Building PC Ideas V2

[Djinni]

Updated with new build

Ok, You may have noticed over the past 2 months I've been bombarding these forums with questions and comparisons between various products, you might even remember me asking for a overview of a "similar" spec a while ago. (And here is why I started planning so early :P it shows me what's around, what its worth and more importantly gives me time to change my mind!). Here's why:


Plan/TimeFrame: Start of September I will be going back to Uni, and will need to sort myself out a new PC for use, I plan to build this in August to give me a chance to make sure that everything works properly before taking it to Uni (This and I decided it would make far more sense to build it at home rather than send 20 boxes to my Uni address and expect none of them to get damaged.)

The reason I am looking for opinions/advise now is because I have been advised that some of the items listed in the proposed spec will take up to 3 weeks to arrive and I intend to go down and collect everything from store in one go.

Budget: roughly £1200 ex VAT
Location: England/UK
Site of prefference: http://www.novatech.co.uk


Things I already have:
External USB Creative SoundBlaster Live 24-bit soundcard,
Microsoft Media Centre remote control,
Creative 5.1 surround sound speaker system,
Samsung 2233RZ 120hz 22" 3D screen + glasses, (I'm not opposed to selling this so I can get 2 screens the same.)
Samsung 226BW 60Hz 22" screen,
(Rather battered) Logitech USB Headset (Current comparable is: http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/p...81-000262.html ) - This needs replacing but as I'm already over budget may have to wait a few months (That or annoy the girlfriend enough to get her to buy me a headset :P).


What the machine will be doing:
I will need to be running up to 5 simultainious Virtual Machines (typically 2 or 3) running graphically based simulations, a little bit of graphical design in Adobe and playing WoW with FRAPS and pretty much everything maxxed out pretty much whenever I'm not at Uni, browsing the web, listening to music watching movies all that jazz.
Expected average usage while gaming:
- Web Browser / Ventrilo + Messenger programs on screen 1, game on screen 2 (center), Movie on screen 3
Expected work usage:
- VM Workstation x2 on Screen 1, Web browser on screen 2, VM Workstation on screen 3
^- Assuming Screen 1 = Left, Screen 2 = Centre, Screen 3 = Right.


Gaming includes:
World of Warcraft, StarCraft:BroodWar, StarCraft2, Crysis, Crysis: Warhead, Crysis2, StarWars:The Old Republic, StarWars:Knights of the Old Republic, BioShock, BioShock2, Halo, Halo2, Stargate:Resistance, WarCraft 3: The Frozen Throne.


I intend to expand my current 2 screen setup to a 3 screen one preferably in a way that would allow me the option to game across all 3 (not a requirement since it would only be for showing off, unless I find I really like it.) To this end I have opted to go for a single ATI card rather than a NVIDA card. (If you can do a dual or single NVIDIA card setup that would allow me to continue using my NVIDIA 3D bundle AND use 3 screens independently please advise)


What I'm looking for from you:
Information!:
Will there be any significant advancements that would change the specs of the machine I buy between now and september?
What suggestions for upgrades do you have, and can you build it cheaper.
Additional opinions on other hardware:
I need to try and reduce the build cost somehow, by substituting various components for cheaper ones with close to the same performance.

		Remove				Item Description		Quantity		Unit Price (ex vat)		Line Total (ex vat)
						LG E2350VR-SN 23" Full HD LED Monitor 27 in stock LG-E2350VR		1		£108.32		£108.32
						Thermaltake Chaser MK-I Tower Case - Black (No PSU) 6 in stock TT-CHASER1		1		£99.98		£99.98
						Corsair HX 850W ATX2.2 Modular SLI Compliant Power Supply 9 in stock CSR-HX850		1		£104.16		£104.16
						Intel Core i5 2500K 3.30GHz (Sandy Bridge) Socket LGA1155 - Retail. 17 in stock IL-I52500K		1		£133.32		£133.32
						Asus P8Z68-V PRO Intel Z68 (Socket 1155) Motherboard 2 in stock ASU-Z68VP		1		£133.32		£133.32
						Noctua NH-D14 Dual Radiator and Fan CPU Cooler 4 in stock NOC-NHD14		1		£56.66		£56.66
						G.Skill Ripjaws-X 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3 PC3-12800 1600MHz Dual Channel Kit 29 in stock GSK-RJ8GC9		1		£54.16		£54.16
						MSI GeForce GTX 560TI Twin FrozR II 1024MB GDDR5 PCIe 16 in stock MSI-560TF		2		£149.99		£299.98
						LiteOn IHAS124-19 24x DVD+/-RW SATA Black - OEM 22 in stock LIT-IHAS12		1		£14.16		£14.16
						Samsung Spin Point F3 SATAII 1TB 32MB Cache Hard Drive <8.9ms 7200rpm - OEM 50+ in stock SAM-F31TB		3		£34.15		£102.45
						Cooler Master Mega-Flow Blue LED Silent Fan - 200mm 2 in stock CM-MF200B		2		£8.33		£16.66
						Arctic Cooling F High Performance Case Fan - 120mm Out of stock: 23 Due Tomorrow ARC-F12		1		£3.33		£3.33
						Saitek Cyborg V7 Gaming Keyboard 1 in stock SAI-V7CYBG		1		£47.47		£47.47
						Saitek Cyborg Rat7 Gaming Mouse 3 in stock SAI-RAT7		1		£63.82		£63.82
						Saitek Cyborg Glide 7 Gaming Surface Out of stock: 50+ at Suppliers SAI-GLIDE7		1		£12.49		£12.49
						Creative Inspire T3130 2.1 Speaker System 3 in stock CRE-T3130		1		£31.64		£31.64

If you have a Novatech Promotional Code please enter it below and press the submit button. Delivery Options: -- Collect from store -- Monday 25 July 2011 (Next Working Day Service) £8.79 Wednesday 27 July 2011 (Economy Service) £5.79 Friday 29 July 2011 (Free 3-4 Day Service) £0.00 Monday 25 July 2011 (Pre-12 Next Working Day Service) £10.78 Saturday 23 July 2011 (Saturday Service) £17.79
	Total Basket Ex VAT: £1281.92 ex vat Delivery Charge: 0.00 ex vat Basket + Delivery Ex VAT: £1281.92 ex vat VAT @ 20%: £256.38 Total Basket Value: £1538.30 inc vat

Q. Why am I using Novatech?
A. Becuase they have all the bonuses of being an online store as well as having outlets and repair centres I can physically take things back to if they don't work properly.
A2. They offer free lifetime technical support.
A3. Dad has a business account with them so everything I do gets fast tracked! As well as the VAT being refunded pretty much automagaically. Since I do do alot of work for him on my machines. (Main reason for me not going elsewhere)
A4. In the extreamly unlikely event that any components don't work properly, they actually have "stores" I can walk into and get same day replacements/repairs.

P.S I also tend to play WoW in fullscreen windowed mode! When not running in 3D.
P.S.S. Unfortunately unless a mod can reverse all the edit's I've done to the original thread there's no way to see what my last planned setup was

[Skelly]

The PSU is a little large for your setup, but I think we covered that in your last thread so I'll leave that be.
Just beware that if you're going to Xfire in the future, Xfire does not support windowed mode in any game (I found out the hard way), while SLI does. I don't know anything about the 3D stuff though.

You won't be seeing any new tech between now and September in terms of CPUs and GPUs.
New cases and other components could come out at any time so you never know about those.

With what you're trying to accomplish, I wouldn't really suggest downgrading any particular part in there. I can really only suggest maybe waiting on a couple of less necessary parts until you get more money - 3rd monitor, keyboard/mouse (I'm sure you already have some).

[Djinni]

The PSU is a little large for your setup, but I think we covered that in your last thread so I'll leave that be.
Just beware that if you're going to Xfire in the future, Xfire does not support windowed mode in any game (I found out the hard way), while SLI does. I don't know anything about the 3D stuff though.

You won't be seeing any new tech between now and September in terms of CPUs and GPUs.
New cases and other components could come out at any time so you never know about those.

With what you're trying to accomplish, I wouldn't really suggest downgrading any particular part in there. I can really only suggest maybe waiting on a couple of less necessary parts until you get more money - 3rd monitor, keyboard/mouse (I'm sure you already have some).

Are you serious!!? What a waste....

​Nope... sold them (The keyboard and mouse anyway... kinda regret selling the keyboard now I see it'll cost me £100 to replace it.....

[vesseblah]

I intend to expand my current 2 screen setup to a 3 screen one preferably in a way that would allow me the option to game across all 3 (not a requirement since it would only be for showing off, unless I find I really like it.) To this end I have opted to go for a single ATI card rather than a NVIDA card. (If you can do a dual or single NVIDIA card setup that would allow me to continue using my NVIDIA 3D bundle AND use 3 screens independently please advise)
P.S I also tend to play WoW in fullscreen windowed mode! When not running in 3D.

With Nvidia cards you need SLI setup to run three monitors, and three is the maximum. With AMD cards you can get up to 6 monitors. Also the 3D glasses will not work with AMD cards, and as mentioned above, you can not run WoW as windowed-fullscreen on crossfire, only with SLI. Or single card.

Will there be any significant advancements that would change the specs of the machine I buy between now and september?
What suggestions for upgrades do you have, and can you build it cheaper.

Nothing new significant is coming out until then.

Easy places to save money is downgrading CPU to i5-2500K since the 2600K is worthless for your planned use, and getting cheaper keyboard/mouse/mousepads. Also depending on what exactly you're doing with VMs 8GB of RAM is probably enough.

[Djinni]

With Nvidia cards you need SLI setup to run three monitors, and three is the maximum. With AMD cards you can get up to 6 monitors. Also the 3D glasses will not work with AMD cards, and as mentioned above, you can not run WoW as windowed-fullscreen on crossfire, only with SLI. Or single card.

Yeah saw that on the official thing but there were lots of forum posts on both AMD/ATI and NVIDIA forums that said that ATI users had used their NVIDIA 3D Vision with an ATI card. Even with games consoles. (PS3 / XBOX 360)

Easy places to save money is downgrading CPU to i5-2500K since the 2600K is worthless for your planned use, and getting cheaper keyboard/mouse/mousepads. Also depending on what exactly you're doing with VMs 8GB of RAM is probably enough.

Networking simulations, with varying OS's both client and server.

I saw the i5 as a way to drop too... but everyone I talked too outside of these forums said that the i7 HyperThreading will be a great benifit for my multi-tasking tendancy + VM use.

[Sephiracle]

Nothing new significant is coming out until then.

Easy places to save money is downgrading CPU to i5-2500K since the 2600K is worthless for your planned use, and getting cheaper keyboard/mouse/mousepads. Also depending on what exactly you're doing with VMs 8GB of RAM is probably enough.

Some would say Bulldozer is pretty significant.

[Skelly]

Some would say Bulldozer is pretty significant.

I'm pretty sure Bulldozer is (currently) slated for Q4 release. He needs his computer in Q3

[Djinni]

I'm pretty sure Bulldozer is (currently) slated for Q4 release. He needs his computer in Q3

I **COULD*** get a "lower spec"/cheaper CPU to upgrade later (before Christmas) but i'm fairly sure Bulldozer won't use the AM3 socket.. So yeah probably wouldn't be worth it.

[Sephiracle]

has it been pushed to q4? Last I heard end of Julyish.

[Skelly]

has it been pushed to q4? Last I heard end of Julyish.

This is from an article from late May by SemiAccurate:
"Bulldozer, originally expected to ship in Q3 will now ship in Q3, but late Q3 instead of early. SemiAccurate is now hearing August for the desktop part ... but no real volume until Q4."

And TBH, I won't believe those dates until I see stock in my local E-tailer's E-shelves.

[Djinni]

:S

AMD Finalizes Shipment Dates for Next-Gen Chips.AMD FX-Series "Bulldozer" to Ship in June, "Llano" to Land in Early July
[03/07/2011 04:57 PM]
by Anton Shilov
Advanced Micro Devices has finalized shipments schedules of its future microprocessors, according to industrial sources. The world's second largest designer of x86 microprocessors will begin commercial shipments of its high-end FX-series chips based on Bulldozer micro-architecture in the second half of June and will initiate supplies of A-series code-named Llano accelerated processing units (APUs) in early July.
Shipments of AMD FX-series high-end desktop microprocessors will commence on the week of June 20th, 2011; Supplies of A-series APUs will begin on the week of July 4th, 2011, according to industrial sources. As expected, AMD's Bulldozer central processing units for desktops will become available earlier than Llano APUs. As a result, AMD will be able to create a "halo" effect for its microprocessor lineup with a high-end offering that is projected to outperform existing Phenom II chips by 50%.
Based on a document seen by X-bit labs, AMD plans to release four eight-core AMD FX8000-series chips, two six-core AMD FX6000-series microprocessors and two quad-core AMD FX4000-series central processing units (CPUs) this year; four chips are to be launched in Q2 2011, another four processors will be introduced in Q4 2011. The amount of quad-core and dual-core A-series APUs to be released this calendar year will be eleven, if the plans do not change.
One of the intrigues that remain is the formal launch date of the new CPUs and APUs by AMD. Some expect the company to introduce its desktops chips with Bulldozer micro-architecture at the E3 trade-show.
AMD did not comment on the news-story.

From: http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/dis...Gen_Chips.html

I see the Llano...

AMD LIano A8-3850 2.9GHz (Socket FM1) APU Processor - Retail Integrated HD 6550D Graphics, Quad-Core Technology, 2.90GHz Clock Speed, 600MHz GPU Clock Speed, 4MB L2 Cache, 400 Radeon Cores, 3 Year Warranty. Order Code: Manf. Code: AMD-A83850 AD3850WNGXBOX

AMD

40 in stock

£104.99

Wasn't it June last month?

[vesseblah]

Networking simulations, with varying OS's both client and server.

Probably dont need much of RAM, and would run well enough with 8GB. Unless you need to simulate very heavy loads also and using real server software in laboratory environment and not just basic network connectivity.

I saw the i5 as a way to drop too... but everyone I talked too outside of these forums said that the i7 HyperThreading will be a great benifit for my multi-tasking tendancy + VM use.

VMs need real cores, HT does not play well with it. For heavy duty VMs on a budget I'd be more inclined towards AMD's 6-core Phenoms, but you'll probably benefit more from the faster clock speed of Intel cores since you are running only 2-3 VMs at once.

[Drunkenvalley]

It's July, before that was June, now August comes afterwaaaaaaaaaaa~rds.
/shot for Friday reference

Anyway, Jesus, it's already been that long that it's relevant again for your thread, Djinni? Holy cow, I hadn't realized. Time flies it seems.

[Sephiracle]

Eventually you'll just have to put your foot down and buy something. Just know what options you have in the future if you go one way or another.

You could pick a AM3+ board and a AM3 processor right now and get bulldozer when its actually out, just like you can buy a Sandy Bridge setup and buy an Ivy when it comes out(assuming h/p67 mobo)

[BicycleMafioso]

Are you serious!!? What a waste....

Gaming in windowed mode isn't very fun either way! Esp with an eyefinity-setup. :P

[Skelly]

Gaming in windowed mode isn't very fun either way! Esp with an eyefinity-setup. :P

I could not possibly live without windowed mode!! I have to be able to post on these forums while I play WoW

But yeah, I bought a 5970 last summer. It was my first build ever. I did a lot of research, so I knew a fair bit, but not enough I guess. So I'm basically running a very expensive 5850 XD

[Djinni]

Probably dont need much of RAM, and would run well enough with 8GB. Unless you need to simulate very heavy loads also and using real server software in laboratory environment and not just basic network connectivity.

The real heavy loads I can do in Uni with dedicated physical machines/hardware, rather than virtual ones.

VMs need real cores, HT does not play well with it. For heavy duty VMs on a budget I'd be more inclined towards AMD's 6-core Phenoms, but you'll probably benefit more from the faster clock speed of Intel cores since you are running only 2-3 VMs at once.

I had the AMD Phenom II X4 920 before... and loved it... but found I played too much WoW....

---------- Post added 2011-07-13 at 07:55 PM ----------

It's July, before that was June, now August comes afterwaaaaaaaaaaa~rds.
/shot for Friday reference

Anyway, Jesus, it's already been that long that it's relevant again for your thread, Djinni? Holy cow, I hadn't realized. Time flies it seems.

Yep :-) And everyday since that first thread i've been tweaking my build :-)

---------- Post added 2011-07-13 at 07:57 PM ----------

Gaming in windowed mode isn't very fun either way! Esp with an eyefinity-setup. :P

Just to be sure... I only need eyefinity enabled when I want to SPAN the 3 screens.... otherwise I can disable eyefinity and use each screen individually as an extended display like you normally do with a 2 screen setup? Do I even have to disable/enable it it?

---------- Post added 2011-07-13 at 07:58 PM ----------

Eventually you'll just have to put your foot down and buy something. Just know what options you have in the future if you go one way or another.

You could pick a AM3+ board and a AM3 processor right now and get bulldozer when its actually out, just like you can buy a Sandy Bridge setup and buy an Ivy when it comes out(assuming h/p67 mobo)

Yeah,.... and from what i've read it's pretty easy to see Ivy bridge mopping the floor with Bulldozer.... (and its a Z68... see above? :-))

---------- Post added 2011-07-13 at 08:06 PM ----------

Wondering... would 2x 2tb raid0's be better or just 1?
OS+ Games + music + movies on one, and use the other as a scratch drive? Although i'm not usually big on the deleting stuff thing...

[BicycleMafioso]

Just to be sure... I only need eyefinity enabled when I want to SPAN the 3 screens.... otherwise I can disable eyefinity and use each screen individually as an extended display like you normally do with a 2 screen setup? Do I even have to disable/enable it it?

Yea. You can set up different profiles in CCC. Eyefinity and landscape, for instance.

[Sephiracle]

Yeah,.... and from what i've read it's pretty easy to see Ivy bridge mopping the floor with Bulldozer.... (and its a Z68... see above? :-))

There's always something on the horizon with computers.

[Ghâzh]

Wondering... would 2x 2tb raid0's be better or just 1?
OS+ Games + music + movies on one, and use the other as a scratch drive? Although i'm not usually big on the deleting stuff thing...

Definitely two raid0's or possibly one raid0 and one non-raid HDD if you're gonna do a lot of frapsing, should improve the performance for some bit.

Can't quite remember all your previous threads, did you already settle to no SSD?