Why all the hate for CTA?

[Astinius]

I don't fully understand why all the hate. First people complain about long queue times so Blizzard tries to implement a system to encourage tanks to rectify this. The intent is that it will lower the queue times thus resulting in more randoms being done. If it works, it should equate to more VP's / faction / loot etc. Will it work? Only time will tell since all of the baseless speculation on the forums is...baseless. (You're not an expert, don't confuse your opinion with facts)

But, now the dps feels shafted because tanks might get a pet or mount...seriously what would you rather have? More VP / loot per day or cosmetic upgrades that really have no effect on actual game play? You are getting something, assuming it works. You are getting more randoms per day.

It's like the nurse saying, "Well I helped the doctor remove this guys gizzard, why the heck does he get paid more than me?" Some occupations warrant higher rewards.
Tanking = responsibility - something most people I have met in this game are afraid of.

Be glad that Blizzard is at least trying something.

Your sense of entitlement...is invalid.


DPS says, "WTF Blizz? I have to wait 40 mins for a random. I'm tired of farming twilight jasmine lulz"

Blizzard responds, "Okay, since lack of tanks appears to be the main issue, we will implement a system to encourage them to queue up. The incentives aren't game breaking and minuscule at best. Hopefully this will lower the unacceptable queue times."

Tank says, "Meh..."

DPS says, "WTF!!!!!!!! I wunt those cool mounts, I only have 104 same speed ones as it is!!!#!! And those uber pets, gimme gimme gimme gimme gimme. I pay 15 bucks a month, YOU OWE ME!"

EDIT - wth is CTH? I dont know but I meant CTA. My apologies.

[wonktnodi]

I run with guild members, so I don't have a long queue time. But now with the chance for rewards combined with the luck of the draw buff making the dungeons easier, I think most tanks would be tempted to queue alone just to benefit themselves.

[Nexiv]

You answered your own question really. The irony is that the negative reaction to this change by "DPS only" players is tied up in the same reason as to why queues are so long because tanks dont want to tank.

[Lord Blackmore]

OP, you are filled with sweet, delicious irony. Let's review, shall we?

You tell people their speculation is baseless, while at the same time, your comments are equally baseless.
You tell people they are not experts, while you are also not an expert.

That's awesome right there.

--

Can someone link to a blue post or patch notes that describe what OP is talking about. I'll reserve judgement on this CTH business until then.

---------- Post added 2011-04-07 at 08:10 AM ----------

You answered your own question really. The irony is that the negative reaction to this change by "DPS only" players is tied up in the same reason as to why queues are so long because tanks dont want to tank.

If you want to say DPS players make tanks not want to tank, just say that. If you don't mean that, then I have no idea
what you mean.

[DeanyKong]

You tell people their speculation is baseless, while at the same time, your comments are equally baseless.

His statements are not baseless. They are taken directly from the blue post and much QQ from the rest of the internet. The speculation as to why this will fail is baselesss, and for the most part, the nay-sayers are ignoring integral points such as the CTA people having to solo queue, the rewards being items you can already easily obtain in-game, and the potential for the CTA to shift to DPS in the event that the tanks and healers flood the market.

See the front page of MMO Champion for the blue post.

[Smeeh]

I run with guild members, so I don't have a long queue time. But now with the chance for rewards combined with the luck of the draw buff making the dungeons easier, I think most tanks would be tempted to queue alone just to benefit themselves.

people that go "fuck you guildies, im gonna queue alone because i want the rewards" and cant be botherd doing 1 run with some guild dps, proberbly wont have to worry about guildies for long

[balatro]

What is CTH?

[Deleted]

What is CTH?

I think he means Call to Arms.

OT: There's lots of hate for it because it won't work, it promotes tank-ago, and it makes those of us who want to play with our friends on a social game feel punished for not wanting to be silent with a group of randoms.

people that go "fuck you guildies, im gonna queue alone because i want the rewards" and cant be botherd doing 1 run with some guild dps, proberbly wont have to worry about guildies for long

Guilds have more DPS than tanks, just because of the way the ratio of them in raids vs heroics is, therefore some DPS will always be left out either way. I don't think it's so bad if a tank wants to go alone for extra rewards.

[Tehgypsy]

--

Can someone link to a blue post or patch notes that describe what OP is talking about. I'll reserve judgement on this CTH business until then.

OP means Call To Arms, CTA.

http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/...r-Call-to-Arms

[Lord Blackmore]

As far as CTA, WGAS, really? I can't control what Blizzard does and they're gonna do what they're gonna do. I remain unconvinced that this will solve queue problems long term. People don't tank or heal for lots of reasons, including not wanted to deal with lousy players, failed runs or whatever. I'm not just talking about not so good DPS, but tanks not wanted to get bad healers and vice versa as well. I don't see perqs all of a sudden motivating tanks/heals to queue because all of the things they don't like about doing randoms is still true.

What I predict is an uptick in tanks/heals queueing for a while, followed by a return to current levels when tanks/heals remember why they don't want to heal/tank randoms.

I certainly hope Blizzard implements some controls too. Tanks/heals queueing more doesn't help me, as DPS, if they don't stick around to finish the instance. As it is too many players bail after just one wipe in a heroic. You can't force successful
completion of an instance, but there needs to be some things in place to prevent abuse like a tank or healer queueing,
running a bit of the instance and bailing, etc.

[Will]

OP, you are filled with sweet, delicious irony. Let's review, shall we?

You tell people their speculation is baseless, while at the same time, your comments are equally baseless.
You tell people they are not experts, while you are also not an expert.

That's awesome right there.

--

Can someone link to a blue post or patch notes that describe what OP is talking about. I'll reserve judgement on this CTH business until then.

---------- Post added 2011-04-07 at 08:10 AM ----------



If you want to say DPS players make tanks not want to tank, just say that. If you don't mean that, then I have no idea
what you mean.

what the heck are you talking about?
He doesn't understand why so many DPS are complaining that they're unable to claim the goodie bag, and at the same time are completely overlooking the fact that queue times may be FAR shorter. In other words the DPS lose nothing. If anything they gain shorter queues, which is a good thing, but they're overlooking this fact because they're in such an uproar about not having a chance to get some aesthetic goodies. So now we know that despite complaining about queue times, DPS wanted aesthetic collectables all along - much more than they wanted shorter queues!

That's not at all baseless. They are completely valid opinions. So why are you telling him otherwise?
And as for not being an expert, yet telling others they are not experts: Does a man have to be a dentist to tell someone else their teeth look bad?

[nehiod]

I run random dungeons on a daily basis on my rogue, resto druid and protadin and I can say tanking is actually more faceroll than other roles for me. When I tank, I come across some terrible dps who don't even deserve the VP and when I'm the dps, there are some tanks that are so clueless basically you're waiting for votekick timer to continue your run. Anyone saying this system isn't flawed is delusional. Good dps is just as important as good tanking, maybe even more because more dps = shorter encounter = easier on healer. In a perfect world, there would be a system to somehow calculate a player's skill in a training area before letting them queue for daily dungeons. One can only hope I guess.

[wtbepix]

...

I certainly hope Blizzard implements some controls too. Tanks/heals queueing more doesn't help me, as DPS, if they don't stick around to finish the instance. As it is too many players bail after just one wipe in a heroic. You can't force successful
completion of an instance, but there needs to be some things in place to prevent abuse like a tank or healer queueing,
running a bit of the instance and bailing, etc.

If they don't complete the dungeon: They get NOTHING

Quote the Blue Post:

To be eligible for the additional rewards you must solo queue for a random level-85 Heroic in the role that is currently being Called to Arms, and complete the dungeon by killing the final boss.

[Femy]

I run random dungeons on a daily basis on my rogue, resto druid and protadin and I can say tanking is actually more faceroll than other roles for me. When I tank, I come across some terrible dps who don't even deserve the VP and when I'm the dps, there are some tanks that are so clueless basically you're waiting for votekick timer to continue your run.

This. Runs where I'm not tanking are far far more painful. Tanking is pretty faceroll indeed. As a tank, you can just drag the group along even if they're bad and just wait on kick timers to remove the lowest DPS. I think I Qd one random as tank in the past 6 weeks...

But with the CTA and the change to VP caps and 7 different randoms rewarding VP, and my total lack of need for honor on my pvp character, I will probably enter LFD more as a tank...but pretty much only when CTA is up (why do the same task for less reward...CTA will become mandatory for me if implemented). I hope mythical healing pots are common in the bags. Even with inflation, I refuse to pay the 30-40g per just to blow them in BGs.

[Spraxle]

The argument that these items are "Easy to farm" is true a degree. Most of the mounts are only obtainable on a once a day lock out, and the CTA will completely bypass that. You que up, you get instant pop, you finish the run in 30-40min, rinse, repeat, profit. I think that's the blatant issue here with people getting "mad" about the rewards. If you're a tank and you can't be arsed to go travel to those old instances you basiclly get to sit in SW/Org and farm the semi-unique rewards of the game for little to no effort on your part. That's bull.

[WretchedSimmons]

-Still- not going to get me to tank a random heroic without guildies. No vent, no control over mobs.. not a chance. I'm not a facerolling pally tank with captain america shield getting massive-o threat and also silencing ranged caster mobs. Sorry Blizz, come at me with bonus vp or 2000g gold bags to put up with that kind of bs for probably 2 hours at a time.

[Nexiv]

If you want to say DPS players make tanks not want to tank, just say that. If you don't mean that, then I have no idea what you mean.

Granted I typed too quickly and ended up being obscure.
What I meant is the complaining and whining that is happening by DPS saying they are now going to be 'punished' because they wont ever get the loot bag, is part of the same entitled attitude that has caused tanks/healers to stay away from random pugs.

[Rukah]

I would support the system if the rewards wern't mounts or pets that I had spend countless hours farming. If it was just extra Gold or Flasks then that would be awesome.

BTW I play a hunter and only a hunter.... pure dps classes ftl. Buff my tanking pet?

[zshikara]

I heal, and I strongly support this incentive (maybe this isn't the best idea. giving em pets and mounts, but hey, its something. and I like that.) to get tanks to queue.

However I really don't like that you have to queue alone. I play with my wife a lot and we always queue together when we can. That means if for some reason healer is the CTA I get screwed if my wife is with me at the time. Not cool.

[Lord Blackmore]

That's not at all baseless. They are completely valid opinions. So why are you telling him otherwise?
And as for not being an expert, yet telling others they are not experts: Does a man have to be a dentist to tell someone else their teeth look bad?

And people who disagree with OP about the viability of this solution have perfectly valid opinions too. Sadly, OP simply dismisses those opinions as "entitlement issues", which, is, here it comes, a baseless accusation. Oh sure some people will be upset over tanks/heals getting extra goodies. But people like me, who has actual working brain cells, and doesn't care about the rewards aspect, may come to the conclusion that this is a band aid, short term fix. So yeah, OP has no basis to claim that it's just due to "entitlement issues" that people disagree or doubt CTA is going to what blue says it will.

Put differently, OP paints with a very broad brush which is NEVER a good idea.

I've done a reasonable job laying out why I think CTA will have a short term effect but will ultimately not prove to be a long term solution. But I guess that's the "entitlement" talking, AMIRITE? *shakes head*.

BTW, it is ironic when someone bitches about other people bitching.

Lastly, yes, you DO in fact need to be a dentist to be able to tell someone how to treat a dental issue. Dental issue = long queue times, treatment = CTA. Nobody here is a dentist (expert) on this issue.