Question about demonology reforging

[Demonickranz]

Alright from what I understand mastery is the most important thing to demonology after you reach 1996 haste rating, however it seems like alot of the gear in firelands (our tier especially) is lacking mastery and I recall hearing that you should not reforge haste into mastery only crit and excess hit, would this rule still apply?

Edit: fixed a typo

[Krunklock]

I think haste would be the last stat you would want to reforge into Mastery, but if you met the threshold, and couldn't drop the hit, then yea.

[Harsesis]

Your order of secondary stats is hit (close to cap but not over) -> mastery -> haste -> crit. Mastery has considerable more weight than haste and crit so go for extra hit and crit first and then go haste. Due to the amount of reforging required to get to hit cap I doubt you'll have haste pieces to spare.

[Penguin FTW]

1996 haste?

https://spreadsheets0.google.com/ccc...CKPti9oE#gid=7

[Frewt]

Indeed, you only need 1993 Haste. The 1995/6 Haste was floating about because the Haste% in the EJ post says you need 25% for the tick, but that is a rounded number. As you can see in the spreadsheet Penguin linked, you only need 24.973964% Haste for the tick, which is achievable with only 1993 Haste + Raid buffs.

It's better to not reforge Haste away and instead replace Haste/Mastery pieces with Crit/Mastery pieces if you can still reach 1993 Haste, as that will allow you to reforge Crit->Hit instead of Mastery->Hit.

Basicly you should plan your reforges such that you maximise Mastery while maintainging atleast ~15% Hit (the more the merrier) and 1993 Haste.

[Frewt]

The 1995/6 Haste thing was floating around because the EJ Demonology thread states you need 25% Haste for the Corruption tick, but this is a rounded figure. As shown in the spreadsheet Brokrone posted, you need ~24.97% Haste for the Corruption tick, which is achievable with 1993 Haste Rating + Raid Buffs.

To answer your question, you should plan your reforges to maximise Mastery while maintaining 1993 Haste and atleast 15% Hit (though the more the better). To maximise your Mastery you should consider swapping out Haste/Mastery pieces with Crit/Mastery, assuming you can maintain that 1993 Haste, as this will allow you to Reforge Crit->Hit instead of Mastery->Hit.

Edit: Would like to point out that too that you should of course be prioritising Intellect gains over these reforges. For example, today I upgraded from i372 Einhorn's Galoshes (HC Chimaeron) --> i391 Coalwalker Sandals (HC Shannox). In doing so I lost somewhere between 0.8 and 1 Mastery but gained +56 Intellect and opened new Reforging posibilities, allowing me to reach exactly 1993 Haste and gaining ~0.4% Hit Rating in the process.

[Penguin FTW]

http://www.wowreforge.com does an absolutely amazing job of optimizing it, I used to just double check my reforges but when 4.2 first came out and I got like the first rep piece or whatever it was, and the site beat out my reforges by 10 mastery so now I just go to it first.

Very useful, easy to use

[Greyarea]

Going by the current top simcraft for demo in heroic T12 gear, they ignore the 1995/6 haste corruption breakpoint and reforge alot of haste to mastery resulting in (as of right now, the profile may change) Haste: 1564 (12.21% haste unbuffed, 21.36% haste raid buffed with optimal raid set up) and having 1893 Mastery (18.56%). Also using the moonwell chalice which is 1700 mastery every 2 mins on use. the gear set up currently caps out at a hair over 35k DPS (http://elitistjerks.com/f80/t110222-...clysm_edition/)

So after saying that, your safe to drop haste for mastery it seems, just make sure your scale factors are similar to the simncrafted thing by running your own simcraft simulations and test out for yourself. Sometimes I find reforging haste to mastery to be a DPS boost, and others it's a minor loss so test with simcraft and find out that way.


EDIT: The demo set up in the link above also only has 16.01% hit (1640 hit). So it proves hit capping isn't needed for max DPS, infact if you want to maximise your DPS, 15-16% hit, not capping, seems to be the way to go about it.

[Frewt]

Wow, I'd never heard of wowreforge before - Looks incredible. Thanks for the link Penguin, will definitely be using that alot from now on

[dalliah1]

How important is it to reach that 1900 haste? My lock only has 798 without DI and 37% mastery

[Frewt]

You have 37 Mastery? What?

And yeah, right now in a mix of T11 Heroic and T12 pieces, shooting for 1993 Haste and stacking Mastery is best. Apparently, once you're in full BiS T12 Heroic gear though you should just go balls-to-the-wall and ignore the Corruption tick, Reforging Haste to Mastery where possible.

[dalliah1]

You have 37 Mastery? What?

And yeah, right now in a mix of T11 Heroic and T12 pieces, shooting for 1993 Haste and stacking Mastery is best. Apparently, once you're in full BiS T12 Heroic gear though you should just go balls-to-the-wall and ignore the Corruption tick, Reforging Haste to Mastery where possible.

1883 mastery RATING which equals 37% when you scroll over your mastery

[Frewt]

I apologise ^^'

So I'm guessing you're at around 18.5 Mastery? You'd have to run it through SimCraft - I recommend using the Action Priority List made by Eph on the EJ forums (Post #526 at the top of this page: http://elitistjerks.com/f80/t110222-...m_edition/p22/).

I imagine single-target DPS would be better with the Corruption tick and general increase in Casting Speed from the ~1100 Haste you're missing, but I could be wrong

Edit: In fact I'm fairly sure you're losing DPS by not having 1993 Haste - Warlocks with better gear than myself such as Jubeto in Paragon have over 17 Mastery while maintaining the Corruption tick so I imagine you're sacrificing too much DPS for too small a gain.

[dalliah1]

I apologise ^^'

So I'm guessing you're at around 18.5 Mastery? You'd have to run it through SimCraft - I recommend using the Action Priority List made by Eph on the EJ forums (Post #526 at the top of this page: http://elitistjerks.com/f80/t110222-...m_edition/p22/).

I imagine single-target DPS would be better with the Corruption tick and general increase in Casting Speed from the ~1100 Haste you're missing, but I could be wrong

The reforge optimizer that was linked in this thread is not telling me to focus on haste at all which is weird but it might be wrong

[Frewt]

You have to tell it your Scale Factors and in the bottom left tell it to get atleast 1993 Haste, otherwise it won't bother - It will see Mastery as your highest Scale Factor and just go for that.

Basically you need to tell the tool what you want - ie atleast 15% Hit and 1993 Haste

[dalliah1]

You have to tell it your Scale Factors and in the bottom left tell it to get atleast 1993 Haste, otherwise it won't bother - It will see Mastery as your highest Scale Factor and just go for that.

Basically you need to tell the tool what you want - ie atleast 15% Hit and 1993 Haste

Isn't it a little dangeous to run with 15% haste as a class that has nothing but long cast time spells? I didn't even run that low on my spriest

[Frewt]

Demonology gains much more from Mastery than it does from Haste. The only reason we maintained 1993 Haste during T11 and will continue to do so until wearing near BiS T12 Heroic gear was because the DPS gained from an extra Corruption tick outweighed the gain in Mastery.

The BiS T12 Heroic gearset for Demonology is currently using only 1564 Haste.

[Jessicka]

Demonology gains much more from Mastery than it does from Haste. The only reason we maintained 1993 Haste during T11 and will continue to do so until wearing near BiS T12 Heroic gear was because the DPS gained from an extra Corruption tick outweighed the gain in Mastery.

The BiS T12 Heroic gearset for Demonology is currently using only 1564 Haste.

The reason the stat weightings changed is in fact because simulationcraft now accounts for the Doomguard triple dipping with that stat.

[god of lock and pala]

lock combat rating prio

affli: haste>crit>mastery
destro: haste>crit>mastery
demo: mastery>haste>crit

on all the specs int is always better, and hit till cap.

so if u stand between the choise of a int trinket and some other trink always go for int. ofc if u have retarded questing int trink hc bell of somth from atremedes is better.

[Frewt]

The reason the stat weightings changed is in fact because simulationcraft now accounts for the Doomguard triple dipping with that stat.

Hmm, he gets 48% + 6% from Mastery yes? I'd forgotten about that when posting above. If Blizzard "fix" it (assuming it isn't intended - which is quite likely but you never know), would the T12 Heroic BiS list attempt to maintain the Corruption tick again?