[Ret][Holy] - Help on improving DPS/HPS please

[Fiercon]

Hello everybody,

yesterday we managed to kill stoneguard. Yeah on normal and no it wasn't easy I have to admit.
It's nonetheless been a very satisfying feeling. Before the shitstorm breaks loose: Yes, our overall performance is underwhelming. There are too many points to work on all of them at once. We are raiding once a week for 3,5 hours - so it's far from "progress" raiding. That however is no excuse for not playing as good as possible. As such we have some people being up to their game and some not as good. Rest assured, that I will post a similar thread in other classes' forums to get feedback on the other peoples performance. Right now I'm especially interested in our pallys performance and how to improve it. So while I know that there is A LOT of room for improvement on many parts of our raid, I'd be happy if you could focus on my fellow pallies.

Please have a look at our kill last night.

I'm Hunnok, one of the tanks and most of our tries ended before any real good could have been done due to fukup on tanking side.
Some DDs are OK: our warlock and our shaman would be what I'd call "in shape" some others range from "need to improve" to "What the ...".

Now for my questions:
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Our Ret-Pally did great in terms of team awareness. She cleaned cobalts, placed hands, stayed out of shit and so on, so I don't expect the utmost pinnacle of DD performance - especially regarding the not perfect tanking. BUT: Back in DS she was one of our best DDs (right beside our rogue, mind you?) and I know she is missing something. I would be very glad if you could point out any mistakes/improvements in terms of rotation, awwareness, itemization, talents you could give me: here's her amory
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Now for the best healer of the raidevening: Malayka - 45k HPS is not bad, but 12k away from being place 200 in WoL. Since I played a HPally all over Wrath/Cata (Ntarok) we layed out some tactics beforehand but I'm sure it's not the best, that can be done in this encounter. Here you'll find his armory.
I assume casting more 1HP EFs on the raid to maximize healing on the bacon would be something to look at. What about LoD or HR, is there any use for those here?
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I'm open to all sorts of critics, suggestions or further information

Thanks alot in advance
Hunnok/Ntarok/Fiercon

[Deleted]

Going on the ret perspective here, she needs to get rid of the direbrew trinket, its totally crap:P

i dont know if shes using divine purpose for dailys or what but she would be better using holy avenger or sanctified wrath.

for stone guard she'd be better using lights hammer for the cleave on both targets.

Personally i'd use divine storm instead of templar's verdict but thats just me, if she keeps tabbing target to make sure to get the increased judgement that would be great to (not sure if she is however, bit hard to determine)

Glyph of mass exorcism would also help and please get rid of the inquisition glyph (might be for dailys i dont know :P)

[Launchpad]

I think your holy pally's numbers are fine for the ilvl of the gear. The druid was pretty close and the priest a little ways back. It's hard to rank if other healers are doing well and ranking as a healer is mostly overrated once encounters are on farm. Usually the logs from those rankings show very lobsided healing percentanges.

With that said, Holy Shock uptime could have been stronger. It should be used on cooldown.

[eflikt]

For the Ret.
Anaxie's guide is really good. I suggest you have her read through, if not already.
Just had time to only glance over her gear/spec/logs, a couple of things pop out.

Gear:
Skinning is a very poor raiding profession, especially for Ret. Yes she is a LW but now that it's maxed, time to drop it and use an alt to skin.
2 items are reforged from Haste with Crit untouched, reforging best stat and not touching worst stat.
Over Hit/Exp, only by a bit but maybe a way to get closer? ReforgeLite addon is really good, reforges for you even.
Overall on par with what we worked with pre-raid (even easier with Hallow's/LFR at her time period of 90)

Talents:
Speed of Light is only usable every 45, and with no run speed on boots hinders her a lot. I suggest Pursuit of Justice, or Long Arm of the Law if moving between 2 spots periodically.
Divine Purpose is okay, but too RNG for my taste. I like having an actual cooldown no matter how bursty it makes us. Holy Avenger/Sanctified Wrath.

WoL:
Cooldown usage was all over the place. You can read up on some ways to use CD usage on this other thread in here, forgot the name though.
Could have used Execution Sentence 2 more times.
Pre Pot.

All I saw for now. Hopefully the experts will weigh in as I am far from.
Also hope you know what spells I am referring to seeing as the armory is in some language I do not know.
Feel free to PM and I can breakdown what I do personally for each fight as far as cooldowns, etc.

[Kurzior]

Can't say much about the ret pally, but the healer looks ok to me. The issue with looking at WoL rankings, or even just HPS in general for healers is there is a fine line between underperforming and mana-conservative healing. Playing mana conservative is actually where we are right now because of fixed mana pools and spirit still being on the low side for people just starting to raid. Healers have to balance between healing everyone quickly and maintaining their mana pool for the entire fight.

Another thing to keep in mind is that HPS is capped depending on how much damage the raid is taking and how much the other 2 healers in the raid (and any off heals dps and tanks) are doing. In the end, if your raid only takes 1 million damage, your healers can only heal 1 million damage. Healer performance has to be evaluated on a fight by fight and group by group basis. Not based on whether they hit the mark for a top 200 parse. If people are dying to unavoidable damage (tanks from boss hits or dps to regular raid damage), then your healers have something to work on. If people are dying from avoidable damage like Amethyst Pools, then its no amount of healing improvements are going to stop that from happening until they vastly outgear the fight. If people are dying because healers run OOM, then the group needs to work on taking less damage and the healers need to focus on being more mana-efficient with their casting.

[Fiercon]

Wow, that's a lot to chew through.

Very much helpfull stuff indeed. Thanks for all the ret-responses - I'll pass them 1to1. Apart from the fact that I don't think she'll give up skinning all other things seem to be very good changes.

Divine Storm and Exo-Glyph are things that might really help dealing with two cats - so will keeping up censure on both targets and switching before Judging - good hint!

As for the holy: Yes HS-uptime really seems to slack especially with it being so full of benefits (HP, Manacost, daybreak and so on).

@Kurzior: You are absolutely right - gaining a spot in HPS on WoL means that another healer had to step back for you to outshine on a certain fight. In our case all healers were overwhelmed by the damage that came in and one minute prior to the kill our pally went OOM and thus thing down the drain. We had 4 Players alive wenn the cats went down, so it was dayum close. I certainly think we will struggle this week (with blue, purple, red up).

ATM I fear mana conservancy (does that word exist?) is a big factor - overheal is too large whereas people on the other hand drop dangerously low in other situations. I think healers need to step up a bit in terms of reacting to what damage comes where when.

I think we got avoidable damage down to a bearable "minimum" with tanks being the vast majority of damage taken. Sure, there are some points wehe the druidtank takes a hit by an unmitigated-cobalt mine - always a big strain on Tankhealth but this alone should not empty the healers pockets.

I think getting used to a fight you basically can practise only once a week (remember our raiding times) is a huge factor for all of us. Whish us luck this thursday Hopefully the cats surrender once more and we can get our asses handed by Feng!

Thanks again @all for the great feedback
Hunnok/Fiercon

[Ater]

What the others said about the ret with talents, professions and gear.

But two things worth naming is:
1. She takes care of the traps, that will lower the dps.
2. If you look at the logs for stone guard from world of logs 10 man normal is that rets are about 15% behind locks and about 8% behind shamans (you can see the numbers here: http://raidbots.com/dpsbot/The_Stone.../default/#2210 ). So if your pally got about the same ilvl as your lock and shaman she should still be a decent amount of dps behind them, and even more so since she takes traps.