Major bear tank problem

[Bigslick]

@ Inicuous:

I actually agree with the vast majority of what you had posted, and certainly value when people post in to help others, especially those new to the class, with information conveyed constructively and with a positive attitude. My only real concern was the suggestion of removing a budgeted point from Fury Swipes to put into Stampede.

Yes, you get a very slight dps upgrade for your white damage attacks for the first few seconds of a fight with Stampede, but that pales dramatically against the threat increase that investing the point in Fury Swipes will purchase (which is available for higher proc rate at the start of the fight, throughout the duration, and after any threat dumps the encounter might entail). As we head into 4.1 (hopefully next week) KotJ become a more broadly appealing investment l and I'll finally throw talent points into it, though I'll still likely not pull fund them from Fury Swipes' budget.

Enchanting and gemming his gear is a must-do, and will have far more impact on his threat generation than the talent decisions we're discussing.

[Zene]

I am one of those "excellent bear tanks" you may have pugged with. I rarely lose aggro on trash, am quick to change targets and taunt / mangle / maul it back under conroll, and usually have a 2 stack of lacerate rolling on everything in the pull 10 seconds after the fight starts.

Our beef is not "we cant do it", but rather, "we have to work 2x as hard as a Warrior / DK and 3x as hard as a Paladin to do it" when it comes to adiquately controlling any pull with more then 4 mobs in it. especially if you get a trigger happy fire mage or Solar Cleave boomkin in your group, who can pull insane damage on EVERYTHING in the pull 5 seconds after you touch it.

(I speak also from the perspective of a Boomkin, as lazer chicken is my Main Spec, and if I end up in a pug with another druid tanking, i usually have to drop Mushroom bombing trash out of my solar spam entirely unless I want to spend half of every trash pull Chicken Tanking.)

I agree, I am in the same boat, mainspec boomy and offspec tank. When I tank i fully expect the DPS to be relentless and when I boomy i'm one of those jerk DPS Good luck. Also recommend using Berserk for some of the harder trash packs as the DPS boost from it not only hold threat much better but also kills them much quicker.

[Inicuous]

at Inicuous:

I actually agree with the vast majority of what you had posted, and certainly value when people post in to help others, especially those new to the class, with information conveyed constructively and with a positive attitude. My only real concern was the suggestion of removing a budgeted point from Fury Swipes to put into Stampede.

Yes, you get a very slight dps upgrade for your white damage attacks for the first few seconds of a fight with Stampede, but that pales dramatically against the threat increase that investing the point in Fury Swipes will purchase (which is available for higher proc rate at the start of the fight, throughout the duration, and after any threat dumps the encounter might entail). As we head into 4.1 (hopefully next week) KotJ become a more broadly appealing investment l and I'll finally throw talent points into it, though I'll still likely not pull fund them from Fury Swipes' budget.

Enchanting and gemming his gear is a must-do, and will have far more impact on his threat generation than the talent decisions we're discussing.

Having looked over a few of our discussion posts, I agree with the things you have posted. We all learn something everyday! I appreciate most the inteligent arguments you have brought forth!

OT: Hol, All the best to you buddy and I hope you have learned some valuable things in this thread!

Edit: Had to alter the "at" sign in Slick's quote due to forum policy for new posters

[tyggyr]

You missed the part where the bonus threat on Swipe that we currently get is getting removed, so in all likelyhood, the swipe "buff" will come out as a wash in regards to threat at the end of the day.

It would be a wash, except that the cooldown is being reduced to three seconds instead of six - so you'll have the same amount of threat from swipe, twice every six seconds, instead of once - this is a definite AoE threat increase.