Nefarian progression

[Lirik]

Hey guys, my guild is currently on nefarian and we are trying to perfect our strat...


our raid make up is:

2shadow/holy priests
2 resto/tank druids
1 warlock
1 mage
1 tank dk
1 dps warrior
1 enh shaman
1 h paladin

During phase 1, when we have a warrior dps available, he puts on a sword and shield, goes in defensive stance and kites 4 of the adds around while we keep 2 two shackled.

Without a warrior, we have 2 shackles while having our mage go from fire to frost and kite the 4 adds around. We have gotten through like this a couple of times but sometimes there are some issues that occur which basically results in a wipe.

So, I guess the main question for phase 1 is, with our raid comp.. what would be the best way to deal with the adds in phase 1 if we don't have a plate melee dps?


We have only gotten as far as half way through phase 2 and we are trying to work out some kinks. The groups were split on each pillar as so,

pillar 1: dk tank, shadow priest, resto druid, mage
pillar 2: hpally, enh shaman, warlock
pillar 3: warrior, hpriest, tank druid

interrupts: dk tank, tank druid, enh shaman

The way we did our strat was that pillar 1 and pillar 2 kill their add asap and once both are down, all ranged dps goes on nefarian while pillar 3 brings their add extremely low until we get nefarian to about 62%.

So, my question for phase 2 is.. is this an efficient way to deal with phase 2?


Thanks in advance guys.

[nemex]

With your raid make-up I'd say the easiest way to handle phase 1 adds would be for the two priests to shackle, holy paladin + warlock fearing and a druid to root one. It's hard, but try not to have them spread all around the room when they die. It makes phase 3 a lot easier for both the raid and the add tank if they're dead near each other.

Phase 2 is about survivability. It doesn't really matter what strat you use as long as you come out of it with your raid in good shape and lots of mana for your healers.

Phase 3 is also about survivability, it's mostly a learning curve for your tanks to figure out Nef + add positioning and how to allow the constructs to reset as often as possible.

[spaace]

I kite all the adds. They run fast It's probably the most challenging kiting I've had to do so far.
If I'm LUCKY, one of out other ccers MIGHT cc... sometimes I get a heal... but it looks grim.. Maybe I should just be more vocal when I ask for CC..

We had..
Prot Pally
Feral Druid
Shadow Priest
Disc Priest
Boomkin
Mage
Rogue
Unholy DK
Holy Pally
Resto Shaman



edit: I guess blizzard never fixed the graphic issue on that fight, because I dc'd about 5 times last night ( in our 9 attempts) just from kiting/blinking around the outside of the room with the adds.

[Deleted]

For phase 1, as far as I know, warlocks can still fear the adds (I know they are undead, and I was shocked when I saw a priest AoE fear them), so maybe if you CC a third add with fear, that should bring the damage being done to the kiter down. A paladin can also glyph to make fear instant, so thats a 4th CC there as well. Perhaps your mage will have it easier kiting 2 adds instead of 4.

For phase 2, it's actually a DPS increase for a warrior to interrupt, so I would suggest having him on interrupts instead of the druid. As phase 3 will be down to how well your tank can reset the adds, it's going to become sort of a DPS race, and therefore having him on as low health as possible will be ideal. If you can have the ranged DPS hitting Neff in phase 2, this will greatly help out. You have 2 minutes to kill the adds, so if 1 minute has gone, and one of the adds is still above 50%, pull off a ranged DPS on that platform from the boss to the add.

The only other advice I can give is practise, practise, practise

[server22]

Tbh i dont know if its possible to kill nefarian without getting 1 electrocute during phase 2, u need to have nefarian at about 52% when he lands for phase 3 or else u ll die from adds and ofc the fires will swarm you..

Start trying to get hit by an electrocute in p2 and learn how to heal through it, coz if u manage to reach p3 sooner or later u will realise that is impossible to deal with the adds and the fire for that long.

We have everyone using defensive cdz like, antimagic zone, iceblocks , bubbles etc, and immediatelly drinking a healthstone during the electrocute in p2, u can have dpsers capable of healing using it there, like shadowpriest doing some heal,(elemental shamans maybe , retris etc)

Depending on ur dps u ll have to adjust ur style, we have 2 dpsers in each platform, 1 of em is attacking nefarian only, usually at the end of phase2 we have an add left at like 5% so we finish it off and jump to phase3. There we use a prot warrior with piercing howl kiting the adds away from nefarian with a paladin healer following him, rotating shockwaves/paladin aoe stun(arg,forgot name!) and novas from the frost mage(frost really helps here) to kite them for as long as he can..

Hope i helped.

[Lirik]

Tbh i dont know if its possible to kill nefarian without getting 1 electrocute during phase 2, u need to have nefarian at about 52% when he lands for phase 3 or else u ll die from adds and ofc the fires will swarm you..

Start trying to get hit by an electrocute in p2 and learn how to heal through it, coz if u manage to reach p3 sooner or later u will realise that is impossible to deal with the adds and the fire for that long.

We have everyone using defensive cdz like, antimagic zone, iceblocks , bubbles etc, and immediatelly drinking a healthstone during the electrocute in p2, u can have dpsers capable of healing using it there, like shadowpriest doing some heal,(elemental shamans maybe , retris etc)

Depending on ur dps u ll have to adjust ur style, we have 2 dpsers in each platform, 1 of em is attacking nefarian only, usually at the end of phase2 we have an add left at like 5% so we finish it off and jump to phase3. There we use a prot warrior with piercing howl kiting the adds away from nefarian with a paladin healer following him, rotating shockwaves/paladin aoe stun(arg,forgot name!) and novas from the frost mage(frost really helps here) to kite them for as long as he can..

Hope i helped.

Oh I actually didn't know that they have to be killed in 2 minutes in phase 2... should all the ranged dps then be on nef while the melee and the tanks kill the adds?

[Aeiri]

Posetd this in another nef thread, but this is how my group does it.

Death Knight(Blood)
Warrior(Prot)
Warlock(Destro)
Mage(Frost)
Druid(Balance)
Death Knight(Unholy)
Hunter(Survival)
Paladin(Holy)
Priest(Disc)
Priest(Holy)

Phase 1
---------
Warrior on Ony, DK on Nef. Disc priest heals Nef tank, Paladin heals ony tank+add kiter/tank.
Our Unholy DK kites/tanks the adds that spawn in blood presence, uses armor pot if needed to stay alive. Once we get them grouped we frost nova/stun them etc. Once they start dying he tanks them in place while we cc a few to ease the damage.
At 20% we switch to nef and the ony tank gets ony down to ~200k by himself. We push 2 crackles before killing Onyxia and get Nef to about 71-72% while he lifts off.

Phase 2
---------
Group 1: DK(Unholy), Mage, Paladin
Group 2: Druid, Warrior, Priest(Holy)
Group 3: DK(Blood), Hunter, Warlock, Priest(Disc)

We let the healers get comfortable and call when they are ready and we push nef to a crackle at 70%. EVeryone on the 4 platform blows personal cooldowns, with hunter's nature resist + power word:barrier. We burn the adds down while working Nef down to 61%. I(the warlock) am on Nef fulltime with bane of havoc on the add and the other ranged dot up nef in the air. We usually work the final % or 2 while the lava subsides in the transition.

Phase 3
---------
DK Tanks Nef in middle. Raid groups on opposite side of Nef from where adds died in Phase 1. Warrior picks adds up and kites on outskirts of room in a circle with the Paladin healer following him. We rotate the boss occasionally to keep him from breathing on the adds, and to avoid fire. We go through about 3 crackles and bloodlust at about 35%. The balance druid also saved tranq to use for phase 3 when needed. Adds need to be reset minimum of twice unless you push additional crackles in phase 1 or 2.

[Vlerk]

We don't tank/kite the adds in P1 at all, we simply use a holy pally with RF to get aggro, and simply cc them all when they reach him. Not that root, shackle, fear, trap, wyv sting all work on them. Since they now all die in practically the same spot (pally actually breaks and asks for a recc if it wasn't cc'd right), so the kiter in p3 has an easier job picking them up.

We also don't do any crackles in P2 at all, since that seemed to be our biggest struggle. we simply dps the prototypes down as fast as possible. after that it's all about the 2nd tank being able to kite the adds and the first to survive every crackle (with this strat there will be a lot of quick crackles in p3). CD rotation rocks.

[chocho]

Oh I actually didn't know that they have to be killed in 2 minutes in phase 2... should all the ranged dps then be on nef while the melee and the tanks kill the adds?

obviously not lol , i dont think they can solo those things, however your dps can be pew pew at switching targets and with this i mean range dps.
you dont need to be dpsing nef all the time also coz dealing with 2 electrocutes on phase 2 is epicly mana killer, ask your healers :P

[Lirik]

obviously not lol , i dont think they can solo those things, however your dps can be pew pew at switching targets and with this i mean range dps.
you dont need to be dpsing nef all the time also coz dealing with 2 electrocutes on phase 2 is epicly mana killer, ask your healers :P

Well what I mean is, what would be a good way get nef to 61% as fast as possible? Having lets say a warlock on nef full time while everyone else kills their add? If the warlock needs help, have another ranged switch over and drop him down?

Or would it make more sense for 2 groups to kill their prototype, last group gets theirs to 10% ASAP and then all ranged get on nefarian, drop him to 61-62% and then kill the 3rd.

All in all, how many ranged dps do you guys put on nefarian during phase 2?

Aeiri, thanks for that write up... lots of helpful information.

[Fidoii]

(keeping in mind you guys are doing your first downs)
OT:
1) When we first downed Nef on 10, we cc'd all the adds in the same location(this is critical for phase 3) We noticed if we didn't place them in a similar location, we would have a lot of trouble picking them all up as well as placing the flames in proper location. If you don't have enough CCs, have your Nef tank pop CDS and pick up an add or two (they don't hit that hard if they don't have the buff) and have your lock pull threat off him after the feared add has died then fear that add in the same place. Ofcourse, if you have a plate dps class, he can Off tank them in phase 1 and make it much easier ( keep in mind, 10 man is not supposed to be balanced around raid comp.)

2) Most of our wipes when we first did Nef10 was around phase 2, a lot of guilds seemed to have problems in phase 3 but that wasn't the case for us. What boils down to is, just balance your raid onto 3 diff platform, have your BEST geared healer heal the one with 4 ppl, also make sure everyone is saving their defensive cds for the electrocute (2 Electrocute before Nef lands). Most likely what will cause you to wipe is, someone misses 1 interrupt on a platform, the aoe hits then the healers can't heal up in time for electrocute. The first time we did this (1 month ago? forgot), we could not get past phase 2 if any interrupts were missed, now, we can survive if we miss 1 or 2. A lot of it, comes down to how geared your healers are and how good they are able to heal (your DPS/Tanks should be helping as much as they can, for example: hunters can glyph Raptor Strike to reduce dmg taken)

Just adding, in phase 3, if your tank who is kiting the adds know how tank it without them ever getting hit by flame, phase 3 will be a joke. For my guild, I tank the adds in phase 3 and it took me 2 attempts to figure out how to do it ( this was before DBM made it easy mode) so it all boils down to your tank. (the reason I mentioned phase 1 placement of adds is critical is because it's better , at least imo, to have the adds all spawn at once so you can control their hp as if they were the all the same )

Our group comp for Nef first down:
3 Paladins (2 Prot, 1 Holy)
1 Druid (Resto)
2 Warlocks (One Affliction, 1 Destro)
1 Hunter (Survival)
1 Priest (Holy)
1 Shaman (Elemental)

[Yagamoth]

...(the reason I mentioned phase 1 placement of adds is critical is because it's better , at least imo, to have the adds all spawn at once so you can control their hp as if they were the all the same )

^
Absolutely true. However you can simply utilize the first breath of Nefarian if the adds are a bit scattered lying around.

[Deleted]

There is several ways you can handle all of the phases.
The tactic(s) we have been using succesfully differs a bit from what ppl have postet so far, especially on 1 point.

Setup:
Prot Warr
Prot Pal
Holy/disc priest
Holy Pal
Resto Dudu
Ench sham
Frost DK
Ass Rogue
Destro Lock
Boomkin Dudu

Phase 1:
2 adds are cc'd with roots and the rest is picked up by dk who goes frost especially for this fight to make this part easyer.
In the beginning we used cc on all of the adds so no kiting was needed, though we found that dk kiting was the easyest.
He get them into position, howling blast, priest fears (glyphed). Within the time the cc's runs out the adds starts dying.
We push 2 crackles in P1, as soon as the second crackle is done we push onyx. Nef is usually at 75% when P1 ends.

Phase 2:
We split the raid as everyone else with Prot warr, dk and ench shaman interrupting.
We push NO crackels in P2 since we don't find its worth the mana and the danger of someone dying.
As soon as we are done with the adds we stay on the pillars untill nef is standing solid on the ground, then we jump down.
This gives the healers plenty of time to heal everyone up so we can push a crackle very early in P3

Phase 3:
Crackle before the first shadow blaze (i think thats the name), Prot pal on Nef, Prot warr on adds.
We are stacking the adds in the oposit side of the room of where we position Nef, and since we know that the shadow blaze will allways target the adds we know that the fire will spawn far away from the raid.
Our resto dudu will follow our prot warr around as the only healer on him.
From there on its just a matter of controlling the adds while the raid burns Nef.
The adds should reset theire stacks 2 times during P3 if they are kited properly.

Make sure your tanks got cd's rdy for all the crackles during p3. The mastery trinket from Baradin's warden (mastery with resistence - use ability) is a very nice and strong cooldown for both breaths in p1 and crackles in p3.
I'd suggest both your tanks to pick this one up if they didn't allready.

I hope this helps.

[Lirik]

Thanks guys I will tweak our setup based on all of your responses

[Mammoth]

In P2 just have your ranged focussed on Nef. Melee/Tanks should have enough dps to kill them. A melee with no target alive should throw whatever he can at Nef. Have your druid tank keep his add alive until the last few seconds of P2 to minimise time needed for P3.

Initially I asked dps to wait for pillars to be ready before pushing a crackle. But on our winning try I just told the interrupters not to fail and healers to push everything when the boss was about to crackle, because we couldn't afford to waste time in P2.

[foreveralone]

Don't kite the adds around, that's a waste of dps and healers mana. Your dps need to just CC them until they keel over and die. Warlocks can fear and deathcoil. Mages can frost nova and slow them with whatever. Paladins have turn evil for fear and priests both have shackle with roots on your druid. Now you need to be vocal about who is ccing what where, learn the face of a clock so for example:

Shadow Priest - "Shackling the 3 o clock skeleton"

I'm the holy paladin in our raid and my job in that fight is to heal the tank that is on Onyxia. You really cannot flirt with their health much unless you're extremely confident in your ability to not let your tank die. Have people on Nefarian be vocal about when he's pushing over 10% of his life. Make sure that your tank on Onyxia is turning her away making his healer and basically everyone on Nefarion BEHIND her. This is so when she does her electricity storm is doesn't hit anybody. Your healer might get tail swiped but that isn't so bad, it doesn't do a lot of damage. Most of the DPS should be hopping off of Onyxia when she gets to 25%. Dots will carry her over to maybe 21% and then you leave her alone for awhile while the tank on her slowly widdles her down. The trick is here to kill Onyxia the moment Nefarion gets pushed over 70%. That gives you a few extra valuable seconds to heal up the people on your pillar before going up, healthstones when you get on the platform.

Phase 2 is incredibly easy, you just interrupt. Make sure people are as spread out as possible on those platforms to reduce shadow barrage splash damage. It's hard to position yourself but this phase is just an interrupt phase. When all the adds are down we go into phase 3.

Top everyone off and nefarion should be pushing over 60% soon. What we do rather than just cc the adds in phase 3 and hope they die in a nice place is we have on of our tanks, preferably a warrior because of heroic leap and intervene. In this phase you will have a tank gathering and kiting adds with a full time healer on him. Once again I am the one following this tank around and I put righteous fury on in this phase to aggro loose skeletons and he picks them up. The trick here is to keep them moving and be vocal with your tank about where he is clear to go. It's nice to have a warrior tank because when damage gets too crazy he can just shockwave and intervene you putting a gap. Kite the adds and be vocal about when nefarion is pushing over so the healer on the kiting tank will know when to heal big.

The tank on Nefarian just needs to be observant of purple fire near him or the raid and move Nef when required, dps will follow. By the time nefarion gets to sub 10%, your kiting tank is going to be getting overwhelmed unless RNG was in your favor (It usually isn't). Bring all the adds as far away as possible from the raid and nefarian and when your kiting tank dies, they will go to the healer. The optimal thing to do is triangulate yourselves to maximize how far the skeletons have to move before they get to your raid and tear peoples faces off. When the skeleton mob gets to the group use as many aoe fears and cc's you have to stop them. Nefarian should die easily if all of that goes according to plan.

Good luck and have fun.