Sanctified Wrath change?

[leokegan]

The only change that can compesate for this is make wings undispellable, if not, imma quit my pally

[Handsylton]

If you speak like that, it's that you have never, ever, played Ret.

See the good thing, now we won't be brought to arena for our DPS Burst, but for our Heal Burst ! Nice to see a DPS spec turned into an offhealing PvP role.

Ret pally main for 3 years

The good thing is that we won't be brought for our DPS burst now, we'll be brought for our DPS burst AND our pressure we can put on the target more consistently, outside of ever 2 minutes that gets countered by fears, stuns, and everything else in the world of CC. OMG, that's so horrible!!

[nyc81991]

Nerfing the crit chance of HoW is them trying to keep Ret burst in check. Honestly we are getting buffed overall so its nothing to qq about imo.

[Korgard]

Handsy, are u mad? 50% more damage with judgement in exchange for 50% crit of HoW is "not a pain, not a gain" for PvE. But for PvP it is like deleting ret spec. So, over all, crap change tbh. We should get this bonus to judgement "for free".

[leokegan]

Mabye they should make templars verdict always give a holy power. So that it doesn't make any change to offhealing.

[Deleted]

Ret pally main for 3 years

The good thing is that we won't be brought for our DPS burst now, we'll be brought for our DPS burst AND our pressure we can put on the target more consistently, outside of ever 2 minutes that gets countered by fears, stuns, and everything else in the world of CC. OMG, that's so horrible!!

Except that other classes have fat better constant pressure; we'll have no DPS burst without HoW autocrit, compared to a War under Reckleness this is pure shit, same for a Dk under Pillar of Frost, a Feral under Berserk (loling hard at this one), and better PvP utility/mobility. The reason why Ret was carried in 3c's was because of Offhealing and Burst DPS under AW, if you don't trust me, see videos of Vanguards, offhealing and burst under AW, nothing more, a Ret without AW burst is useless, as constant pressure is not what qualifiy most the Ret, if at all. If you think that Ret have a good constant pressure, then I guess you're stuck in patch 3.3.

[Handsylton]

Handsy, are u mad? 50% more damage with judgement in exchange for 50% crit of HoW is "not a pain, not a gain" for PvE. But for PvP it is like deleting ret spec. So, over all, crap change tbh. We should get this bonus to judgement "for free".

Korgard, no, I'm not mad. I pvp as ret and I'll be happy to have more than one source of serious damage from range against kiters. It's not a 50% damage buff to Judgement, it's a 100% damage buff to Judgement. 50% -> 100% = 2x, or 100% buff.

That being said, yes, I totally would rather have more Judgement damage to be able to pressure a ranged from two sources, rather than one source any day. It's sheer mathematics Korgard, why can't you see that it is a BUFF to both PvP and PvE?

[Requital]

And you guys are surprised by this change? I'm pretty sure there was a thread exactly about this being the EXACT change that the devs were going to make. So they listened to us... GOOD THING!!!

Judgement no longer hits like a wet noodle... GOOD THING!!!

Now we don't have to rely on HoW as the only thing that can kill someone at ranged, because Judgement is going to be hitting a lot harder now. No more pure reliance on HoW to do damage in arenas... GOOD THING!!!

More sustained damage through 5% 2H weapon damage buff... GOOD THING!!!

I honestly do not see how any of you can complain about this at all. They did EXACTLY what we asked them to do... and you are upset? Idgi but whatever, you guys are impossible to please. I on the other hand, am thrilled that they are actually nerfing our burst and increasing our sustained damage. EXACTLY what we wanted them to do.

Being the ret community is so bitter, I'll just give a big YAY to Blizzard for them, because even though you guys are so blinded by bitterness, I'll see the amazing parts of the changes they've made for you.

Actually no that isn't how it was stated, They said they were going to even the damage. To me and a lot of other people redistribute the damage means change the coeffs of the spells ability slightly nerfing and buffing them.

Not nerfing our only crit by 80%+

[Handsylton]

Except that other classes have fat better constant pressure; we'll have no DPS burst without HoW autocrit, compared to a War under Reckleness this is pure shit, same for a Dk under Pillar of Frost, a Feral under Berserk (loling hard at this one), and better PvP utility/mobility. The reason why Ret was carried in 3c's was because of Offhealing and Burst DPS under AW, if you don't trust me, see videos of Vanguards, offhealing and burst under AW, nothing more, a Ret without AW burst is useless, as constant pressure is not what qualifiy most the Ret, if at all. If you think that Ret have a good constant pressure, then I guess you're stuck in patch 3.3.

No, I don't think we have good pressure right now at all. I think we will have better pressure, as well as better ranged pressure after the patch. From ranged, we will be hitting both HoW and Judgement for 20% extra damage with wings up, and from up close, we will be hitting everything for more damage, not just praying for HoW crits. Oh, and it's definitely not an auto crit. 60% is pretty far from 100% crit last time I checked.

Your avatar has a blindfold, and I'm pretty sure you are looking at these changes with a blindfold on, or at least through some blinders, because you aren't looking at the entire picture AT ALL.

---------- Post added 2011-10-04 at 11:25 PM ----------

Actually no that isn't how it was stated, They said they were going to even the damage. To me and a lot of other people redistribute the damage means change the coeffs of the spells ability slightly nerfing and buffing them.

Not nerfing our only crit by 80%+

You are upset because of a trinket Requital. Enough said.

[Nillo]

Korgard, no, I'm not mad. I pvp as ret and I'll be happy to have more than one source of serious damage from range against kiters. It's not a 50% damage buff to Judgement, it's a 100% damage buff to Judgement. 50% -> 100% = 2x, or 100% buff.

That being said, yes, I totally would rather have more Judgement damage to be able to pressure a ranged from two sources, rather than one source any day. It's sheer mathematics Korgard, why can't you see that it is a BUFF to both PvP and PvE?

(1+100%)/(1+50%) = 1.33 => it's a 33% buff just saying.
just read the tooltip:
Unleashing this Seal's energy will deal Holy damage to an enemy, increased by 10% for each application of Censure on the target.

---------- Post added 2011-10-04 at 11:30 PM ----------

Actually no that isn't how it was stated, They said they were going to even the damage. To me and a lot of other people redistribute the damage means change the coeffs of the spells ability slightly nerfing and buffing them.

Not nerfing our only crit by 80%+

Why would you care about crit so much? It may not be as cool to no longer see big numbers pop up all the time but you'll be compensated with more consistant damage and having to rely less on having cooldowns up overall !_!

The only thing I don't get is why they wouldn't instead of reducing the crit altogether, remove the high crit from HoW under AW and keep it high for the <20% execute.

[Korgard]

Well Handsy, i dont know if u are that good at pvp or that bad. Not me to judge. But in casual 2k-2.2k ratings i play, ret is doing damage ONLY under wings. And 60% crit with hammer is great part of it. Huge. When i am not in winged-burst mode, protected from dispells, i am doing nothing. WoGing around to not get bored. Judgement change is XX % bonus to nothing, while hammer crit nerf is XX % to everything. Thats how i see it.

Oh, and for PvE, it looks like gain and lose is equal, but when u take potion / trinket stacking into consideration, it looks like loose for me.

[Requital]

No, I don't think we have good pressure right now at all. I think we will have better pressure, as well as better ranged pressure after the patch. From ranged, we will be hitting both HoW and Judgement for 20% extra damage with wings up, and from up close, we will be hitting everything for more damage, not just praying for HoW crits. Oh, and it's definitely not an auto crit. 60% is pretty far from 100% crit last time I checked.

Your avatar has a blindfold, and I'm pretty sure you are looking at these changes with a blindfold on, or at least through some blinders, because you aren't looking at the entire picture AT ALL.

---------- Post added 2011-10-04 at 11:25 PM ----------



You are upset because of a trinket Requital. Enough said.

You should learn to read anything that requires crit is what I'm upset about but it doesn't surprise me that you don't get that.

[Nillo]

You should learn to read anything that requires crit is what I'm upset about but it doesn't surprise me that you don't get that.

Is there anything except for that trinket that will hopefully be replaced in the next tier anyway? (and I really wonder if HoW was the only way to stack it up in the first place)

[Moradim]

anyone who thinks 5% more damage to cs/tv/melee and a bit more judgement damage solves all of rets problems, is an idiot.

we are still proc reliant, these changes accomplish absolutely nothing.

[Deleted]

There might be other changes.. maybe. Maybe this is enough to push Avenging Wrath undispellable? I don't know, but I hope so.

This is enough to put HoW usable on 100% hp targets, without an inflated crit chance akin to execute/kill shot there is little point having it as a finisher type move.

As if Ret didn't have a huge enough bag of problems they throw this at us? ugh.

[Fredzilla]

I want seal of the martyr again. It was fun.

Also, lowering the crit chance of HoW along with the 2pc bonus for ret will drastically lower our use of HoW in raids, since judge will give HP, where HoW doesn't (at least as far as I see it now, that's what will happen). I didnt realize redistributing damage = making us use HoW a lot less. Also, with this, im really hoping there wont be anymore trinkets like vessel or app, otherwise may god have mercy on our souls.

[Deleted]

Wow, so much QQ its incredible. In pve ret is already doing decently, and this is definitly a buff. They already said they wanted to move ret damage from CDs and make it more sustainable, this is a step in the right direction. An this is the PTR, and it wont go live like this. They will probably make more changes.

[rezoacken]

anyone who thinks 5% more damage to cs/tv/melee and a bit more judgement damage solves all of rets problems, is an idiot.

we are still proc reliant, these changes accomplish absolutely nothing.

I agree they have to tone down the variance of our dps, if they only boost our mean dps but never change the variance we actually have its going to be really weird.

As for the buffs/nerf won't say anything until someone get the sim run and theorycrafting going on.

This doesn't change much for ret pvp, it still sucks though.

[Butosai]

I havent read through the first 4 pages, but my first thought when i saw this , considering the # amount is something youd find in a constant ability talent, was thinking there were making it usable 100% of the time, but weve already had so many buffs if they dont nerf the damage we would be way overpowered

[Maelstrom51]

paladins: Hammer of wrath is really a good finisher in arena. weaker than kill shot but still! i got tons of kills with it ^^.
people: omg wtf pala is OP whine whine whine.
Blizzard: let's remove the crit bonus from hammer of wrath!

This part is funny. Weaker than kill shot, rofl rofl rofl.
Look at the top baleroc parses for ret and marksman, then compare kill shot and HoW damage. 46k kill shots average, 50k HoW average. Also HoW has a 6 second cd, while Kill Shot has a 12 sec cd. Also Kill Shot is affected by armor while HoW is not. Also HoW has a much higher crit chance than kill shot. Also there are ways to use HoW before 20%, with kill shot there are not.