[Megathread] Wildstar - Now F2P

[Acidbaron]

TTK score = gear progression mattering.

Also, name the RPG elements please.

Gear progression, abilities, talent points, quests.... You want to argue it's not an RPG really?

TTK, plays a role but i rather have my health constantly thrown down so that a fight can't last endlessly and i can't kite mobs just endlessly either. Taking damage from white hits is a soft enrage and that's better than merely having a timer in which you need to kill it in how i see it.

Also don't you think that if one aspect of the game had no white damage and all the rest did it comes across as inconsistent game design and confusing? It does for me.

[zito]

one word >>> RUBBISH

Logic >>> ministabber

[RoninaThorstone]

Gear progression, abilities, talent points, quests.... You want to argue it's not an RPG really?

TTK, plays a role but i rather have my health constantly thrown down so that a fight can't last endlessly and i can't kite mobs just endlessly either. Taking damage from white hits is a soft enrage and that's better than merely having a timer in which you need to kill it in how i see it.

Also don't you think that if one aspect of the game had no white damage and all the rest did it comes across as inconsistent game design and confusing? It does for me.

None of those matter for solo dungeons. Those things happen before end game.

Kill a boss too slowly, get nothing. Bronze/silver/gold for bad to good TTK.

[Tidezen]

None of those matter for solo dungeons. Those things happen before end game.

Kill a boss too slowly, get nothing. Bronze/silver/gold for bad to good TTK.

This guy gets it.

[Coldkil]

Well, a badge system would work good - we have already the experience of it in shiphands/adventures/dungeons.

I wouldn't get all the way to "you get 0 if you don't beat the timer" because i think these should be used as a progression system, so you start bad and climb up to gold; getting no reward at all means "you're too bad for this" and people would just get away.

Also lowerst reward tier can be made easy on purpose, so you get "cardboard medal for partecipation" and get small stuff; at least people won't have the feeling of wasting time on something they cannot complete.

[Calfredd]

Well, a badge system would work good - we have already the experience of it in shiphands/adventures/dungeons.

I wouldn't get all the way to "you get 0 if you don't beat the timer" because i think these should be used as a progression system, so you start bad and climb up to gold; getting no reward at all means "you're too bad for this" and people would just get away.

Also lowerst reward tier can be made easy on purpose, so you get "cardboard medal for participation" and get small stuff; at least people won't have the feeling of wasting time on something they cannot complete.

I would have thought a better motivator was something along the lines of "Here's a taste now try for the big enchilada" rather than "Game over. Try again" but I don't have anything to back that up so I can only guess.

Note: I am in agreement as to what you said.

[RoninaThorstone]

getting no reward at all means "you're too bad for this" and people would just get away.

I think it's okay to let people fail.
I think failure is an important learning mechanic.

We have to stop treating people like their emotional fortitude is that of a wet napkin or we are going to end up with people who can't enjoy video games because the players can't handle losing and thus the games aren't challenging enough to be fun.

[Acidbaron]

None of those matter for solo dungeons. Those things happen before end game.

Kill a boss too slowly, get nothing. Bronze/silver/gold for bad to good TTK.

It does matter to solo dungeons, again it is confusing game design. If white damage is reduced so it is factored in as a soft enrage it works much more consistent with existing systems.

Also i like how badges work now we shouldn't reward classes that can kill faster easily that much. Since there will always be a difference.

- - - Updated - - -

Well, a badge system would work good - we have already the experience of it in shiphands/adventures/dungeons.

I wouldn't get all the way to "you get 0 if you don't beat the timer" because i think these should be used as a progression system, so you start bad and climb up to gold; getting no reward at all means "you're too bad for this" and people would just get away.

Also lowerst reward tier can be made easy on purpose, so you get "cardboard medal for partecipation" and get small stuff; at least people won't have the feeling of wasting time on something they cannot complete.

You always get a reward for completing Shiphands, you get additional rewards if you get a medal that's how it currently works. If you can't complete it at all than well yeah, go back to pokemon comes to mind.

[Deleted]

We have to stop treating people like their emotional fortitude is that of a wet napkin or we are going to end up with people who can't enjoy video games because the players can't handle losing and thus the games aren't challenging enough to be fun.

Think we may have already crossed that mark

[RoninaThorstone]

Also i like how badges work now we shouldn't reward classes that can kill faster easily that much. Since there will always be a difference.

Different classes, different TTK bench marks.

Pretty easy fix.

(You could even have floating benchmarks that get adjusted each month where the top 5% sets the bar for gold, top 15% for silver, top 25% for bronze, and bottom 50% for nothing. It would be like a monthly ladder system)

[Acidbaron]

Different classes, different TTK bench marks.

Pretty easy fix.

(You could even have floating benchmarks that get adjusted each month where the top 5% sets the bar for gold, top 15% for silver, top 25% for bronze, and bottom 50% for nothing. It would be like a monthly ladder system)

Easy fix, perhaps. Expensive to tweak every class to different standards in different dungeons however. So i would argue how easy that is in reality considering it has to take into account class balance.

[RoninaThorstone]

Easy fix, perhaps. Expensive to tweak every class to different standards in different dungeons however. So i would argue how easy that is in reality considering it has to take into account class balance.

Where did I say that every class would have to be tweaked?
I said that TTK would be tweaked.

[Acidbaron]

Where did I say that every class would have to be tweaked?
I said that TTK would be tweaked.

What still boils down to tweaking every mob per class. If it was this easy to do why does no mmo actually do it with diverse classes?

[RoninaThorstone]

What still boils down to tweaking every mob per class. If it was this easy to do why does no mmo actually do it with diverse classes?

No, it doesn't require that if there is no white damage in solo dungeons.
Every class has a dodge, every class has a DPS tree.
If TTK goals for each class are set by the community performance, then the goals automatically balance for class differences.

You should stick to arguing against what I am saying instead of making things up.

[Acidbaron]

No, it doesn't require that if there is no white damage in solo dungeons.
Every class has a dodge, every class has a DPS tree.
If TTK goals for each class are set by the community performance, then the goals automatically balance for class differences.

You should stick to arguing against what I am saying instead of making things up.

How does removal of white damage, remove the need to tweak CC and damage done by each class to make it "balanced".

Set by community performance well ain't that a messy way of just throwing it out there and hoping for the best. Letting medals be determined by either the strongest or weakest of the class, bad bad idea.

[RoninaThorstone]

How does removal of white damage, remove the need to tweak CC and damage done by each class to make it "balanced".

Set by community performance well ain't that a messy way of just throwing it out there and hoping for the best. Letting medals be determined by either the strongest or weakest of the class, bad bad idea.

Removal of white damage makes it so every class can complete the content without having to adjust mob damage for armor class differences.

Community performance within classes is the best way to reward skill without rewarding FOTM classes. It's like having a 2400 MMR at playing a stalker when compared to other stalker players. That removes the need to tweak CC and damage done by each class.

[Acidbaron]

Removal of white damage makes it so every class can complete the content without having to adjust mob damage for armor class differences.

Community performance within classes is the best way to reward skill without rewarding FOTM classes. It's like having a 2400 MMR at playing a stalker when compared to other stalker players. That removes the need to tweak CC and damage done by each class.

A medal system should reward playing good and fast, not be about "the top 10" players. It simply creates a mess, if people think they can get gold they are motivated for it with a ranking system we both know it's going to set standards that are not going to be even reachable.

I though you were the guy all for accessibility, now you are preaching exclusivity on a rather major level.

[RoninaThorstone]

A medal system should reward playing good and fast, not be about "the top 10" players. It simply creates a mess, if people think they can get gold they are motivated for it with a ranking system we both know it's going to set standards that are not going to be even reachable.

I though you were the guy all for accessibility, now you are preaching exclusivity on a rather major level.

Access =/= free loot.
Access =/= easy mode.
Access = low barrier to entry (no grinds, no cross content reqs)
(Starting to think this is a language barrier issue because you can't STILL be strawmanning, right?)

Also, I told you it's not the "top 10 players", the medal system would be based off the scores of the top 5%/15%/25% every month but everyone can break the records set from the previous month as many times as they want.

[damonskye]

Actually it's not. It's facts. Sorry. Play programming semantics all you want. They're playing a game not designed for their system in any capacity and complaining about it.

You are COMPLETELY AND UTTERLY WRONG.

Let me state that again. YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY WRONG.

I own an iMac. I run Windows 7 on it via dual boot (Bootcamp). Windows 7 is designed to be run on the same Intel architecture as Macs these days.

Fact: Macs running Windows via Bootcamp *are Windows machines*. They do not differ from PCs in any capacity when configured to boot into Windows.

You are absolutely 100% without-a-doubt incorrect in your assessment.

Have I mentioned that you're wrong? You are.

And to bring this entirely back on point... a Mac owner playing Wildstar via Windows 7 is seeing Wildstar the same way our Windows 7 native PC brethren do. AND THE UI STILL SUCKS. Period.

[Deleted]

Performance is simply an issue of what hardware or architecture the Mac running Bootcamp is built on.

In layman's terms, if your Mac or Windows PC is rubbish.....it's rubbish, end of story