Thrall should have blown Garrosh head-off the day he challenge him in a duel (right before Wotlk)
Thrall should have blown Garrosh head-off the day he challenge him in a duel (right before Wotlk)
Because that hot-headed buffoon was charismatic, hailed as a war hero, and was respected by the youth of the Horde
As Thrall said himself "Your obvious love for the Horde? That is more important to me than political acumen right now. And that, Garrosh Hellscream, you have in abundance."
I guess you can say Thrall made the mistake expecting the advisors he left Garrosh would help him to the level he needed
We have faced trials and danger, threats to our world and our way of life. And yet, we persevere. We are the Horde. We will not let anything break our spirits!"
Garrosh is older then Thrall. Garrosh grew up in a relatively peaceful time in Nagrand. Garrosh had the support of his tribe and from the Earthern Ring. He's got no reason at all to be foaming at the mouth with rage.
Hense he's just an asshole with an axe to grind.
Thrall left him in charge, hoping he'd learn to be a good leader. He was hoping Cairne and Vol'jin would help guide him down the right path. Instead, Garrosh murders Cairne over a petty squabble, and threatens to kill Vol'jin.
Hense he's completely incompetant and unsuitable for any leadership position. The only role he suits is being in a berzerker vanguard. And he'd not even be good at that role, since apperently he's not a skilled fighter at all and can be beaten by:
1/ A Shaman who's not even using his spells.
2/ A elderly man.
3/ Quillboar.
Its quite funny how people think he's a badass. Goes to show how much his family name matters.
Garrosh is older than Thrall, he may be arrogant but that does not make him a child, Thrall may come off as older because he has been educated and is wise beyond his years.Originally Posted by PvPisthelifeforme
OT While Thrall's decision was the wrong one in our eyes, at the time, he believed that he was doing the best thing for the Horde, which is what Garrosh believes he is doing right now. Also, had Thrall sat in Org. all day waiting for Alliance to raid the city, Deathwing would have destroyed Azeroth...
They both take some blame because both believed they were doing the right thing.
Thrall is an idiot for passing the reins to Garrosh. He gambled his life's work on Hellscream and lost, now Cairne is dead, all of the other leaders apart from Gallywix (who has become something of a Garrosh fanboy) are pissed and the Horde is barely holding itself together. That much is on Thrall.
That being said Garrosh alone is responsible for his actions. Theramore wasn't Thrall's fault and no amount of foresight would have told him it would happen. Nor would it have told him about Garrosh summoning demons, inviting the Blackrocks in or his intention to completely genocide his enemies. Garrosh is ultimately the one to blame and he'll be the one to pay for it.
"Lordaeron belongs to the Forsaken. Always and forever!"
Perfection is so horribly dull, don't you think?
well you are, in fact, 100% correct, it is all thrall's fault. He wanted to hornor his lost friend, and gave his son to much power, saurfang would be the right choice, and he should have let garrosh train under him, or really just anybody else, to let him learn about the hornor beside on killing people.
Last edited by Dreknar20; 2012-11-10 at 10:02 AM.
We have faced trials and danger, threats to our world and our way of life. And yet, we persevere. We are the Horde. We will not let anything break our spirits!"
I kinda lost faith in Thrall when he left Gallywix in charge... after he enslaved his own Cartel and tried to kill Thrall. Still puzzling over that one. He must have been hit pretty hard on the head when he was captured by the Alliance or something.
Might i remind you that Thrall really wanted to give Warchief to Dranosh Saurfang before the lich king chopped him in half. Hellscream was the 2nd choice.
That is how the goblins work. Thrall knew that so he left him in change. Goblins only go up when the person above them is dead. (Which in alot of ways they kill them)
Sorry? WHAT? At no point the whole time Garrosh as been around he has never summoned demons. The ones in jade forest were forsaken thry were lead by a forsaken leader.
Last edited by Airwaves; 2012-11-10 at 10:40 AM.
Aye mate
To this day im still baffled by that decision
so a guy who takes all your possessions, forces you into slavery, tries to murder you but then thrall decides well im sure hes learnt his lesson then lets him be your leader
gallywix is a backstabbing moneygrubbing asshole
er wait a sec i think i just realized why he makes the perfect goblin leader scratch what i just said
I blame Thrall, absolutely. He should have known that Garrosh was a self-glorifying, hotheaded ass whose entire philosophy boils down to 'RAWR ORC SMASH ALIYUNSE!' He should have known that a gentle finger-wagging and 'now you be a good boy and listen to my buddies, K?' was about as useful as telling a four year old 'Now you keep out of that cookie jar I just set in your lap'.
It's not really Thralls fault. It are Garrosh his actions that made the Horde to what it is now. Thrall could've forseen Garrosh becoming 'evil' in the way he acted during the campaign in Northrend. but it was in a time of need he thought Garrosh was just what the Horde needed. Garrosh kinda 'betrayed' Thrall.
Yeah, Thrall is to blame and honestly as Alliance I really can't see him as a neutral figure.
Expecially after reading Tides of War. He's apparently too busy to stop Theramore being nuked but he rushes in and is all "won't somebody please think of the children" when Jaina is about to do the same with Orgrimmar. He did us a favour in the end since that prevented the destruction of the Alliance fleet too, but he didnt know it.
Last edited by mmoc785ca38ad1; 2012-11-10 at 01:19 PM.
I think you're spot on. Garrosh deserves to be a killing machine, a badass like Saurfang. And he still can be, imo.
As for your argument that Thrall is to blame. I think you and Blizzard think alike. I've heard Metzen say the same thing at Blizzcon before Cataclysm. Garrosh' storyline only served to deepen Thrall's storyline. Yes, Thrall is to blame for anything that goes wrong. Garrosh is too young and inexperienced to be good at everything, it was already expected that he would make mistakes.
To go about and say Garrosh should die is stupid. With this logic, the majority of people who visit these forums would kill children who make mistakes as well. Or what about political leaders around the world who don't always make the right decision, would you want them dead as well? It's so stupid.
Garrosh deserves more than to be killed in the last raid. He deserves to be on par with Saurfang in awesomeness. Maybe he isn't Warchief material, but he's surely a good warrior and he should lead the Warsong and be Overlord. In the pre-Cataclysm event that's exactly what he wished for instead of becoming Warchief, so yes, it is Thrall's fault. Let's blame Thrall instead of Garrosh. And trust me, I still like Thrall overall. I'm not a hater.
Not gonna read every post here just gonna add my thoughts
As far I can see it, the current state of the horde is on ALL RACIAL LEADERS fault. Why do I say this? I will gladly point it out.
Fualt one.yes it is thralls fault that garrosh is in charge of the horde being aggressive with it, but normally this wouldn't be a problem..except thrall has ,sadly to say, weakened the horde to a state they think fighting is pointless. And on top of that he should have had check in with garrosh(I'm so not joking. Thrall kinda did the dad sink or swim thing...just a really bad way. And just so u know thrall could have taken breaks in between the maelstrom hell even Agra says this.there were other great shamans there with him)
Next is garrosh himself . I won't blame garrosh for being over aggressive in times of WAR, shit needs to get done one "honorable" way or another. So telling every soilder to brush aside dreams of peace and to kill you're enemy is fair. (Plus lets not forget outside of undead and elves the other races are kinda in a shit hole of homes...that btw the alliance wanted to force them out of.) now what do I blame garrosh for, he can't talk peacefully with people In his horde. He only tried with two ppl. One used him as a puppet and the other acceding lay got killed because he called his bluff(carine and magatha) and basically every since garrosh basically learned he wouldn't get along with racial leaders he tries to find others that will obey him without question. (Th dragon maw,malkorok,etc) and the final thing garrosh isn't a strategist , which in all honesty isn't meant to be in his area..last I checked voljin was meant to be the planner along with carine...both of who gave him the middle finger on day one.
Now to voljin. ...honestly I don't even know how to explain voljin..he claims he cares about the horde and his trolls but yet he just can't seem to grasp that this threatening and trying to prove that without him garrosh can't sustain shit isn't working..I mean really if you can't agree just stay the fuck away , don't rage quit just stay the fuck away.
Sylvannas has a simple issue...she cares about her ppl but at the same time really really hates being on a leash and let's face garrosh is always trying to put her on one. Don't get me wrong at the end of the day I know he probably loves the fact he has a racial leader that can at least come close to doing as he ask but still making a fuss about each and every time gets annoying.
Baine...he is just...fuck he is having a rommney effect( sorry kinda a joke and I do not want to offend any one.) one minute he is gun ho for garrosh the next minute he isn't ,rinse and repeat.
Lothremar( hope I got tht right) he is loyal sure..but not loyal to garrosh but the horde...so basically what ever the majority vote is and what doesn't seem stupid he will be with..so he is kinda a 50/50 deal...
That's my thought sooo yeah.