Arena, honor, and you.

[Deleted]

Stanton that is just fucking retarded...

I got to ask what the fuck blizzard is thinking...

If that system really comes to live server I will quit with arena and only fuck around in it with my mage once I get the staff.

[Stanton Biston]

Like I said- I'll post all the final notes. I really, REALLY wish they would elaborate on this system because it is vague.

I think I figured the 2/3 off the rating itself, as that's how it looked, and since the rating:cap in non-linear, that's how I got 2250.

So an team Arena Team MMR of 2250 rewards the equivilant of an RBG team at 1500. That's one way.

The other way is to just multiply the cap by 2/3 for Arena.

My way it at least means something to get past 3k. Otherwise, it puts a hardcap of 2k on the conquest point limit from Arenas.

And that's not even taking into account that the first way they announced the change made it seem like if you capped Arena, you couldn't get points from RBG.

They have defended the change however, and it REALLY REALLY feels like they might all but phase out arena.

Like how people wanted Skirmishes back. They might be back, only we'll call them Arena. Since they'll have the same value.

[Deleted]

I get about a 2450 CP cap for a 2044 rated 2v2 team, and the way I see it it's going to be like this instead:

- 1500 RBG Rating (at 4.2) = 1500 CP cap.
- 1500 Arena Rating (at 4.2) = 990 CP cap. (2/3th of RBG)

- 2044 Arena OR RBG Rating (right now) = 2450.
- 2044 RBG Rating (at 4.2) = ~2600.
- 2044 Arena Rating (at 4.2) = ~1716. (2/3th of RBG)

Correct me if I'm wrong though, since I'm still not 100% sure on what this vague patchnote is all about.

That makes more sense then to have people be forced to play RBGs to get actual POINTS to fill the cap that they got from either RBG or arena, but it's still shit. I mean, I don't plan on ever being rated below 2800+ on any of my characters, so I guess I'd end up with quite a high cap anyway but a change like this would wreck mid-rated teams (2200~) in arena.

Plus 2044 rating in arena is SO little, and awarding such a high cap for it (more than enough for people to buy at least one "big" set piece per week) is just ludicrous. I think I only maxed out my weekly cap at around 2750 rating this season, and now any idiot that spams rated BGs, regardless of winning or losing is going to get 3k point cap just by being what? 2400 rated in BGs? Fuck off.

This wouldn't bother me too much because of what I've already said, I don't plan on being low rated so I'll get my cap up one way or the other BUT it's going to suck major dick for the avarage PvPer, and that's extremely unfair. But at least it's a *bit* better than the alternative, which is having to play RBGs to fill out one third or half of your weekly cap (at least from what I can decode out of the vague notes they gave).

More notes on this please, it's fucking groundbreaking.

[Balduvian]

You do know that even on a 3k rated arena team your CP cap will be down to 2k MAX. like this right?

So even for an "arena-pro" like yourself which you so clearly keep on stating it is still going to be rather low.

Also, if 2044 is going to give ~1716 points, and 3k is going to give 2k, the difference is basically the same as it is now in %'s.

[Stanton Biston]

However this ends up, I *think* one of the points of it was to stop people from camping on high arena ratings and getting 3 rBG wins to cap.

And to encourage people to rBG over Arena. 4x 10 man BGs isn't SO bad.

But as they stand, these changes are pretty drastic, as seen above.

[Balduvian]

And to encourage people to rBG over Arena. 4x 10 man BGs isn't SO bad.

Well, I know tons of people with decent to good arena ratings that absolutely dislike RBG. Why should I and all of those people be "forced" to do one part of PvP (RBG) when there is another option available as well (Arena), in which skill actually still matters a bit rather than in RBG where everyone can faceroll to their tier 2 weapon and higher.

If this system goes live the way we understand it to be, competitive Arena will be dead.

[Deleted]

Well it wont affect hardcore pvper so much considering they will still get their stuff pretty fast but this will affect pve/pvpers (like myself) cause with 4 days of raiding and perhaps 1 day of arena and now I will have to do something which I really do not like and will take a lot of time just to get a few more points...

Feels like a lot of bs to me

[Merin]

Until they make RBG's more accessible other than requiring 10 people and a strict comp, I dont know what they think this is gonna acomplish.

[Balduvian]

Well it wont affect hardcore pvper so much

Sorry but that's just false.

I play about 3+ hours on workdays and saturdays, and 6-10 on sundays and in my holiday. It's not so much about time when you absolutely disgust a specific form of PvP. (although in my case it is double as bad since my guild runs RBG's on times I can't play, AND I disgust it.)

[Stanton Biston]

Well, I know tons of people with decent to good arena ratings that absolutely dislike RBG. Why should I and all of those people be "forced" to do one part of PvP (RBG) when there is another option available as well (Arena), in which skill actually still matters a bit rather than in RBG where everyone can faceroll to their tier 2 weapon and higher.

If this system goes live the way we understand it to be, competitive Arena will be dead.

Honestly, I don't think most of these changes will last. rBGs take too long for too little comparative reward and telling people that you're increasing the minimum time commitment for arenas by like 3x to get the same amount of points as before won't encourage casual arena players.

We can all admit that when we were just looking for our cap for the week, it was nice having other people who just wanted their cap and didn't know how to play. Those people are the most likely to stop, and as some of them stop, more of them will stop. The bottom could fall out, and while it would make arenas in theory more competitive, in practice it might push people away and fast.

Really though, I'm just waiting for the final notes from Blizzard. So many changes all the time.

[Deleted]

Sorry but that's just false.

I play about 3+ hours on workdays and saturdays, and 6-10 on sundays and in my holiday. It's not so much about time when you absolutely disgust a specific form of PvP. (although in my case it is double as bad since my guild runs RBG's on times I can't play, AND I disgust it.)

My point was that hardcore arena junkies often get their gear quite fast and therefor do not need to sit and do extra stuff for perhaps 2-3 month.

I understand that this will affect everyone but its seems to be more focused on people playing perhaps 10 games a week to get the cap or whatever.

And since pve/pvp often are in a PvE guild you will find it harder to actually find a good RBG team then if you were a hardcore pvper and know good people..

[Whisperawr]

I don't have time for RBG's AND arenas & and a lot of the good PvPers on the my server migrated to other games/quit when during beginning of cata, what do I do now that I can't form an RBG group? Blizzard's goal to satisfy the casuals isn't their goal anymore, clearly.

Hating the game more and more every day. I don't even want to know what the changes are that are going to make me finally quit this game... I guess I keep playing because I have hope that they can turn it around to the game that I got addicted to.

[Deleted]

i would welcome that change to finance future enchants or to have a chance to test a 2nd or 3rd spec without mindlessly grinding BGs again.

and i would like to see some changes to the pace honor points are farmed with toons. it was fun around the date of release when everyone was geared roughly the same. but now you enter the battlegrounds with a handfull of crafted blue PvP gear, matched against almost completey arena geared enemies while sitting at or round about 100k HP shouting "look at me, I'm a match stick in a forest fire!"

i do understand the concept of gearing up, and that it should take some time. but perhaps earning a tabard with your main that can be exchanged between chars increasing the honor gain by 100% could be a solution.

[Deleted]

Ofcourse it should.

RBG = Honor and CP.
Arena = CP.

Doesn't make sense.

Indeed, I understand their desire to make us all jump on the RBG train, but some of us find it boring and tedious and prefer good 'ol Arenas. Why not offer some incentive to actually keep playing after you cap Conquest? Right now there's little point unless you're trying to raise your rating honestly. Also it would get people with full Vicious and t2 weapons(the ones farming those PvP enchants or just BoA gear for their alt) out of BGs that contain mostly green/blue geared players.

[Deleted]

You do know that even on a 3k rated arena team your CP cap will be down to 2k MAX. like this right?

I do now, and it makes me quite depressed. Funny part is that a 2k rated player will be getting like 300 points per week less than someone at 3.1k. Well, not exactly funny, more like I want to stick a pin into my eyes. But anyway, 2k points is still quite a lot, I remember when getting 2.4k~ points per week back in S8 at 2800~ rating in 5v5 and that was a ton at the time, so I'm pretty sure people will deal with being limited if they don't play RBGs.

[rtjason]

I do now, and it makes me quite depressed. Funny part is that a 2k rated player will be getting like 300 points per week less than someone at 3.1k. Well, not exactly funny, more like I want to stick a pin into my eyes. But anyway, 2k points is still quite a lot, I remember when getting 2.4k~ points per week back in S8 at 2800~ rating in 5v5 and that was a ton at the time, so I'm pretty sure people will deal with being limited if they don't play RBGs.

That's not quite right. You will not receive a higher cap from arena until you breach 2250 and your scaling for cap will not increase very much. You will have to do rated bgs (and at a higher rating than your arena rating, I believe) to remain competitively geared in order to play while everyone is actually grinding up.

[Deleted]

Yeah, I understand that and find it quite unfair and stupid, but the point I was trying to make is that the actual arena players who succeed in the aforementioned side of PvP should still be able to perform when put up against players with slightly (or even considerably) better gear. Not to mention this is only valid or maybe 2 and a half-ish months of arena (taking into account most arena players are able to sustain a 1900~ point cap a week without RBGs) because by then, even arena-only players will be fully geared regardless. In TBC this would be outrageous, seeing as it'd leave you like a month or two at best to actually play against equally geared players but taking into account seasons last for like half a year these days, I don't think it'll be too hard to handle this if it goes by unchanged. Which I REALLY hope it does not.

[Thundercougr]

I said this before and I'll say it again. They should bring back Skirmishes, but let them award honor. That way there is a competing-tier system between Arena and Battlegrounds. Skirmish gives honor, battlegrounds give honor. Arena gives Conquest, RBG gives Conquest. Skirmish would serve the same purpose as non-rated BGs: allow you to practice strategies while gearing yourself up.

[kombucha]

I said this before and I'll say it again. They should bring back Skirmishes, but let them award honor. That way there is a competing-tier system between Arena and Battlegrounds. Skirmish gives honor, battlegrounds give honor. Arena gives Conquest, RBG gives Conquest. Skirmish would serve the same purpose as non-rated BGs: allow you to practice strategies while gearing yourself up.

You'd still get griefers in 2200 gear Qing just to ruin people's days.

[Frozen Death Knight]

That makes more sense then to have people be forced to play RBGs to get actual POINTS to fill the cap that they got from either RBG or arena, but it's still shit. I mean, I don't plan on ever being rated below 2800+ on any of my characters, so I guess I'd end up with quite a high cap anyway but a change like this would wreck mid-rated teams (2200~) in arena.

Plus 2044 rating in arena is SO little, and awarding such a high cap for it (more than enough for people to buy at least one "big" set piece per week) is just ludicrous. I think I only maxed out my weekly cap at around 2750 rating this season, and now any idiot that spams rated BGs, regardless of winning or losing is going to get 3k point cap just by being what? 2400 rated in BGs? Fuck off.

This wouldn't bother me too much because of what I've already said, I don't plan on being low rated so I'll get my cap up one way or the other BUT it's going to suck major dick for the avarage PvPer, and that's extremely unfair. But at least it's a *bit* better than the alternative, which is having to play RBGs to fill out one third or half of your weekly cap (at least from what I can decode out of the vague notes they gave).

More notes on this please, it's fucking groundbreaking.

I agree. As someone who has only focused on rated BGs with my PvP guild, I think the changes they made to Conquest Points in 4.2, so far, is a huge kick in the nuts to any serious PvPer.

The problem doesn't lie in the Conquest Points, when it comes to the low participation in rated BGs. The issue is the difficulty of forming a proper 10 man to participate. Heck, even as a hardcore PvP guild, we have trouble forming them, simply because our demands are extremely high, and we have to rely a lot on the least represented role in PvP, which is tanks, that are a huge pain in the ass to find. I can not even imagine how it is on servers with barely any PvP community, especially when my server, Grim Batol, has one of the biggest PvP communities in Europe and still suffer from the lack of available tanks with good PvP gear.

Blizzard should have focused development time on fixing rated BGs so teams are easier to put together. Then Conquest Points would not be much of an issue, really.