1. #30941
    Warchief Maarius's Avatar
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    I agree with WP... I feel that the writing is far too less in this games, npcs aren't talking more than a few lines which could be improved easily. What are the lore-guys doing I wonder. They can produce high quality stuff as we've seen in pre-release blog-posts.

    I like the hidden events in the game (e.g. the swamp in Queensdale has this 2 guys who summon some demon or the Necromancer in the hut there has also a litte event which can be triggered by just talking to him) but there could be much more of those with added lore. They had some nice events in the Halloween update too... loved that scavenger hunt.

    so those little special things are basically in the game, only far too few and with too less lore imho

  2. #30942
    Yea, Rift is probably the best example of terrible MMO questing. Potatoes makes a note to tie back his argument to the new living story thing in GW2. Which I also agree with as a possible avenue to add more personality and player investment to the game's world.

    Things like this: http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/The_Villainy_of_Galrath

    Stand out to me in Gw1. Or even like the bonuses such as saving the piggy in that one early mission. Or the way Cynn and Mhenlo have their stories revealed over time. I suppose a lot of the backdrop of the Order of Whispers, Sunspears and Houses of Luxon and Kurzick-- so much great world detail.

  3. #30943
    I agree, GW2 simply focused too much on telling the story by "stumbling over it". You have to overhear two locals talk about x-y-z inorder to learn about that stuf while in gw1 you had the normal quests from refugees and you learn how the am-fah impacted people etc.

    Now it's sort of like hearing to old people talk about vietnam instead of being the guy who "flew" those people there and then had an involvement in the story e.g: this one time i was flying and this guy who had lost a hand said "eey fellas I need to piss anyone care to lend me a hand?"

  4. #30944
    Dreadlord Scyth's Avatar
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    I can't believe it, they are finally adding preview to the TP

  5. #30945
    So, karma dump. Last time I used it on Obsidian Shards. Should I go for Lost Orrian Jewelry Boxes now or continue to stock up on shards?

  6. #30946
    Dreadlord Scyth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lane View Post
    So, karma dump. Last time I used it on Obsidian Shards. Should I go for Lost Orrian Jewelry Boxes now or continue to stock up on shards?
    Depends what you want from the boxes. I opened like 70 yesterday and got only 15 Shards and karma stuff. In my opinion they've nerfed the drops from those too because when they introduced them on the first day I opened quite a lot of them and got a lot of pets and different kinds of lodestones. If you don't care what you get though go for it!

  7. #30947
    Warchief Razael's Avatar
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    I just saw that video from WoodenPotatoes, and i must say its spot on for me. I miss that "completion" feeling that Dynamic events don't offer.

  8. #30948
    Warchief Maarius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirve View Post
    I just saw that video from WoodenPotatoes, and i must say its spot on for me. I miss that "completion" feeling that Dynamic events don't offer.
    I think WPs video wasn't about a completion feeling (you get that a lot in GW2: hearts, Map-completion, World-completion) but the feeling of emptyness in certain areas. For me the thing missing are lore-connections. Things with stories.

  9. #30949
    Quote Originally Posted by Scyth View Post
    I opened like 70 yesterday and got only 15 Shards and karma stuff.
    Karma stuff? o_O

    Well, I guess I don't really care what I get from them. I really wish karma was account bound and then I wouldn't have to worry about spending 60k+ of it every time I decide to delete one of my 80s. I think Obsidian Shards are only for legendaries anyway, right? I'm nowhere near ever doing that. :P

  10. #30950
    Quote Originally Posted by Lane View Post
    Karma stuff? o_O

    Well, I guess I don't really care what I get from them. I really wish karma was account bound and then I wouldn't have to worry about spending 60k+ of it every time I decide to delete one of my 80s. I think Obsidian Shards are only for legendaries anyway, right? I'm nowhere near ever doing that. :P
    Yeah, you often get karma drops/vials etc from the Lost Orrian Boxes. Which is pretty good cause you can use it on others chars. I usually buy a few and I get usually 75% of the karma back or so.

  11. #30951
    Ah, okay. That sounds good then. I thought it may have meant other things you could buy with karma and I thought, if I wanted that wouldn't I have already bought it instead of this box? ;P

  12. #30952
    Dreadlord Scyth's Avatar
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    Yeah sorry for that Lane, I meant something like jugs of karma. And the Shards are only for legendaries yes, for now at least

  13. #30953
    WPs perhaps expressed it a bit ambigously with 'quests'. I think it could better be described as a lack of interactivity with the general scenery, as an example you could get for one of these guys in the citadel some token he lost where he originally lived, in the process telling you a story why he ended up there and getting you involved. That would technically be a classic quest, yes.

    I thought of Mass Effect 2's Omega Station where you could help out a quarian stranded there on his pilgrimage, Or you could ignore his plight. Things like that would add a lot of depth to the world, but perhaps the living story will introduce such things.

  14. #30954
    I think a better way to put it is the lack of an objective based list. Something like the Elder Scrolls for example. Dynamic Events are very shallow and small in scope, and they have a limited range. Once you leave the area, you can't progress it. The lack of any sort of quest system prevents smaller story arcs, like Garenhoff.

    Quest is a bad word since the stigma attached to it. Kill 10 boars and such.
    6.0 Disc Priest Guide http://i.imgur.com/QbCmDc2l.jpg

  15. #30955
    "Quest" is only bad in the context of theme park MMOs.

    Quests as a general game concept/device is rarely kill 10 rats. Quests are fairly mainstream too.

    Not a big fan of Skyrim, but that's a very mainstream game, with great varied questing. Or more importantly, used their quests to provide great context to the game world. Morrowind would be another example in TES.

    Myriad games in the Final Fantasy, Tales, Persona, Mother and Dragon Warrior series fit the bill as well. Arcanum, Baldur's Gate, Fallout, Ultima, etc.

    MMOs are just kinda... bad games in terms of actual design. They have to be built around a set of circumstances which are almost totally contra to any other convention in the service of providing a perpetual, socially driven device.

    You don't really "quest" in Rift or Everquest 2. You task.
    Last edited by Fencers; 2013-02-17 at 06:17 AM.

  16. #30956
    Bloodsail Admiral nevermore's Avatar
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    In terms of quests I miss 2 things from GW2:

    * Epic quest chains (a long series of tasks that progressively takes you from doing simple things to amazing feats all around the world, grants unique rewards and tells you a part of the lore -- Vanilla WoW had a few good ones (Scepter of the Shifting Sands for example, and some smaller ones during WotLK and Cata))

    * 'Hidden' quests, ones that you can stumble upon in the most random places that either introduce you to a nice side-story or form the beginning of an epic quest chain ;p

    I kinda miss the traditional questing style sometimes. But the thing is, it doesn't have to be X or Y. You can do all the "kill 10 boars, collect 10 onions, kill a dozen centaurs" in the GW2 hearts style, but that doesn't mean you can't add actual quests that... you know, take you questing (= adventure)

    My two cents.

  17. #30957
    Quote Originally Posted by nevermore View Post
    In terms of quests I miss 2 things from GW2:

    * Epic quest chains (a long series of tasks that progressively takes you from doing simple things to amazing feats all around the world, grants unique rewards and tells you a part of the lore -- Vanilla WoW had a few good ones (Scepter of the Shifting Sands for example, and some smaller ones during WotLK and Cata))

    well you got meta-events not the same but also pretty epic

    * 'Hidden' quests, ones that you can stumble upon in the most random places that either introduce you to a nice side-story or form the beginning of an epic quest chain ;p
    instead of hidden quests you get jumping puzzles in my opinion cooler
    Last edited by Fencers; 2013-02-17 at 05:32 PM.

  18. #30958
    Legendary! draykorinee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by syom View Post
    instead of hidden quests you get jumping puzzles in my opinion cooler
    Jumping puzzles arent instead of, and nothing is hidden and nor do you 'stumble' upon jumping puzzles, there is a great big red sign saying jump here. Afaic the lack of true exploration is astounding everything is labelled for you, really couldnt fathom why.

    Edit: this comment is stupid and deserves the disdain it got.

  19. #30959
    Warchief Maarius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by draykorinee View Post
    Jumping puzzles arent instead of, and nothing is hidden and nor do you 'stumble' upon jumping puzzles, there is a great big red sign saying jump here. Afaic the lack of true exploration is astounding everything is labelled for you, really couldnt fathom why.
    I think what you are talking about are Vistas, not Jumping Puzzles. Vistas are small JPs, yes - but the real JPs aren't marked on the map at all.

  20. #30960
    All the jumping puzzles my husband and I have done were things completely stumbled on. There were no "signs" of such.

    Some of them you can only find by accident least you read some external guide.

    Don't know the name of the puzzle, but there was one in a cave that had a sheet of ice between two crevices. There was nothing around this opening and the ice blocked the crevice. Which led to like 3 chambers, a free fall section and pipe/trap section and finally to a boss.

    It's not till you leave the entire complex that the achievement even pops up that it was a puzzle.

    The above was found only because I got lost and fell off a rock.

    There is one in BTC that is underwater. Which my sister found by accident trying to unlock the zone [chantry of secrets eluded her]. Had she not been poking into all corners of the map looking for the final POI, we would have not known of the puzzle.

    Etc, etc, etc.

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