Heal crit modifier 200% on PTR.

[Deleted]

O.o Isn't compatible with our key HR spell, beacon or other things that our class is trademarked for......

You think our class is trademarked by a spell they added in the 3rd expansion? Mastery adds a shield when we heal, how is that not compatible with the lore of the paladin? It's exactly what it should be, protect those that we heal.
And it scales 1.5 % per mastery, which is a lot and that compensates for all the spells it doesn't work on.

[Kelesti]

O.o Isn't compatible with our key HR spell, beacon or other things that our class is trademarked for......

Really? Because I could've swore the Paladin class was "trademarked" around hard hitting single-target heals, once they became actual healers that is.

Does it mean that Exorcism crits for 200%?

Not something we'll be likely to see before 4.4, if even then

[Vanderhuge]

I'd like to point out that Paladin and Warrior tanks in T12 could very easily reach the avoidance/mitigation cap with the correct setup, and with the recent Blood Shield/Death Strike and Savage Defense changes, we may very well see bosses hitting like trucks again. I really don't like the idea of bosses hitting harder than Magmaw (100K+ if it's not blocked) because it feels like we're going back to the Wrath tanking mindset of hit, hit, hit, dead tank with an unlucky string.

[Kelesti]

I'd like to point out that Paladin and Warrior tanks in T12 could very easily reach the avoidance/mitigation cap with the correct setup, and with the recent Blood Shield/Death Strike and Savage Defense changes, we may very well see bosses hitting like trucks again. I really don't like the idea of bosses hitting harder than Magmaw (100K+ if it's not blocked) because it feels like we're going back to the Wrath tanking mindset of hit, hit, hit, dead tank with an unlucky string.

That's the problem when you let mana not be an issue.

They had a goal, to get other healers to be dealing with their blue bar as much as Holy Priests (in Beta) because pushing the healing metagame that far back would prevent it from happening. They couldn't do it, so they said "fuck it" and brought Priests up to everyone else, and then buffed Mana Tide, thus to every non-Paladin out there "Uhh... what's mana again?"

Blizzard failed to capitalize on their design when it mattered to healers. The tanking itemization is just pushing it in the same direction.

[Borigrad]

Really? Because I could've swore the Paladin class was "trademarked" around hard hitting single-target heals, once they became actual healers that is.

It was one of our trademarks, but it was part of the niche that was our tank healing. What really made us great tank healers back in the day was things like Hand of Salvation/Hand of Freedom/Hand of Sacrifice coupled with things like sacred shield. That i would say was more our "trademark" since it gave holy paladins great control over tanks and the fights, by keeping them mobile, on top of threat and having one of the best mitigation cooldowns in the game.

Granted that hasn't changed but other classes do it just as well, or nearly as well now.

That's the problem when you let mana not be an issue.

They had a goal, to get other healers to be dealing with their blue bar as much as Holy Priests (in Beta) because pushing the healing metagame that far back would prevent it from happening. They couldn't do it, so they said "fuck it" and brought Priests up to everyone else, and then buffed Mana Tide, thus to every non-Paladin out there "Uhh... what's mana again?"

Blizzard failed to capitalize on their design when it mattered to healers. The tanking itemization is just pushing it in the same direction.

I like the ideas of healers not needing to worry about mana since it really is their job, the field medic doesn't worry about running out of gause in the war unless it lasts a really long time. With that being said there are so many Mana-Regen cooldowns out now a days to accommodate people who have a hard time controlling their mana, that good players essentially take advantage of this to never run oom. I know back when i used to play, i wouldn't run a raid if we didn't have a replenishment procc somewhere because i got used to the ease of access to mana it provided. Granted i could do it, but it just increased the difficulty ten fold.

[TickTickTick]

Mastery adds a shield when we heal, how is that not compatible with the lore of the paladin?

The lore of the paladin says about fighting evil and wielding the holy light. Nothing about shields and absorbs.

It's exactly what it should be, protect those that we heal.

Yep, protect, but offensively.

And it scales 1.5 % per mastery, which is a lot and that compensates for all the spells it doesn't work on.

It's too small and crap, making it the worst healing mastery and one of the worst masteries in game. We are not Disci priests. We don't need bubbles. We heal. Mostly direct heal. Head in to that direction.

[Deleted]

It's too small and crap, making it the worst healing mastery and one of the worst masteries in game. We are not Disci priests. We don't need bubbles. We heal. Mostly direct heal. Head in to that direction.

It's around 9 - 10 % of total healing with very little mastery (1.5 - 2.5), how on Azeroth is that crap?

[Borigrad]

It's too small and crap, making it the worst healing mastery and one of the worst masteries in game. We are not Disci priests. We don't need bubbles. We heal. Mostly direct heal. Head in to that direction.

I disagree, Sacred Shield is by far one of the best spells we had at the end of 3.3 and 3.0 Sacred Shield literally killed disc priests till 3.1 it was so good. Since we had a cheap bubble that could be applied to the whole raid that last longer then PW:S.

[Kelesti]

It's around 9 - 10 % of total healing with very little mastery (1.5 - 2.5), how on Azeroth is that crap?

Because they want it to absorb Power Word: Shield style without a cooldown (28k, go), so it can actually take off an entire hit.

Despite the fact it's directly increasing your output, proportionally at that. Sure, it's not quite haste. Spirit's going to continue to DR.

But gearing in favor of 200% crit works on a spreadsheet. Mastery's still the superior stat of the two for everything except Holy Radiance (which given its "uptime", your Druids/Priests/Shaman can handle the healing if you don't crit. Afterall, when Holy Radiance isn't up, they have to anyways)

[Borigrad]

But gearing in favor of 200% crit works on a spreadsheet. Mastery's still the superior stat of the two for everything except Holy Radiance (which given its "uptime", your Druids/Priests/Shaman can handle the healing if you don't crit. Afterall, when Holy Radiance isn't up, they have to anyways)

They have too regardless if anyone is more then 10 yards away during the cast.

[Kelesti]

They have too regardless if anyone is more then 10 yards away during the cast.

Mmhmm. So why base a gearing decision around the philosophy of this one spell that isn't as gamechanging as people make it? Because it shows up nice on a graph?

The only thing bumping crit up does is it increases your Light of Dawn beacon transfer. It will do so predictably. As to everyone you actually heal with Light of Dawn, it won't really make much of a difference as triage still needs to come in and take effect between your pseudo cooldowns (especially on the people you didn't crit with).

[Borigrad]

Mmhmm. So why base a gearing decision around the philosophy of this one spell that isn't as gamechanging as people make it? Because it shows up nice on a graph?

The only thing bumping crit up does is it increases your Light of Dawn beacon transfer. It will do so predictably. As to everyone you actually heal with Light of Dawn, it won't really make much of a difference as triage still needs to come in and take effect between your pseudo cooldowns (especially on the people you didn't crit with).

I think it's rare that we fully agree, but we do on this topic. As right of right now Paladin AoE healing is a booster to the real AoE healers in the raid. LoD is for Single Target beacon heals, WoG is for haling the off-tank and main tank etc. Going Crit for paladin AoE healing is ridiculous. Infact going haste for Holy Radiance is still just as good because haste makes it tick faster and more often.

So Paladin's really still are Pre-Dominately Tank Healers with AoE kicker, which is really no different then having Judgement of Light for the last 6 years.

[Kelesti]

I think it's rare that we fully agree, but we do on this topic. As right of right now Paladin AoE healing is a booster to the real AoE healers in the raid. LoD is for Single Target beacon heals, WoG is for haling the off-tank and main tank etc. Going Crit for paladin AoE healing is ridiculous. Infact going haste for Holy Radiance is still just as good because haste makes it tick faster and more often.

Mmhmm. Haste still holds onto the "top stat" pretty strongly for a pretty good reason.

And hey, I've been agreeing with you in the past. Playing Devil's Advocate on semantics does not mean I disagree. I can even get along with zealous (zcks on the other hand...)

So Paladin's really still are Pre-Dominately Tank Healers with AoE kicker, which is really no different then having Judgement of Light for the last 6 years.

It's funny, I could've swore I've been saying that since 4.0.3, but everyone here goes "NO STFU UR RONG".

[Deleted]

It's funny, I could've swore I've been saying that since 4.0.3, but everyone here goes "NO STFU UR RONG".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hspNaoxzNbs

[Borigrad]

Mmhmm. Haste still holds onto the "top stat" pretty strongly for a pretty good reason.

And hey, I've been agreeing with you in the past. Playing Devil's Advocate on semantics does not mean I disagree. I can even get along with zealous (zcks on the other hand...)

Devil's advocate eh? I know we've butt heads pretty severely before but thats a different story. But yes Haste is still top priority, besides i don't even see 200% heals as a big change as it just allows more of it to be over heal in non heroic modes.

It's funny, I could've swore I've been saying that since 4.0.3, but everyone here goes "NO STFU UR RONG".

I'm sure i'll be called a noob and told to gtfo. You forget what forum you are on i think, unless you conform to the masses on every topic you are branded a heretic and then chastised until you agree with the majority.