2023-24 NHL Season Thread.

[Savedwow]

This is probably going to be the oddest question you guys have ever gotten BUT, with the season coming up, what's the best way to find the low-down on all the teams and to starting getting into the sport? My family is canadian/english so it's hockey in the winter, and football (soccer) in the summer. I used to know all of the teams when I was like 5, and my dad took me to hang out at the sports bars with his friends and I would do this trick and recite all of the team names based on city/mascot (ex. Edmonton ____, ____ Sharks). Now I'd like to actually understand and watch the sport with my parents and have a general idea of what the teams are/player drama (as that always gets brought up). I know the positions basically, but is there like a info-wiki on the teams etc. like they do with league of legends?

I don't think there is an official NHL Wiki but what I could recommend for you to do is head over to http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/. It's the most well known/largest Hockey forum and you can find pretty much anything you want there.

[Raleik]

I don't quite understand why people are debating the strength of the punches... It doesn't matter how hard he hit him, what he actually did matters. And that's slew foot a guy, bring him to the ground, and hit him in the head when he clearly was defenseless and had no interest in fighting. What Thornton did was wrong, he knows that, I know that, pretty much everyone knows that. He will get a long suspension, and he will deserve every game of that. And, this is coming from a Bruins fan. I love the physical, gritty style of play the Bruins employ. But, that's not what this was. This was a dirty play, the kind of thing nobody wants to see in the sport.

However, also keep in mind that this is Thornton's first offense in his over 500 games played. Whatever you may think about this action, in general, Thornton is not a dirty player, and is not a cheapshot artist. He's one of the few true honorable enforcers left in the game, who brings a lot to this team through his grit, work effort, and leadership. He made a mistake and got caught up in his own emotion, he has owned up to that, and he will serve his time (10-20 games I'm expecting since he's a first time offender). But, he should not be suspended the entire season, and he should not be thrown out of the league, because he has shown to this point (in quite a large sample size) that he is not a dirty player, he's simply a player who made a very bad mistake.

[Savedwow]

I don't quite understand why people are debating the strength of the punches... It doesn't matter how hard he hit him, what he actually did matters. And that's slew foot a guy, bring him to the ground, and hit him in the head when he clearly was defenseless and had no interest in fighting. What Thornton did was wrong, he knows that, I know that, pretty much everyone knows that. He will get a long suspension, and he will deserve every game of that. And, this is coming from a Bruins fan. I love the physical, gritty style of play the Bruins employ. But, that's not what this was. This was a dirty play, the kind of thing nobody wants to see in the sport.

However, also keep in mind that this is Thornton's first offense in his over 500 games played. Whatever you may think about this action, in general, Thornton is not a dirty player, and is not a cheapshot artist. He's one of the few true honorable enforcers left in the game, who brings a lot to this team through his grit, work effort, and leadership. He made a mistake and got caught up in his own emotion, he has owned up to that, and he will serve his time (10-20 games I'm expecting since he's a first time offender). But, he should not be suspended the entire season, and he should not be thrown out of the league, because he has shown to this point (in quite a large sample size) that he is not a dirty player, he's simply a player who made a very bad mistake.

Keep in mind that Bertuzzi was suspended indefinitely pending reinstatement for his first offense. While the injury from that was more severe, the Thornton incident can be argued to be a more vicious / unhockey like play. Bertuzzi sucker punched an opposing player once, and the injury was caused by the two players falling to the ice during in-game play. Thornton skated almost 200 feet down the ice to slewfoot an unsuspecting player during a stoppage in play, and assault him multiple times while he laid defenseless. To be completely 100% honest, I expect Thornton to get the book thrown at him and miss the rest of the season.

[Greeney]

This is probably going to be the oddest question you guys have ever gotten BUT, with the season coming up, what's the best way to find the low-down on all the teams and to starting getting into the sport? My family is canadian/english so it's hockey in the winter, and football (soccer) in the summer. I used to know all of the teams when I was like 5, and my dad took me to hang out at the sports bars with his friends and I would do this trick and recite all of the team names based on city/mascot (ex. Edmonton ____, ____ Sharks). Now I'd like to actually understand and watch the sport with my parents and have a general idea of what the teams are/player drama (as that always gets brought up). I know the positions basically, but is there like a info-wiki on the teams etc. like they do with league of legends?

I've really been getting into Reddit's Hockey community lately, and they did a pretty good 30 Teams in 30 Days type of thing.
http://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/wiki/30teams30days

You'll generally get a basic idea of positions after watching a game.
2 Wingers, the more offensive players who score goals.
1 Centre, takes the faceoff, generally expected to be more responsible both ways than the Wingers.
2 Defense, stop pucks from going to the net... unless you're a Leafs d-man, because our goalies seem to excel when they get 50 shots on net every game.
1 Goalie, stops pucks that goes by the defense

[Rosh]

http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2...g-memory-loss/

Thats weird, i rather trust the actual site of pittsburgh penguins saying he joined them back on the flight the same day and where he was actually released before the match even ended.

All you need to do is pick any youtube video...

Same video i already linked.

Intentional trip, punches the guy in the face after tripping him, guy goes on a stretcher. I don't give a shit if the guy was wearing a visor, it doesn't make it any less scummy. You're telling me that after going into a rage, tripping him, and taking enough cheapshots to send the guy to the hospital that Thornton was barely using any force? And I'm the one full of shit? If you find the right clip, I'm sure it looked like Bertuzzi was just trying to give Moore a hug. From what I've heard of the guy, your inner Jack Edwards is showing.

I never said it WASNT scummy at all. I dont accept him doing it. But the fall was never pure, the hit was never a full one. there is simply no way he would get a concussion from that. Especially not with gloves and a helmet on. Just for the love of god Download the video and run it frame by frame to get a closer look at where his hits actually hits. Is that so hard? the situation goes by fast, YES, and it looks bad. YES. But is it? No. not by a mile.
His fall was not pure, i've written this before and its like im talking to a wall.


IF thornton was to use full force you would have seen it.
Thornton might have been pissed but that was simply to give him a piece of his mind.
And if Thornton wanted to fight, there would be significant marks on Orpic.
There is a big difference from being pissed and wanting to really fight someone and just wanting to give a message.

you don't lose your cool, trip a guy from behind, and punch him while he's down.

I agree IF this actually was an incident where orpic really got hurt and where Thornton really was out to harm him.
But in the reality of this, no he does not deserve a big suspension. max 3 games IMO.

This is just wearing homer glasses or being completely delusional, at an exceptional level.

This alone makes me wonder if you even know anything about the sport, except from watching it on tv.
Penguins will make playoffs no problem there. so will boston.
But i never said penguins wanted Thornton OUT.
I said they wanted an advantage to win the absolute hardest game in the eastern with getting boston to take a serious penalty.
It doesent matter if both teams reach the god damn playoffs. Penguins has ALWAYS drooled to win the Conference, League AND Cup.
They are known for milking the refs for everything they got.
It was a tie game. it was an away game. Put your pieces together.

The goal for every team is the Stanley Cup.
Not the President's Trophy.
If anyone cared about the President's Trophy, the Canucks would be considered a dynasty.

This alone tells me that you clearly have no knowledge of this team what so ever.


This is a team that wants everything. They arent going to lay back, just making the playoffs. They want it all.
They are in the weaker conference, where only bruins are in their way. and i explained it above step by step.

I want whatever you are having; Orpik was placed on the INJURED RESERVE.

Let me get out the airplane spoon:

"A player placed on Injured Reserve is ineligible to compete in NHL games for a period of not less than seven days."

I highly doubt the Penguins are interested in losing a top 4, minute-crunching defender to get rid of Shawn f****g Thornton.

I never said it was to get rid of Thornto. Read.

what i DID say was that they would take any advantage they could get in the game. Orpic probs didnt even realise at first who came but hoping they would draw a penalty for it. And yes even though majority goes as personal it is still a chance there will be a team penalty.

doesn't matter because the end result is that Brooks Orpik has been diagnosed with a severe grade 2 concussion.

Where did it say he got SEVERE grade 2 concussion.
That even strenghtens my point, Who the hell gets a SEVERE grade 2 concussion from 1 wisor slide and a slight hit on the head with no force. Especially while wearing a Helmet and hitter a Glove.
Not an NHL player, not an Hockeyplayer. None.

I wonder if anyone here actually has played the game?
Has ANY of you even wore a player helmet, have any of you recieved a punch with a glove to a players helmet?
Raise your hand, i REALLY want to know.

Because i've sure as hell have felt it noumerus times from quite big athletes and never EVER been close to a god damn concussion.
And to be honest, i cant even recall ever in NHL that a player got a concussion from anything like it. Atleast not while wearing a helmet. If there was no helmet or glove involved , yes i would not even go near this discussion.
IF he got a concussion it was simply not from the single hit from Thornton.
Fucking sell my house, car, hell even give up Hockey before i even at the slightest belive he actually did get a concussion from that situation.

[Greeney]

I don't quite understand why people are debating the strength of the punches... It doesn't matter how hard he hit him, what he actually did matters. And that's slew foot a guy, bring him to the ground, and hit him in the head when he clearly was defenseless and had no interest in fighting. What Thornton did was wrong, he knows that, I know that, pretty much everyone knows that. He will get a long suspension, and he will deserve every game of that. And, this is coming from a Bruins fan. I love the physical, gritty style of play the Bruins employ. But, that's not what this was. This was a dirty play, the kind of thing nobody wants to see in the sport.

However, also keep in mind that this is Thornton's first offense in his over 500 games played. Whatever you may think about this action, in general, Thornton is not a dirty player, and is not a cheapshot artist. He's one of the few true honorable enforcers left in the game, who brings a lot to this team through his grit, work effort, and leadership. He made a mistake and got caught up in his own emotion, he has owned up to that, and he will serve his time (10-20 games I'm expecting since he's a first time offender). But, he should not be suspended the entire season, and he should not be thrown out of the league, because he has shown to this point (in quite a large sample size) that he is not a dirty player, he's simply a player who made a very bad mistake.

I think that's a fair assessment. He's not a scummy person, but he still did a real scummy thing. I also like the way the Bruins play, but it (without a doubt) crosses the line. As long as he doesn't do it again I don't think the book needs to be thrown at him, but I can't grasp the logic of others saying he shouldn't be suspended more than a few games just because some other idiot wasn't suspended more than five games. I'll give all the credit in the world to him for admitting he was wrong though, better than the "woe is innocent me" Neal tried pretending that he never noticed Marchand.

[Savedwow]

Thats weird, i rather trust the actual site of pittsburgh penguins saying he joined them back on the flight the same day and where he was actually released before the match even ended.


Same video i already linked.



I never said it WASNT scummy at all. I dont accept him doing it. But the fall was never pure, the hit was never a full one. there is simply no way he would get a concussion from that. Especially not with gloves and a helmet on. Just for the love of god Download the video and run it frame by frame to get a closer look at where his hits actually hits. Is that so hard? the situation goes by fast, YES, and it looks bad. YES. But is it? No. not by a mile.
His fall was not pure, i've written this before and its like im talking to a wall.


IF thornton was to use full force you would have seen it.
Thornton might have been pissed but that was simply to give him a piece of his mind.
And if Thornton wanted to fight, there would be significant marks on Orpic.
There is a big difference from being pissed and wanting to really fight someone and just wanting to give a message.




I agree IF this actually was an incident where orpic really got hurt and where Thornton really was out to harm him.
But in the reality of this, no he does not deserve a big suspension. max 3 games IMO.



This alone makes me wonder if you even know anything about the sport, except from watching it on tv.
Penguins will make playoffs no problem there. so will boston.
But i never said penguins wanted Thornton OUT.
I said they wanted an advantage to win the absolute hardest game in the eastern with getting boston to take a serious penalty.
It doesent matter if both teams reach the god damn playoffs. Penguins has ALWAYS drooled to win the Conference, League AND Cup.
They are known for milking the refs for everything they got.
It was a tie game. it was an away game. Put your pieces together.



This alone tells me that you clearly have no knowledge of this team what so ever.


This is a team that wants everything. They arent going to lay back, just making the playoffs. They want it all.
They are in the weaker conference, where only bruins are in their way. and i explained it above step by step.




I never said it was to get rid of Thornto. Read.

what i DID say was that they would take any advantage they could get in the game. Orpic probs didnt even realise at first who came but hoping they would draw a penalty for it. And yes even though majority goes as personal it is still a chance there will be a team penalty.


Where did it say he got SEVERE grade 2 concussion.
That even strenghtens my point, Who the hell gets a SEVERE grade 2 concussion from 1 wisor slide and a slight hit on the head with no force. Especially while wearing a Helmet and hitter a Glove.
Not an NHL player, not an Hockeyplayer. None.

I wonder if anyone here actually has played the game?
Has ANY of you even wore a player helmet, have any of you recieved a punch with a glove to a players helmet?
Raise your hand, i REALLY want to know.

Because i've sure as hell have felt it noumerus times from quite big athletes and never EVER been close to a god damn concussion.
And to be honest, i cant even recall ever in NHL that a player got a concussion from anything like it. Atleast not while wearing a helmet. If there was no helmet or glove involved , yes i would not even go near this discussion.
IF he got a concussion it was simply not from the single hit from Thornton.
Fucking sell my house, car, hell even give up Hockey before i even at the slightest belive he actually did get a concussion from that situation.

Do you know... anything... at all... about concussions? Seriously. Go do some reading on concussions and you'll understand why you're coming across as a conspiracy theorist that is spouting off the most asinine things possible. You don't have to be hit by a truck to experience a concussion, just like getting hit by a truck doesn't necessarily mean you will experience a concussion.

Orpik lost consciousness for over 2 minutes. The punches must have been stronger than you think, too. Go watch the video, the guy is 100% out cold after the first punch.

[Rosh]

Do you know... anything... at all... about concussions? Seriously. Go do some reading on concussions and you'll understand why you're coming across as a conspiracy theorist that is spouting off the most asinine things possible. You don't have to be hit by a truck to experience a concussion, just like getting hit by a truck doesn't necessarily mean you will experience a concussion.

Orpik lost consciousness for over 2 minutes. The punches must have been stronger than you think, too. Go watch the video, the guy is 100% out cold after the first punch.

Actually i know a hell of alot about concussions as i've had alot of them throughout the years.
No you do not have to be hit by a truck. But you do actually need some way of shaking up your brain in the process of getting it. Seriously come on. that single hit would not sturr up your brain enough to give you a damn Concussion.
Orpic has nothing to do in NHL if that gives him a concussion. That would mean a simple HIT on him would give him a concussion. even if he fell over.

And since i clearly have no idea about concussions
Do you have any idea how protective a players helmet is? do you know how soft a players glove is?

Orpic did not lose any consciouness. He was there the whole time laying still on the ice. so that card you gotta play somewhere else.
And no he was not out cold, he rolled over and stayed still but he did not lose consciouness.
IF he did. then he would never have been graded a 2 degree concussion.
Thats a 3 degree concussion.

Now you're just speaking out of your ass.


and to just clarify for you.

IN a Grade 1 Concussion the symptoms lasts under 15 minutes and you dont lose Consciousness.

in a grade 2 concussion the symptoms lasts over 15 minutes and you dont lose Consciousness.

In a grade 3 concussion person loses Consciousness.

oh and yes. With a grade 3 concussion, you will be kept overnight at the hospital.
You will not fly.
Orpic Joined the team before game was over, he flew with them back to Pittsburgh.

[Rylon]

Do you know... anything... at all... about concussions? Seriously. Go do some reading on concussions and you'll understand why you're coming across as a conspiracy theorist that is spouting off the most asinine things possible. You don't have to be hit by a truck to experience a concussion, just like getting hit by a truck doesn't necessarily mean you will experience a concussion.

Orpik lost consciousness for over 2 minutes. The punches must have been stronger than you think, too. Go watch the video, the guy is 100% out cold after the first punch.

Some more concussion education, just to continue clarification. Concussions can happen from two types of motion. The first is the forward and backward motion, much like banging your head against a wall (which this thread makes me do, btw) that can injure the brain. What may be surprising is that you can actually receive a concussion without your head every making contact with another surface. For example, concussions occur during car accidents where your head doesn't actually hit anything. The whiplash of getting hit from behind cause your head (and brain) to move forward. Once your head stop, your brain actually continues moving, because there it is surrounded by, among other stuff, cerebral spinal fluid. Well, your brain keeps moving, mashes into the front of your skull, and then when it whiplashes back, hits the back of your skull, causing injury to your brain. And your skull didn't make any contact with anything.

The second cause of concussion is caused by rotational forces, such as getting hit in the side of your head. This occurs when your head rotates quickly and unnaturally, causing shearing stress on brain tissue. This rotational concussion also normally injures parts of the brain that can, yep, cause you to lose consciousness. This is what happens when boxers get knocked unconscious.

Long story short, you do not need an ungloves fist make contact to an unprotected skull to cause a concussion.

Also, just because you've received a bunch of concussions, doesn't make you a scientific expert on them.

[Rennadrel]

At least the league is consistent with their boarding penalties

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=6...id=DL|NHL|home

[Rosh]

Some more concussion education, just to continue clarification. Concussions can happen from two types of motion. The first is the forward and backward motion, much like banging your head against a wall (which this thread makes me do, btw) that can injure the brain. What may be surprising is that you can actually receive a concussion without your head every making contact with another surface. For example, concussions occur during car accidents where your head doesn't actually hit anything. The whiplash of getting hit from behind cause your head (and brain) to move forward. Once your head stop, your brain actually continues moving, because there it is surrounded by, among other stuff, cerebral spinal fluid. Well, your brain keeps moving, mashes into the front of your skull, and then when it whiplashes back, hits the back of your skull, causing injury to your brain. And your skull didn't make any contact with anything.

The second cause of concussion is caused by rotational forces, such as getting hit in the side of your head. This occurs when your head rotates quickly and unnaturally, causing shearing stress on brain tissue. This rotational concussion also normally injures parts of the brain that can, yep, cause you to lose consciousness. This is what happens when boxers get knocked unconscious.

Long story short, you do not need an ungloves fist make contact to an unprotected skull to cause a concussion.

Also, just because you've received a bunch of concussions, doesn't make you a scientific expert on them.

im guessing that one is aimed at me.

No you do not. you CAN get a concussion yes. In this situation, a simple No.
im saying it again, IF he got a concussion, it was not from that situation.
People can sit here and say whatever they want really, and i know o too well how this forum is and im baffled over myself why i even bother.

IF he got a damn concussion from that single hit, he has NOTHING to do outside his house. There was no rocking, shaking or anything, it was a plain hit on the helmet.

Wake up. see what a hockey player goes through, if he would've gotten a damn concussion from that hit, then he would be down on the ice after every god damn hit in the game and constantly be out injured.

I'm not an expert, i've never been educated in it. But i know enough about protection and what it actually takes to get a concussion, and that single glove/helm hit is not enough to shake the brain up. MAYBE if he would've been punched down in the ice where the brain would get a sudden stop and hit the skull.
Any other thing in Icehockey would've had a greater shot of him getting a concussion. Even him falling over while skating would have been a bigger chance of him getting one.

[Savedwow]

Actually i know a hell of alot about concussions as i've had alot of them throughout the years.
No you do not have to be hit by a truck. But you do actually need some way of shaking up your brain in the process of getting it. Seriously come on. that single hit would not sturr up your brain enough to give you a damn Concussion.
Orpic has nothing to do in NHL if that gives him a concussion. That would mean a simple HIT on him would give him a concussion. even if he fell over.

And since i clearly have no idea about concussions
Do you have any idea how protective a players helmet is? do you know how soft a players glove is?

Orpic did not lose any consciouness. He was there the whole time laying still on the ice. so that card you gotta play somewhere else.
And no he was not out cold, he rolled over and stayed still but he did not lose consciouness.
IF he did. then he would never have been graded a 2 degree concussion.
Thats a 3 degree concussion.

Now you're just speaking out of your ass.


and to just clarify for you.

IN a Grade 1 Concussion the symptoms lasts under 15 minutes and you dont lose Consciousness.

in a grade 2 concussion the symptoms lasts over 15 minutes and you dont lose Consciousness.

In a grade 3 concussion person loses Consciousness.

oh and yes. With a grade 3 concussion, you will be kept overnight at the hospital.
You will not fly.
Orpic Joined the team before game was over, he flew with them back to Pittsburgh.

Where are you getting this information? Because it's factually incorrect.

Casntu (1986) designates a grade II concussion as "the patient loses consciousness for less than 5 minutes or experiences amnesia for between 30 minutes and 24 hours (Cantu, 1986.)

Lets take a look at PUBLICLY ACKNOWLEDGED FACTS BY THE GENERAL MANAGER OF THE PITTSBURGH PENGUINS. Directly from the medical staff and Brooks Orpik himself.

http://www.sportingnews.com/nhl/stor...nee-suspension

-Lost, at the absolute minnimum, 2 hours of memory. Depending on when the question was answered, he could have over 12 hours of amnesia.
-Was unconscious for over 2 minutes.
-Has been diagnosed with a concussion and is out for the lengthy, foreseeable future.

Read for more.

Why are you spouting off random, nonsensical bits of information that are your opinions and not based on fact?

[draynay]

I don't quite understand why people are debating the strength of the punches...

Because people in this thread are CRAZY!

If it isn't crazy homerism its plain old crazy. Its the main reason I post less in here than I do in the MLB or NFL threads, too many insane people posting insane things.

Actually i know a hell of alot about concussions as i've had alot of them throughout the years.

I believe you, the first thing that makes sense, how else could someone concoct such a ridiculous conspiracy as to have a 21min a game top-4 defenseman pretend to be injured for [at least] a week so that a guy who plays 8min a game can get suspended.

[Rosh]

Where are you getting this information? Because it's factually incorrect.

Casntu (1986) designates a grade II concussion as "the patient loses consciousness for less than 5 minutes or experiences amnesia for between 30 minutes and 24 hours (Cantu, 1986.)

Lets take a look at PUBLICLY ACKNOWLEDGED FACTS BY THE GENERAL MANAGER OF THE PITTSBURGH PENGUINS. Directly from the medical staff and Brooks Orpik himself.

http://www.sportingnews.com/nhl/stor...nee-suspension

-Lost, at the absolute minnimum, 2 hours of memory. Depending on when the question was answered, he could have over 12 hours of amnesia.
-Was unconscious for over 2 minutes.
-Has been diagnosed with a concussion and is out for the lengthy, foreseeable future.

Read for more.

Why are you spouting off random, nonsensical bits of information that are your opinions and not based on fact?

There is 3 grading systems.


Cantu:

Grade 1: Post-traumatic amnesia <30 minutes, no loss of consciousness
Grade 2: Loss of consciousness <5 minutes or amnesia lasting 30 minutes–24 hours
Grade 3: Loss of consciousness >5 minutes or amnesia >24 hours

Colorado medical Society:

Grade 1: Confusion, no loss of consciousness
Grade 2: Confusion, post-traumatic amnesia, no loss of consciousness
Grade 3: Any loss of consciousness

American Academy oF neurology

Grade 1: Confusion, symptoms last <15 minutes, no loss of consciousness
Grade 2: Symptoms last >15 minutes, no loss of consciousness
Grade 3: Loss of consciousness (IIIa, coma lasts seconds, IIIb for minutes)

And if orpic was Unconscious, why did he then move skates, hands and were talking with the people around him?
Am i the one spouting off random, nonsensical bits of informations?

IF the concussion was that serious he would NOT have been released from the hospital.
Seriously IF he lost consciousness they would never have let him out of the bed, let alone letting him go back to the rink before the game was over.
And then, again. The flying part.

[Savedwow]

Because people in this thread are CRAZY!

If it isn't crazy homerism its plain old crazy. Its the main reason I post less in here than I do in the MLB or NFL threads, too many insane people posting insane things.



I believe you, the first thing that makes sense, how else could someone concoct such a ridiculous conspiracy as to have a 21min a game top-4 defenseman pretend to be injured for [at least] a week so that a guy who plays 8min a game can get suspended.

LMFAO! So true!

[Rosh]

Because people in this thread are CRAZY!

If it isn't crazy homerism its plain old crazy. Its the main reason I post less in here than I do in the MLB or NFL threads, too many insane people posting insane things.



I believe you, the first thing that makes sense, how else could someone concoct such a ridiculous conspiracy as to have a 21min a game top-4 defenseman pretend to be injured for [at least] a week so that a guy who plays 8min a game can get suspended.

Knew that one was coming, and really. that was the only thing you could come up with?
Shit i better settle down before the TV hockey fan takes me over.

Get out and play the sport.

[Rylon]

Knew that one was coming, and really. that was the only thing you could come up with?
Shit i better settle down before the TV hockey fan takes me over.

Get out and play the sport.

Right, because playing the sport and spouting anecdotal claims is a surefire replacement for things such as science, and facts, and medical diagnoses

[Rosh]

Right, because playing the sport and spouting anecdotal claims is a surefire replacement for things such as science, and facts, and medical diagnoses

Show me the Science, facts and medical diagnoses that actually proves that he did get a concussion from that ONE hit.
im saying it again, if that was a severe concussion he would not have been released from the hospital.
I've linked probably more straight forward truth than most have in this post to be honest.


Doesent it strike you odd that he actually were back in the rink before game ended, and cleared to fly with them after that "big" incident?
after supposivly according to team doctor etc that he was knocked out for several minutes, despite actually talking to the on ice crew, moving hands(wat.)


Im saying play the sport and actually know what equiptment helps you prevent, and how much it actually takes to create an injury in that specific situation.
People can sit online, discuss all they want and come with that info and that info. But if you havent even come close to touching the ice, trying on the protective gear. Dont come here and say its that easy to get an concussion in that specific situation.

If it was on the street. bare hands and no helmet. Hell i wouldnt even start discussing it.

This probably wont tell you anything, but im showing you anways.
Look how much protection that little helmet gives you. And note that the entire helmet absorbs shocks from hits, pucks and whatnot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L82URiqRJNo


I'm just going to call it here and say. Lets agree to Disagree.

[Rylon]

Show me the Science, facts and medical diagnoses that actually proves that he did get a concussion from that ONE hit.
im saying it again, if that was a severe concussion he would not have been released from the hospital.
I've linked probably more straight forward truth than most have in this post to be honest.


Doesent it strike you odd that he actually were back in the rink before game ended, and cleared to fly with them after that "big" incident?
after supposivly according to team doctor etc that he was knocked out for several minutes, despite actually talking to the on ice crew, moving hands(wat.)


Im saying play the sport and actually know what equiptment helps you prevent, and how much it actually takes to create an injury in that specific situation.
People can sit online, discuss all they want and come with that info and that info. But if you havent even come close to touching the ice, trying on the protective gear. Dont come here and say its that easy to get an concussion in that specific situation.

This probably wont tell you anything, but im showing you anways.
Look how much protection that little helmet gives you. And note that the entire helmet absorbs shocks from hits, pucks and whatnot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L82URiqRJNo


I'm just going to call it here and say. Lets agree to Disagree.

I understand that sports equipment protects you. I've played competitive contact sports (though not hockey) And guess what? Football players wearing helmets still get concussions, despite wearing helmet. There is also scientific evidence that you do not even need contact to the head to receive a concussion, either by rotational stress on the brain or whiplash. Let me reiterate: YOU DO NOT NEED TO GET HIT IN THE HEAD TO RECEIVE A CONCUSSION. So if we take a step back, sure, maybe the two punches to the head didn't cause the concussion. The fact is at some point from the slew foot to the punches, a defenseless Orpik was knocked out and concussed.

Now, I can't say that I have a medical degree, and I doubt you do either, and neither of us were present on the ice, or in the hospital, to hear the actual diagnosis, but I do not think it is unheard of to not stay overnight after a class II concussion. So yeah, it's completely possible that they scanned him, saw no brain damage, and told the team to watch him on the flight back.

So your argument, as I can see, is that he could not have received a concussion. Which means that the entire pens organization is lying, and deactivating a top 4 defenseman. The purpose of this would be to shed a bad light on the bruins team, and lobby for a longer suspension for an 8 minute a night 4th liner player. Additionally, the Bruins are doing nothing to expose this conspiracy, as their team doctor was there with Orpik on the ice and would have seen his condition. Does this not seem ridiculous?

[Greeney]

Thats weird, i rather trust the actual site of pittsburgh penguins saying he joined them back on the flight the same day and where he was actually released before the match even ended.

Does it really matter? He needed to leave the game on a stretcher. If you want to trust the site of the Pittsburgh Penguins (and not just when it's convenient for you) then you also trust that he had a concussion and lost consciousness, (http://penguins.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=695165).

Same video i already linked.

Great, so why bother downloading it? To watch it frame by frame until I become so tired of watching it that nobody outside the most asinine of Bruins homers will think "well, it wasn't that bad"?

I never said it WASNT scummy at all. I dont accept him doing it. But the fall was never pure, the hit was never a full one.

The fall was never pure? What the actual shithorse? The guy was the receipient of a slewfoot. Of course he's not going to fall purely, assuming your imagination of falling purely actually has something to do with both the word "falling" and "purely". As for "the hit was never a full one..." The first punch or the second one? Because there was a visor? And gloves? You've got to be kidding me.

there is simply no way he would get a concussion from that. Especially not with gloves and a helmet on.

You, on the other hand, master of concussions who has had a lot of them throughout the years have suffered much worse I'm sure than being unexpectedly punched by an NHL enforcer... Amazing.

Nobody could ever get injured when someone who wears gloves takes a shot at someone wearing a helmet though!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fz9RE9RGrVY

Just for the love of god Download the video and run it frame by frame to get a closer look at where his hits actually hits. Is that so hard? the situation goes by fast, YES, and it looks bad. YES. But is it? No. not by a mile.
His fall was not pure, i've written this before and its like im talking to a wall.

It must be a crazy coincidence that you're a Bruins fan who doesn't think it's so bad and nobody else (and I'm pretty sure it's not just limited to this site) seems to agree with you. He lost fucking consciousness, but the Pittsbugh Penguins site says he flew home the next day so it must have been Pittsburgh's strategy to get Thornton suspended for 9,249 games! Really though, it's the 5 minute powerplay that he pretended to go to the hospital for! And he isn't really going on IR, he just needed an excuse for an extended vacation. What else could it be? You sir, you're quite the detective.

I could already see it...
"This dog wasn't really abused by it's owner! He tried throwing himself out the window to guilt trip his owner into giving him a treat!"

IF thornton was to use full force you would have seen it.
Thornton might have been pissed but that was simply to give him a piece of his mind.
And if Thornton wanted to fight, there would be significant marks on Orpic.
There is a big difference from being pissed and wanting to really fight someone and just wanting to give a message.

Yeah, because everyone who just wants to send a message starts a fight by tripping the opponent and not giving them a chance to defend themselves what-so-ever. He wanted revenge for the Eriksson hit earlier and the knee to Marchand just pushed him over the line, it was not "just a message."

I agree IF this actually was an incident where orpic really got hurt and where Thornton really was out to harm him.
But in the reality of this, no he does not deserve a big suspension. max 3 games IMO.

Max 3 games? Really? Crosby does this to anyone on your team and you're bullshitting me like this that you expect a maximum of 3 motherfucking games?

Well, clearly Toronto's mayor isn't the only one smoking crack these days.

This alone makes me wonder if you even know anything about the sport, except from watching it on tv.

"Person disagrees with me, must make more idiotic posts and suggest he knows nothing about the sport."
Fans from teams that don't care about Boston disagree with you.
Fans from other teams that like Boston disagree with you.
Fans from your team disagree with you.
"I play in a silly little league with a few silly friends so only I can comment about the sport as if I am the only one here who experienced it on a professional level!"
Guess I know more about baseball than anyone in the MLB thread because I used to play in a league. That's not a logical thought process.

Penguins will make playoffs no problem there. so will boston.
But i never said penguins wanted Thornton OUT.
I said they wanted an advantage to win the absolute hardest game in the eastern with getting boston to take a serious penalty.
It doesent matter if both teams reach the god damn playoffs. Penguins has ALWAYS drooled to win the Conference, League AND Cup.
They are known for milking the refs for everything they got.
It was a tie game. it was an away game. Put your pieces together.

I don't even know where to start.

Yes, Penguins seem to get away with more than any other team. IMO Boston's a close second. It generally seems that way with the better teams.
Penguins tend to get away with goaltender interference penalties that don't get called on when they score, but get called on when other teams score. Penguins do not feign blackouts so that they can lose a defensemen, who kills off the clock, so that they can get a 5 minute powerplay only halfway into the first period when Pittsburgh made it perfectly clear that they SUCK DEFENSIVELY over the last couple years.

"It doesent matter if both teams reach the god damn playoffs. Penguins has ALWAYS drooled to win the Conference, League AND Cup."

Wow, just wow... The evil penguins are going to win everything and the poor innocent Bruins who can't give someone a concussion because there's like gloves and helmets have only won one cup recently!

"I said they wanted an advantage to win the absolute hardest game in the eastern with getting boston to take a serious penalty."

If you really think a player would fake a concussion and go on IR for a chance at winning a single game, you're probably out of your fucking mind.

This alone tells me that you clearly have no knowledge of this team what so ever.

Wow, it's like a retarded deja vu tactic to try to win an internet argument when you can't accept you're wrong.

This is a team that wants everything. They arent going to lay back, just making the playoffs. They want it all.
They are in the weaker conference, where only bruins are in their way. and i explained it above step by step.

Ohhhhhhkay there. Because, you know, Thornton is going to be the difference maker between Pittsburgh or Boston winning the conference. This reminds me of some idiot who once said Boston wouldn't have beat Montreal the year the Bruins won the cup if one of their injured players had been in the line up.

I never said it was to get rid of Thornto. Read.

Well, when you start spouting out so much ignorant junk you might start to forget what you actually stated. Here you go, I'll bold it for you.

It was a "Gift" for Penguins to get a good player like Thornton out so why not make the best of it. it was a tie game, we all know any team will try and get an advantage in the game, its not the first time its happend in NHL.

what i DID say was that they would take any advantage they could get in the game.

Maybe if you included the world "also" in there it wouldn't appear dishonest. You stated quite clearly that it was a gift for Penguins to get a good player like Thornton out.

Orpic probs didnt even realise at first who came but hoping they would draw a penalty for it. And yes even though majority goes as personal it is still a chance there will be a team penalty.

Yeah, Bylsma was like communicating with Orpik telepathically telling Orpik that Thornton was going to trip him. So Orpik was probably laying there after the slewfoot thinking "I bet he's going to punch me now!"
Then innocent Thornton, who should get no more than a 3 game suspension, fell for the trap.
Then Orpik was like "I bet he's going to punch me again, but this time I'm really going to show him because I'm going to close my eyes until I get a stretcher!"
And once again, poor Thornton just got suckered into punching Orpik.
And Orpik was closing his eyes, thinking to himself, "Wow! I'm actually going to get this good player Thornton thrown out of the game! Now we just can't lose!"

But in the end Pittsburgh lost, because like always Pittsburgh gets all the calls there way... especially against Boston who have only beat them in 6 of the last 7 games with all those calls going Pittsburgh's way.

And in Pittsburgh's loss Orpik was like "okay guys I was faking the whole time, but I really thought it would help us win the Eastern Conference, President's Trophy, and Stanley Cup!"



You do know Thornton said he was sick with himself after the game? If Thornton didn't hit Orpik as hard as "Orpik is pretending" then Thornton has no damn reason to be sick with himself.

Actually i know a hell of alot about concussions as i've had alot of them throughout the years.

Yes, you must be more knowledgeable than any Dr. who works for the NHL. I mean, I know if I got a concussion I would be like, I hope I can speak with that Rosh guy on mmo-champion ASAP.