Let's Talk About Class Fantasy - Druids

[thesmall001]

In Legion, we're taking a strong look at how well individual specs meet up to the given fantasy of their intended design which is, perhaps, the most exciting feature for many long-time players. So I'm making a thread in each class forum to invite people to share their ideal visions for each Spec.

Try not to focus too much on balance-QQ unless it's somehow relevant to the fantasy (and no, "I always fantasized I'd be viable" doesn't count), instead, try to focus on whether you feel your spec meets up to the hype or whether it lacks (or has) a strong fantasy to begin with; are you happy with aspects such as cooldowns and abilities and how they represent those ideas? Finally, would you like to see the fantasy changed or modified in a world where drastic re-designs aren't off the table?

[huth]

Class fantasy is about the look and feel of a class, not about mechanics. I.e. Nature magic spellcaster/shapeshifter for Druids in general, and the Astrological themes Balance acquired in recent years.

[thesmall001]

Class fantasy is about the look and feel of a class, not about mechanics. I.e. Nature magic spellcaster/shapeshifter for Druids in general, and the Astrological themes Balance acquired in recent years.

I would strongly disagree. The way that look and feel manifests is primarily through their mechanics and cooldowns and rotations as well as the animations and effects (and sometimes UI) that accompany those abilities. For that matter, are people happy with the gradual shift towards the astrological themes of Balance since TBC? Druids are lucky enough to have perhaps the most Lore attached to their class of any, so how do people feel that is reconciled with the gameplay?

[Shooter McGavin]

Unfortunately he doesn't understand what you mean. I get what you are saying though. And personally I play Feral/boomie and I feel like the ferals have one of the best class fantasy as you are referring it as. Just based on 1. The looks of the class like @huth said the look is important don't get me wrong. But IMO it's not solely based on that. Because for boomies supposed to be a class that feeds off the stars and sun a fat chicken doesn't make sense. Whereas feral the movement and mechanics of the class 100% make me feel like I'm playing as a cat. And what a cat would do in a fantasy movie.

If you pictured a cat in a movie it would do exactly what ferals do in game based on bleeds and how stealthy cats can be. Also, one thing I think that makes it even more relevant and I love about this post is when you are in cat form you can jump from basically anything and not take fall damage like a real cat. I've played feral for years and everytime I take a break from the class and comeback I always fall back into that mindset of okay I have to think like a cat and be stealthy idk lol maybe that's weird but I assume people who play rogues think they are all ninjas.

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same goes for resto Druids who use treant form. Trees in mythology their sole purpose is healing. So it just makes playing a Druid that much better the fact that yeah you can shapeshift into cool things but the fact that most of the shapeshifts have a true meaning and isn't just a pointless cool looking form.

[Deleted]

I personally don't like the astrological theme behind balance. It doesn't feel very druidic. Feels and looks more like a mage but I think the majority of balance players either don't mind or like the star theme. Hopefully we get some nature spells more like entangling roots that are used in our rotation but I highly doubt Blizzard will. No way they'll give us some pruned spells back either like instect swarm or symbiosis since they've said they don't think they've pruned enough for some specs :/

[Juvencus]

I very much like the celestial theme of Moonkins. I think now Druids embody nature in its entirety more than ever before. You have Feral/Guardians representing Azeroth's lifeforms, Restoration embodying Azeroth's natural environment and Balance for the universe that surrounds the planet.

[huth]

I would strongly disagree. The way that look and feel manifests is primarily through their mechanics and cooldowns and rotations as well as the animations and effects (and sometimes UI) that accompany those abilities. For that matter, are people happy with the gradual shift towards the astrological themes of Balance since TBC? Druids are lucky enough to have perhaps the most Lore attached to their class of any, so how do people feel that is reconciled with the gameplay?

While it manifests in your abilities among other things, that isn't what it is about. You're focusing on the wrong part of the equation. Music manifests as pressure differences in air, but nobody would look at those when thinking about music.

[Wildmoon]

I don't mind the celestial theme I guess but I want to see some more nature related abilities in balance kit. We only have wrath as the sole nature themed dps spell currently. I wannea see some sort of storm or shits like that as dps spell.

[Shooter McGavin]

I still don't understand why boomies are being the main focus lmao. They have the least fantasy. Is a fucking chicken. Auto loss.

[Keiyra]

I still don't understand why boomies are being the main focus lmao. They have the least fantasy. Is a fucking chicken. Auto loss.

Thats prolly because Feral (and to a lesser extent Guardian) are already pretty good in the "fantasy/feeling" of being these shapeshifted animals. They don't need much polishing. Boomkin and Resto could use a little more flair.

On the boomy side, im fine with the astral themes, but I wouldn't mind some more nature based stuff on solar side. Like instead of Sunfire just being a yellow moonfire clone, it could've been "Briar patch" Thorn covered vines damage your foe with nature damage over time (with all the exact same mechanics of Sunfire, just different name and visual spell effect). Or you know...insect swarm...still miss that :P - Hurricane needs a rework.

On the resto side I wouldn't mind an overhaul on most of the visual spell effects (most are pretty underwhelming). Theres alot of potential material from nature, animals, insects, plants that could be thematically incorporated into boomkin(solar side) and/or resto.

Also for all specs, getting Treants to be more competitive would be nice and is a good spot to add flare in terms of fantasy for a spec. Summoning natures tree warriors to assist you is a great concept...now just make it work :P

[huth]

I think they deliberately removed those elements from Balance to bring it more into the celestial theme. Still think Sunfire should be more than just an orange Moonfire with a sun on top, and Starfire really needs an upgrade.

Might be best to just outright replace Hurricane with a Sun based AoE with similar power but different focus from Starfall(just like Moonfire and Sunfire).

But this is veering to far from theme and more into mechanics.

[thesmall001]

I think they deliberately removed those elements from Balance to bring it more into the celestial theme. Still think Sunfire should be more than just an orange Moonfire with a sun on top, and Starfire really needs an upgrade.

Might be best to just outright replace Hurricane with a Sun based AoE with similar power but different focus from Starfall(just like Moonfire and Sunfire).

But this is veering to far from theme and more into mechanics.

Mechanics are very important here too. Mechanics are the medium for your theme. Theme is more than just what others see when you are in combat, it's everything about how the class feels to you. So, for example, over in the Paladin thread there was a big demand for solutions to their AoE problem and that lead to discussion about whether Divine Storm is effective enough on it's own or if Consecration or another ability would be cooler or more interesting. What best fits their theme to overcome a flaw in their mechanics? Should that flaw be retains because it's part of the classes' identity?

Consider Balance: High DoT damage combined with bursty nukes are pretty core to the theme because it makes Eclipse important and impacting. Eclipse, a key part of the spec fantasy, needs to feel important otherwise you weaken the identity of that mechanic, you see?

With that regard, how does Feral hold up? Bleeding, maiming and biting are core fantasies for Feral. But if you look at the main source of their damage it tends to be things like Thrash and Shred, an AoE and a direct damage ability, doing a lot of the work for them. Should that be shifted towards focusing on bleeding multiple enemies over time?

It's curious the attitude towards the Astrological themes of Balance being so divisive. It's something that is more prominent in the game and yet completely different to the idea of a Balance Druid in Lore. As badly as people want a HD Boomkin, there's many who'd happily see them get rid of it in favour of... something else? Caster form? I'm curious.

[Ern]

nowadays, every playable druid is a Wild Druid.

I would like the specs lore on storyline of their respectives animal sides.
Guardian and feral to Claw, moonkin to Talon, resto to Antler.

Some fluff on their spells and talents on that way would be nice too.

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About the chikenlaser rotation.
The sun stuff seens a quick patchwork solution to nature damage (but fire would be more consistent).
Instead of "nature" fire dots, poison dots seens more fun, change sun fire for the old insect swarm.
But it would change the bipolar mechanic they made. Wildkins dont have fire theme, thats bug me.

Druid blink could be a swift fly on crow flyform to bookins to refere Aviana and Malfurion.

[huth]

I think they should just change our damage types to Lunar and Solar. Main reason our second school is nature is basically tradition. It's a leftover from when we still had spells like Insect Swarm, and Balance never had spells outside of Nature and Arcane.

It's curious the attitude towards the Astrological themes of Balance being so divisive. It's something that is more prominent in the game and yet completely different to the idea of a Balance Druid in Lore. As badly as people want a HD Boomkin, there's many who'd happily see them get rid of it in favour of... something else? Caster form? I'm curious.

You're mixing up two different things there. One is the Astrological/Celestial theme vs. the older more Nature based one, the other is Moonkin vs. Not-Moonkin.

[Ern]

The main reason to nature damage damage type is bcouse... druids are nature based class? Moonkin, directly linked to wildkin, who are nature spell creatures created by Elune.

[Kinnil]

I have always thought of it similar to druids having their main celebrations on Equinoxes. That is what the shifting from lunar to solar is. That we are focusing on different spells at different times because the world/universe is powering those types of abilities. I know people hate that this shifts for you now but it makes more sense to me as this follows the way the cycle takes place in the world. "We don't cast spells to move the sun and stars, but the placement of them can affect our spells."

[Ern]

I have always thought of it similar to druids having their main celebrations on Equinoxes. That is what the shifting from lunar to solar is. That we are focusing on different spells at different times because the world/universe is powering those types of abilities. I know people hate that this shifts for you now but it makes more sense to me as this follows the way the cycle takes place in the world. "We don't cast spells to move the sun and stars, but the placement of them can affect our spells."

Nice point of view.

[Deleted]

On the boomy side, im fine with the astral themes, but I wouldn't mind some more nature based stuff on solar side. Like instead of Sunfire just being a yellow moonfire clone, it could've been "Briar patch" Thorn covered vines damage your foe with nature damage over time (with all the exact same mechanics of Sunfire, just different name and visual spell effect). Or you know...insect swarm...still miss that :P - Hurricane needs a rework.

I like the briar patch idea, it encorporates both balance druid themes within the actual dps rotation. That way we get both the nature and celestial theme.