The League of Legends thread

[NotValidAnymore]

Hexdrinker, Maw of Malmortius(?) and Mercurial Scimitar are all items you can get for AD champs.

[Deleted]

I build 20 MR, and the enemy builds 20 magic pen.

With that kind of thinking, it might as well not build any kind of defenses like armor or MR. They're just going to get armor/magic pen so it won't matter.

Wrong.

You should build MR if the team is heavy AP or you just need a defense against that one AP or AD champion. Every little mr and/or armor counts and makes the other champion do less damage, even if s/he has one item nullifying one of your's, like the sorc boots taking out 20 MR(assuming it does that, I have no idea if 20 magic pen takes out 20 mr, I doubt it to be honest I don't know, so I digress on this). It's better to have those 20 MR than not having them, it's still making you more tanky to mr.

Though keep in mind that he is nullifying your item or part of it but so are you nullifying his item or part of his item.

I might not be explaining this very well but just because someone has magic/armor pen doesn't mean you shouldn't be building MR or/and armor to counter that.

Who is better off? the enemy ofcourse, because magic pen items also offer damage (only MP item without AP are boots), and MR items dont't offer any damage unless you can use atack speed (wits end) or AP (which is, ironically, what Yi often builds).

Abyssal Scepter and Mercurial Scimitar comes to mind.

Even so, just because a defense item doesn't give you some kind of damage doesn't mean it's shit or that you shouldn't get it despite having/giving you no damage. It's still giving you a defense and survivability which ultimately, will allow you to survive damage for longer, it basically means you'll be doing more damage.

Sometimes, defense items allow you to do more damage, with certain champions of course, than with pure damage items.

Hexdrinker, Maw of Malmortius(?) and Mercurial Scimitar are all items you can get for AD champs.

Yeah, the bolded ones too. I forgot those.

[personn5]

(assuming it does that, I have no idea if 20 magic pen takes out 20 mr, I doubt it to be honest I don't know, so I digress on this)

It should, but it can't reduce it below 0.

[Deleted]

building MR only takes you so far.

I build 20 MR, and the enemy builds 20 magic pen.
Who is better off? the enemy ofcourse, because magic pen items also offer damage (only MP item without AP are boots), and MR items dont't offer any damage unless you can use atack speed (wits end) or AP (which is, ironically, what Yi often builds).

Actually MR is cheaper than MPen so the person buying MR is better off than the person building MPen.

[Kaj392]

I was pretty sure you were saying that skins like Gladiator Draven, Cass's greek skin and the new Morgana skin should only be available to the people from those countries, then you said about trading them to other regions. This is what you said, right?

Because if that's what you said, and I'm pretty sure that's what you said, that's just complicating things for everyone outside of that country to which the skin is dedicated to.

There's no point in making a trading system for skins, that are only obtainable in country X, in LoL.

If that's what you didn't mean to say then I have no idea what you meant and you'll need to be more clear.

(That was responding to the bolded part on the first quote on this post)

Now, responding to this:

Yes, I agree that Riot can make a buttload of skins with that idea.

People in specific country´s could get it, but seeing how a lot of country´s are part of a region (let's take EU-W) you could see them all on the region but you can only obtain said skin if you live in country X.

Some skins could actually be pretty easy to identify;
Garen with a French hat/what not and a baguette. His ult is a huge baguette.
Singed in a Dutch cheese girl outfit with green weed leaves for gas. His slow could be a huge weed leaf.
Greece has Mystic Cassio.
Spain Matador Alistar.
Some country's could be a bit annoying tho yes. But i am sure there are solutions for that too.


The skin trading would be out of the line cause yeah, they wouldn't be unique / specific anymore then.
But, like with everything people whine and cry about every little thing so that's why trading would be a better option.
And ofcourse the "OH MY GOD YOUR COUNTRY HAS X-CHAMP WITH Y-SKIN OMG RIOT PLOX ME WANTS" ^

[Deleted]

It should, but it can't reduce it below 0.

Ah, okay. Cool. I really didn't know that.

People in specific country´s could get it, but seeing how a lot of country´s are part of a region (let's take EU-W) you could see them all on the region but you can only obtain said skin if you live in country X.

What you mean "get it"? Do you mean get it for free? If so, yes, they are already doing that for sure.

And I still think the "you can only get skin X if you live in region X" is completely not okay for anyone outside of said region.

Some country's could be a bit annoying tho yes. But i am sure there are solutions for that too.

If Riot ever does more skins like that, which I'm fairly certain they could or they would just associate current ones to countries like several skins were done with the launch of the Russian server, I wouldn't know if sticking to current generalizations and/or stereotypes would be good for them since it would most certainly cause a big ruckus.

The skin trading would be out of the line cause yeah, they wouldn't be unique / specific anymore then.
But, like with everything people whine and cry about every little thing so that's why trading would be a better option.
And ofcourse the "OH MY GOD YOUR COUNTRY HAS X-CHAMP WITH Y-SKIN OMG RIOT PLOX ME WANTS" ^

Skin trading would be great yes but like Hippalus has said, it wouldn't be a great thing since it can be easily exploited.

See here for some reasoning to why it wouldn't be exactly a good thing: http://www.surrenderat20.net/2013/04...ng-system.html.

[Deleted]

Singed in a Dutch cheese girl outfit with green weed leaves for gas. His slow could be a huge weed leaf.

Couldn't help but laugh at this one as a fellow Dutch person.
I'd think cheese girl Sona would be more fitting... or Admiral Gangplank.
I dunno lol, we don't have any unique soldiers lol.

[S2omegaS2]

building MR only takes you so far.

I build 20 MR, and the enemy builds 20 magic pen.
Who is better off? the enemy ofcourse, because magic pen items also offer damage (only MP item without AP are boots), and MR items dont't offer any damage unless you can use atack speed (wits end) or AP (which is, ironically, what Yi often builds).

Actually he is worse off...you are forcing him into magic pen items so he doesn't just stack deathcaps or something else ridiculous and 1 shot everyone in one 'q' lol

[Aydinx2]

Actually he is worse off...you are forcing him into magic pen items so he doesn't just stack deathcaps or something else ridiculous and 1 shot everyone in one 'q' lol

Let's take master Yi for example.
Against a high MR enemy he will build:

Pen boots
Liandry's torment
Rabadon
Lich bane
Void staff or Abbysal scepter
Rylai's crystal scepter

3 of these will give him alot of magic pen, while still allowing him to build the rabadon and a decent amount of health he probably doesn't even need (notice how EVERY item except boots gives him a good amount of ability power, even though he's stacking magic pen).

Magic pen is so strong not because it penetrates magic resist, but because it (save boots) always comes with a good amount of AP, allowing you to increase your damage and reduce the effectiveness of MR on the enemy.

---------- Post added 2013-05-13 at 06:27 PM ----------

...

So an AD champ can pick 2 items that give AD aswell as MR, which is still less than an AP could pick (sucks if you're not an AD champ).
Besides, we're talking about building MR against a Yi, so you might aswell be an AP champ yourself, which is actually worse.

[Deleted]

Yi doesn't need and shouldn't get Liandry's. There's better item choices for him other than that(DFG ftw). It's pretty much a waste of gold.

Also, yes, magic pen is strong but I honestly don't know what you're trying to say now because of what you said earlier, Aydinx2. Again, magic pen is strong but so is mr and not getting mr because someone else has magic pen is silly.

[Boomcats]

Not to mention you just listed about 17k plus worth of items right there. I mean if Yi has all those items 1 of two things is happening:

1.) You are getting utterly stomped why haven't you surrendered yet?!
2.) You have 17k worth of items (or in the ballpark) and your ADC/Top can 4 shot Yi

There is legit no excuse to not build MR unless you are the ADC and you don't have ANY damage items yet. MR is scarce to come by in S3, but not having a bulwark/locket on your team is just asking for a loss. There is a direct correlation between the amount of lockets/bulwarks I have seen per game vs. the higher I get placement wise.

I honestly can't remember the last gold game I was in that didn't have them.

[Aydinx2]

Yi doesn't need and shouldn't get Liandry's. There's better item choices for him other than that(DFG ftw). It's pretty much a waste of gold.

Also, yes, magic pen is strong but I honestly don't know what you're trying to say now because of what you said earlier, Aydinx2. Again, magic pen is strong but so is mr and not getting mr because someone else has magic pen is silly.

What I'm saying is that MR is not as great as people think.
Yes you should build it against AP enemies, but don't build too much because they'll just stack magic pen untill your MR isn't worth anything.

I never said you shouldn't build MR.
I just said that you can build it but the enemy can build around it with magic pen and still deal loads of damage.

[Deleted]

What I'm saying is that MR is not as great as people think.

But it's not as bad as you make it sound nor is magic pen as good as you make it sound.

Yes you should build it against AP enemies, but don't build too much because they'll just stack magic pen untill your MR isn't worth anything.

In return you can equally build tons of MR to counter their tons of magic pen then. It works both ways.

I just said that you can build it but the enemy can build around it with magic pen and still deal loads of damage.

You can also build around magic pen with MR, and hp too. Again, it works both ways, it just depends on what you build to counter the other item.

[Deleted]

What I'm saying is that MR is not as great as people think.
Yes you should build it against AP enemies, but don't build too much because they'll just stack magic pen untill your MR isn't worth anything.

I never said you shouldn't build MR.
I just said that you can build it but the enemy can build around it with magic pen and still deal loads of damage.

Unless the player has a void staff MR is more cost effective than MP. The reason why MR against a 3x AP + support team is so good is because the mid laner is often the only player who builds a void staff, so all their MP items are basically useless against you. And seeing as there are plenty of items that offers hp + mr or damage + mr you may as well build it into your build. While a full out AP or AD team rarely happens you should still take into consideration how your item build affects the opponent.

[Boomcats]

Not to mention health scales INCREDIBLY well versus AP champs, even if they have Liandry's.

Look at two champions: 1 that builds MR and 1 that doesnt.

Assume your Yi has the following items: (because this is a realistic game and not SUPER FED Yi where your scenario has no relevance to a real game)

Sorc boots
Lichbane
Liandrys (why does he have this? Its awful on him but whatever)
Void Staff

Thats a pretty fed Yi regardless: but compare it to champion A and B

A has a teammate with a Bulwark, and built 1 MR item (say a scimitar), and has blue flat MR runes- we can blindly call that 105 MR
B built no MR at all and comes out to a flat 60 MR (I believe the max a champ can have before building any MR is around 50)

With your items listed above, Champion A would have about 33 MR (Yi has 8% M pen from masteries) and Champ B would have about 5. Thats a difference of about 33% reduction with almost none. That means Yi is doing 2/3's (!!!!!!) the damage he should be. Thats a huge difference, and if you can't see that... well I don't know what to say.

These are all real general approximations, and we can get nitty gritty if you want with exact runes and masteries, but blindly saying Mpen is better then MR is wrong.

[S2omegaS2]

Let's take master Yi for example.
Against a high MR enemy he will build:

Pen boots
Liandry's torment
Rabadon
Lich bane
Void staff or Abbysal scepter
Rylai's crystal scepter

3 of these will give him alot of magic pen, while still allowing him to build the rabadon and a decent amount of health he probably doesn't even need (notice how EVERY item except boots gives him a good amount of ability power, even though he's stacking magic pen).

Magic pen is so strong not because it penetrates magic resist, but because it (save boots) always comes with a good amount of AP, allowing you to increase your damage and reduce the effectiveness of MR on the enemy.

---------- Post added 2013-05-13 at 06:27 PM ----------



So an AD champ can pick 2 items that give AD aswell as MR, which is still less than an AP could pick (sucks if you're not an AD champ).
Besides, we're talking about building MR against a Yi, so you might aswell be an AP champ yourself, which is actually worse.

and the point I was trying to make is that if you allow him to ignore magic pen, then he can do some all in ap build and probably get double the ap then the normal build.

[Riboe]

Fuck yeah!

Been in the hospital for a week. Only played two games this week. Both of them were normals.

Tonight, I decided to do some YOLO queue... This is what happened:



7 wins in a row, all with amazing teammates and absolutely no ragers or whiners.

Gold V, finally!

[Boomcats]

and the point I was trying to make is that if you allow him to ignore magic pen, then he can do some all in ap build and probably get double the ap then the normal build.

Well under your scenario you wouldn't be doing that great either. Lets just say he gets to 500 AP (which is high, not absurd but VERY high) and only built sorc boots.

With about 100 MR you would take roughly 50% less damage from that Yi, meaning his Q would do about 400- which is substiantially less then if you just built some basic Mpen or Magic resist reduction.

The takeaway isn't to stack one thing or the other (although certain cases are different like Elise) its about a balance. Don't blindly build AP when they are 100+ MR and don't blindly stack Mpen either- its a mix of both.

[Firebert]

Gz Riboe.

I just won my third placement match as jungle Warwick (went 5/5), I was splitpushing the whole time at the endgame, and they couldn't catch me because there'd always be a member of their party below half, and they all grouped up to gank me.

[hasslehoof]

People in specific country´s could get it, but seeing how a lot of country´s are part of a region (let's take EU-W) you could see them all on the region but you can only obtain said skin if you live in country X.

Some skins could actually be pretty easy to identify;
Garen with a French hat/what not and a baguette. His ult is a huge baguette.
Singed in a Dutch cheese girl outfit with green weed leaves for gas. His slow could be a huge weed leaf.
Greece has Mystic Cassio.
Spain Matador Alistar.
Some country's could be a bit annoying tho yes. But i am sure there are solutions for that too.


The skin trading would be out of the line cause yeah, they wouldn't be unique / specific anymore then.
But, like with everything people whine and cry about every little thing so that's why trading would be a better option.
And ofcourse the "OH MY GOD YOUR COUNTRY HAS X-CHAMP WITH Y-SKIN OMG RIOT PLOX ME WANTS" ^

Patriot Urgot
Can be a fat guy wearing a Bane mask on a mobility scooter that shoots french fries at people.

riot pls.