, you demand that the two players are able to coordinate their abilities, through vent or macros (however you see fit), and it is immediately a larger concern, as it should be.

[xebtria]

the spell lock for an interrupt is always the interrupt's cd divided by 2. so we get a 6 second spelllock wenn we interrupt while pala/druid/dk tanks/rogues have only a 5 second lock, and shamans only have a 3 second lock. Sure, it can be balanced and made to 10 seconds as well (because blizz likes everything being equal), but I'm quite fine as it is.

[domzai]

the spell lock for an interrupt is always the interrupt's cd divided by 2. so we get a 6 second spelllock wenn we interrupt while pala/druid/dk tanks/rogues have only a 5 second lock, and shamans only have a 3 second lock. Sure, it can be balanced and made to 10 seconds as well (because blizz likes everything being equal), but I'm quite fine as it is.

You should probably do some research before posting crap.

Wind Shear: 6s CD | 2s lockout
Shield Bash: 12s CD | 6s lockout
Pummel: 10s CD | 4s lockout
Kick: 10s CD | 5s lockout
Mind Freeze: 10s CD | 4s lockout
Rebuke: 10s CD | 4s lockout
Skull Bash (bear&cat): 10s CD | 5s lockout
Counterspell: 24s CD | 8s lockout

[pomop]

You should probably do some research before posting crap.

Wind Shear: 6s CD | 2s lockout
Shield Bash: 12s CD | 6s lockout
Pummel: 10s CD | 4s lockout
Kick: 10s CD | 5s lockout
Mind Freeze: 10s CD | 4s lockout
Rebuke: 10s CD | 4s lockout
Skull Bash (bear&cat): 10s CD | 5s lockout
Counterspell: 24s CD | 8s lockout

This is a forum of people speaking with eachother, not elitist jerks. Clearly he was misinformed, no need to be rude about it.

On topic - I wouldn't mind SB being lower, but it seems good at the moment. If it's mandatory that the spell be interrupted and the other 9 people have their interrupt on cooldown somehow, you can always hop into battle stance and pummel.

[lumpheed]

Don't forget, we also have Spell Reflect. Not much use against an AoE or channeled spell like Arcane Missiles, but still very useful, and VERY satisfying to use.

I generally run as Arms and if we are a bit short of CC in an instance I can quite easily strap on a shield and tank a caster using Shield Bash, Spell Reflect and Throwdown.

[Deleted]

As I said I dont know raiddesign to date. I remember mobs in the past needing 2 people interrupting them and you wouldnt want a warriortank doing it because he would already be too late for his second interrupt. The spelllockout only works chained if the mob only has one type of spell. Im coming from Jaraxxus here. He pops into mind when Im thinking about constant interrupts from a tank. with 12 seconds you would start to lose time and on your third interrupt you had a rogue jump away from a portal to kick him. Then you were good for the next two again.

Spelllocking also works differently on boss mobs (often enough).

As far as im concerned bears only have a 1min CD interrupt (skullbash was it?) It is longer than counterspell from mage.

Its not only about spelllocking one mob. Imagine you had 2 mobs that have combined 22 seconds cast times to interrupt. So lets say one spawns you interrupt his first cast and his next is in 22 seconds. then another one pops up and you interrupt him so that youre still 1-2 seconds on CD when the next mob is due to cast. Yes you will want to have a DPS watch out for it too but if a tank can do that solo -> DK or pala > warrior.

Another thing popped into my mind. Warriors and DKs usually are low on rage/runicpower. Palas are low on mana but rebuke needs next to no mana. I get shitloads of dmg at times but I dont have enough rage to interrupt because I waste 50% of my max resources in one GCD (HS+SS) and yet you got no rage from 50k hits. I find myself doing less aggro just to have the rage to interrupt. Have any of you encountered this?

[Snared]

Can't say I have ever lost aggro saving rage for an interrupt....

[CaspianRoach]

On the bears, don't they already have an interrupt? I could swear looking into it back in ICC, where druids of all flavors, if they got pulled into Frostmourne, had to build a macro to quickly jump into bear form and interrupt the mob inside.

Bears had their interrupt tied up into Feral Charge. They also could just stun the ghost with Bash in bear form.

But yeah, now that they have Skull Bash (interrupt+minicharge), Feral Charge no longer interrupts. It still roots for 3 seconds though.

[Deleted]

Can't say I have ever lost aggro saving rage for an interrupt....

It really depends on what situation you are in. If a freshly spawned add shows up and you want a quick HS+SS on it to NOT lose aggro then you just might be out of rage for the interrupt ^^ It hasnt had that much of an impact on me but in the end it does feel stupid to push a button every second GCD because you want to have enough rage just to be sure.
"un"lucky avoid chain and you have no rage

[Powell]

our 12sec CD is fine. Interrupt + silence, in addition to our other silence on a 30sec cooldown. Ofcourse heroic Throw, nor does the silence really apply to boss fights, but in my opinion warriors already have plenty of control to negate a 12sec CD on Shield Bash, not to mention almost everyone has or gets a reliable interrupt, so you should not be the only person on the interrupt list.
unlike paladins we have spellreflect, most direct spells are reflectable with some exceptions.

[Deleted]

Im coming from Jaraxxus here. He pops into mind when Im thinking about constant interrupts from a tank. with 12 seconds you would start to lose time and on your third interrupt you had a rogue jump away from a portal to kick him. Then you were good for the next two again.

I tanked ToC back when my main was a DK and I could solo those interrupts from start to finish. Runic power then, the way it worked, if I did not keep an eye on it, I could miss an interrupt if I spent it too eagerly but it wasn't a big deal keeping up with it. I certainly did not have any threat issues on that fight. Frankly, the interrupting was the only mechanic I had to keep my mind on, otherwise was simple tank&spank. Don't remember what the timer on Jaraxxus was but pretty sure DK interrupt was 10 sec CD, even back then.

Another thing popped into my mind. Warriors and DKs usually are low on rage/runicpower. Palas are low on mana but rebuke needs next to no mana. I get shitloads of dmg at times but I dont have enough rage to interrupt because I waste 50% of my max resources in one GCD (HS+SS) and yet you got no rage from 50k hits. I find myself doing less aggro just to have the rage to interrupt. Have any of you encountered this?

I'm going to have to conclude the same as Snared did; rage is never an issues in Cataclysm content. I can go on, smash my buttons as soon as they come off CD and still manage to hit every interrupt on my schedule. Omnotron is a good example of a pull, where you need to interrupt almost immediately, if you have Arcanotron as the first mob, but even on that, I always have enough rage to hit my interrupt without holding back on my pull rotation. In fact, most of the time I'm the only person in position to catch the first interrupt, so if a tank finds himself compromising his snap aggro for the interrupt, it is something he has to work on because it is fairly important.

I haven't tanked with my DK in Cata, so I can't speak much for how RP works nowadays but for a warrior, you should have plenty of rage for everything you want to do. It's a reason I always advice against tanks speccing into Drums of War. I enjoyed the similar talent for my DK in ICC, but in current content, it is a waste of points.

[Deleted]

Not much use against an AoE or channeled spell like Arcane Missiles

Wha? Reflecting Arcane Missiles is probably the most epic thing you can do in PvP against an Arcane Mage since if you time it right the person you reflect eats much more than 1 hit of them.

OT: I've never had an issue with the cd, I would LOVE for it to be shorter, but honestly there's other people with better interrupts and who actually have the hit rating to not miss it every once in a while. I just let them do their job and standby if they mess up =]

[Deleted]

I tanked ToC back when my main was a DK and I could solo those interrupts from start to finish. Runic power then, the way it worked, if I did not keep an eye on it, I could miss an interrupt if I spent it too eagerly but it wasn't a big deal keeping up with it. I certainly did not have any threat issues on that fight. Frankly, the interrupting was the only mechanic I had to keep my mind on, otherwise was simple tank&spank. Don't remember what the timer on Jaraxxus was but pretty sure DK interrupt was 10 sec CD, even back then.

my point exactly, warriors have 12 seconds on their interrupt making it a close call when you wanted to lock jaraxxus as WARRIOR. DK thus being better.

I'm going to have to conclude the same as Snared did; rage is never an issues in Cataclysm content. I can go on, smash my buttons as soon as they come off CD and still manage to hit every interrupt on my schedule. Omnotron is a good example of a pull, where you need to interrupt almost immediately, if you have Arcanotron as the first mob, but even on that, I always have enough rage to hit my interrupt without holding back on my pull rotation.

I haven't tanked with my DK in Cata, so I can't speak much for how RP works nowadays but for a warrior, you should have plenty of rage for everything you want to do. It's a reason I always advice against tanks speccing into Drums of War. I enjoyed the similar talent for my DK in ICC, but in current content, it is a waste of points.

As a tank I do not spec into drums of war. probably never would I would rather sit there and feel the pain of not pushing buttons. but then again you said rage is no issue, ill just have to take your word on this one.
I can only remember in ICC that at times dmg was so incredibly low that I actually pressed my X to get a crit when a pull was made because the DPS had their resources whereas I did not. interrupting was something i really had to watch out for. glad it seems to have changed

[shadowkras]

I tanked ToC back when my main was a DK and I could solo those interrupts from start to finish. Runic power then, the way it worked, if I did not keep an eye on it, I could miss an interrupt if I spent it too eagerly but it wasn't a big deal keeping up with it. I certainly did not have any threat issues on that fight. Frankly, the interrupting was the only mechanic I had to keep my mind on, otherwise was simple tank&spank. Don't remember what the timer on Jaraxxus was but pretty sure DK interrupt was 10 sec CD, even back then.

For a DK tank yes, but for a warrior tank you would lose a second everytime you interrupted, and eventually his cast would go off before shield bash came out of cooldown (usually 3rd or 4th cast in a row).
The cooldown on his spell was exactly 10 seconds.

Same happened in general vezaxx, warrior tanks couldnt single interrupt his fire aoe, because the cast would go off every 3rd interrupt in a row. But then again, only DKs could back in 3.1.

[Deleted]

my point exactly, warriors have 12 seconds on their interrupt making it a close call when you wanted to lock jaraxxus as WARRIOR. DK thus being better.

Yeah, kk, gonna apologize here. Was, for some reason, under the impression shield bash was on a 10 sec CD. No wonder was confused reading this thread. Anyway, aye it would make a warrior's job on Jaraxxus bit more difficult, but for that fight, you could easily assign another tank for that job. Warriors easily have the best mobility among the tanks and add tanking would require quite a bit of zipping about. At least that's the way I see it and which is why I never believed in the MT/OT separation. Rather, have whoever is best for the job, as long as raid design doesn't compromise a tank's ability to be competitive.

As a tank I do not spec into drums of war. probably never would I would rather sit there and feel the pain of not pushing buttons. but then again you said rage is no issue, ill just have to take your word on this one. I can only remember in ICC that at times dmg was so incredibly low that I actually pressed my X to get a crit when a pull was made because the DPS had their resources whereas I did not. interrupting was something i really had to watch out for. glad it seems to have changed

Aye, ICC could be a fairly hectic place but the issues there were the problems that accumulated in the game mechanics, long before the instance was released. I too remember being somewhat annoyed by the mechanics in ICC, particularly where rage and thread was concerned. It wasn't difficult to hold threat, but you were in a very tight rotation, which gave very little opportunity to use utility abilities, like demo shout and TC.

The good news is that this has changed in Cataclysm. I'm not riding fire when producing threat, I have more control over it, and have both time and resources to use all my abilities effectively. So yes, rage really isn't an issue. In a typical 6-8 min fight, I find myself hardly caring what goes on in my rage bar. Sometimes you need to micromanage it, a little. Like during a pull or when the boss does something other than hit you, e.g. Valiona's breath, Maloriak's phase change, etc. but still only require minor adjustments.

[Alianthos]

OP : druids does have a interrupt since Cataclysm. "Skull bash", 1 for each stance (cat / bear), shared CD.

[Deleted]

OP : druids does have a interrupt since Cataclysm. "Skull bash", 1 for each stance (cat / bear), shared CD.

too long CD to be comparably thats why I ignored it.
the topic is about 12 seconds of warrior being inferior to 10 seconds on paladin and dk. Thats why I also mentioned that durid tanks should be given a viable interrupt too (as long as they are in bear form and after stancing the ability should be on the standard CD of 10 sec so that cats are not OP in bgs)


@Dannyl: my point again. if you need a tank to interruptlock a mob/boss (because elementals hate doing so and restro might get somebody killed when the heal interrupts, also windshear has 30 yards not 40) you will skip the warrior tank because he is less likely to fulfill this task.

[Alianthos]

too long CD to be comparably thats why I ignored it.
the topic is about 12 seconds of warrior being inferior to 10 seconds on paladin and dk. Thats why I also mentioned that durid tanks should be given a viable interrupt too (as long as they are in bear form and after stancing the ability should be on the standard CD of 10 sec so that cats are not OP in bgs)

@Dannyl: my point again. if you need a tank to interruptlock a mob/boss (because elementals hate doing so and restro might get somebody killed when the heal interrupts, also windshear has 30 yards not 40) you will skip the warrior tank because he is less likely to fulfill this task.

Dont look at the CD, most PVE bears take the talent in the feral tree that lowers the CD of both skull to 10 seconds, that why. It's called "Brutal Impact". Not sure about Cats though, but for bears its pretty much mandatory talent.

[Deleted]

Dont look at the CD, most PVE bears take the talent in the feral tree that lowers the CD of both skull to 10 seconds, that why. It's called "Brutal Impact". Not sure about Cats though, but for bears its pretty much mandatory talent.

Oh thanks, I didnt know that it was 10 seconds afterwards, I thought it was a silence effect on top of it with a CD of 30 sec or so.

So even more now! Warriors need a comparable interrupt with 10 seconds CD