Should LFR be rejugged into a 5man structure?

[Deleted]

As the title says, would it work out better if LFR was changed to a 5man style.

So you would still be able to experience the locations, the bosses and such of the raids, but with a little bit more emphasis on individuals 'performing', when I say perform, I dont necessarily mean top enchants, gems, specs, talents - I mean, not afk auto-attacking etc.

If 'seeing the content' is the primary reason for its current existence, then surely this would be fine?

Could it work? Would it be better?

Edit: error in title, supposed to be rejigged

[Terridon]

Has been suggested before and consensus was that average of this forum didn't like it.
It would mean more tuning, or just to dump it so far down that class combos doesn't matter at all.

Personally i want it to stay as 25man since it's a great way to find bugs for the real raids too, and gives blizzard a large enough playerbase to really throw a lot into developing raids.

[Giscoicus]

As the title says, would it work out better if LFR was changed to a 5man style.

So you would still be able to experience the locations, the bosses and such of the raids, but with a little bit more emphasis on individuals 'performing', when I say perform, I dont necessarily mean top enchants, gems, specs, talents - I mean, not afk auto-attacking etc.

If 'seeing the content' is the primary reason for its current existence, then surely this would be fine?

Could it work? Would it be better?

Edit: error in title, supposed to be rejigged

First, we all know "seeing the content" means getting gear to afk in the shrine.

I think it should be 3 man, with the tank healer and dps each practicing mechanics. No lik timer or determination though, since both would make it a broken learning tool. Each role can receive the BoA bag for completing it, if they queue as a leader. Queuing as a leader requires the Ahead of the Curve achievement.

I would like the gear to be on par with normal dungeons, below heroic ones. No tier/trinkets/etc. so it is really about the content and not the reward.

For example, fallen protectors? Only one of the melee bosses is active at a time. When took dies the adds will come down one at a time. Stuff like that, so the dps can learn their role, tanks can learn to tank both bosses, healer can practice.

Kick timer cannot exist, since people can easily refuse to play to fuck over others. No determination because in a 3man with 1 dps, +50% can turn the entire thing into a joke. Also, more Blizzard made raid wanings, and chat bubbles displayed at all times, so you cannot ignore communication.

[Simple057]

Yes please do would love to wait even longer for tanks

[Chonar]

Look at the time spent in queue waiting for tanks now.
Now look at me.
Look back at the time spent
Now BACK to me.
Sadly, the time spent isnt me.
I have no idea where I'm going with this.
I'm a tank.

[Deleted]

First, we all know "seeing the content" means getting gear to afk in the shrine.

I think it should be 3 man, with the tank healer and dps each practicing mechanics. No lik timer or determination though, since both would make it a broken learning tool. Each role can receive the BoA bag for completing it, if they queue as a leader. Queuing as a leader requires the Ahead of the Curve achievement.

I would like the gear to be on par with normal dungeons, below heroic ones. No tier/trinkets/etc. so it is really about the content and not the reward.

For example, fallen protectors? Only one of the melee bosses is active at a time. When took dies the adds will come down one at a time. Stuff like that, so the dps can learn their role, tanks can learn to tank both bosses, healer can practice.

Kick timer cannot exist, since people can easily refuse to play to fuck over others. No determination because in a 3man with 1 dps, +50% can turn the entire thing into a joke. Also, more Blizzard made raid wanings, and chat bubbles displayed at all times, so you cannot ignore communication.

To learn your role, do proving grounds. IMO you shouldn't even be allowed to queue for LFR before doing proving grounds

[Amerissis]

As the title says, would it work out better if LFR was changed to a 5man style.

So you would still be able to experience the locations, the bosses and such of the raids, but with a little bit more emphasis on individuals 'performing', when I say perform, I dont necessarily mean top enchants, gems, specs, talents - I mean, not afk auto-attacking etc.

If 'seeing the content' is the primary reason for its current existence, then surely this would be fine?

Could it work? Would it be better?

Edit: error in title, supposed to be rejigged

How would you handle boss mechanics with only 5 players? I know people opposed to LFR like to say there are no boss mechanics, but of course that is not true. Some mechanics are removed and all are more forgiving, but they do exist.

And besides that, in what world is 5 man considered raiding? It's not comparable at all, while LFR is.

[Deleted]

How do you want to do these bosses with one tank? How do you do an encounter like Spoils of Pandaria with 5 people?

[Santoryu]

It would work out better if the system was removed entirely.

[Synstir]

Well it can range now from 25 to 10 man; that is quite enough.
The only thing is now we still need 25 to start it.... there should also be a 10 man option to start.

[Pull My Finger]

The whole point of LFR is it to be a mass event. It enables Blizzard to lump a lot of people together in the same group and provide a form of endgame content for them, while reducing queue times as much as possible. That's also the reason why they didn't do a 10 man LFR. And it's been stated by Blizzard several times. Your idea is the exact opposite of what the whole system is intended to do.

[Sansnom]

As the title says, would it work out better if LFR was changed to a 5man style.

So you would still be able to experience the locations, the bosses and such of the raids, but with a little bit more emphasis on individuals 'performing', when I say perform, I dont necessarily mean top enchants, gems, specs, talents - I mean, not afk auto-attacking etc.

If 'seeing the content' is the primary reason for its current existence, then surely this would be fine?

Could it work? Would it be better?

Edit: error in title, supposed to be rejigged

I hardly doubt it. While there are people who AFK and "Just zerg it", I do think there are people who try to do it like it was suppose to do, just that they require a larger safety zone in case of errors. Mistakes are less likely to kill. I find it is sometimes the "real raiders" that are the problem in ignoring the mechanics and causing problems for others because it is not a challenge for them so they either go AFK or auto-attack. To these, LFR is a loot grab to supplement their weekly attempt to get higher gear.

Changing to 5 man will be a nightmare. Many encounters are tuned to have certain types of people in the raids, such as two tanks, three healers for example. Changing it to 5 man that will cater for less tanks and healers will cause more problems than it solves.

One thing I would consider is putting LFR on the same lock out as the other raids. This would then mean the "real raiders" will not enter LFR. Everybody has their own raid and not more mixing. The down side is of course there are some genuine good players out there running LFR and not trolling, helping the less skills players to progress and would not longer be able to do so.

[Raintola]

It would work out better if the system was removed entirely.

I take it your raiding experience is retroactively ruined because there are more players running around with gear that has purple text on it?

[Deleted]

And besides that, in what world is 5 man considered raiding? It's not comparable at all, while LFR is.

Sorry I should have been clearer. What I mean is, if it is as blizz say to see the content, it doesnt matter if its a raid or not.

[Deleted]

In short no, in long nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnoooooooooooooooooooooooooo.

LFR is there for people to see content as you said, but to also experience the boss fight and learn the tactics, to scale the encounters down to 5 people would take even more time to play test and think out.

[wych]

Sorry I should have been clearer. What I mean is, if it is as blizz say to see the content, it doesnt matter if its a raid or not.

You're not really seeing the content if it's completely changed to make it for 5 man raids are you? For example Spoils of Pandaria, or the Galakras fight.

Not only that but as pointed out above, queue times would get 10x worse because now for every 6 DPS you need 2 tanks rather than 17.

[Pull My Finger]

It is to be noted that this whole "seeing the content" isn't, and never was, something that came for Blizzard or has been communicated that way, but one of those things people make up and run with it to a point where it takes on a life on its own. It's one of these winged phrases that get tossed around and everyone just picks it up.

To make it clear: LFR isn't there for people "to see the content" - in the sense of "seeing how the interior and the bosses look like". Anyone can "see the content" on YouTube or elsewhere.

LFR is there to provide a possibility of experiencing content. More precisely: to give players who don't do "proper" raids a form of endgame content. Meaning: playing, killing bosses, progressing, collecting loot. The whole package - the pillars of WoW PvE gameplay. It's there to be played. Got nothing to do with "seeing the content".

[jaakkeli]

The whole point of LFR is it to be a mass event.

Which is why it's doomed to suck. Unorganized groups of random people barely work for LFD when it's 5 people, LFR is a guaranteed cesspool no matter what you do.

It enables Blizzard to lump a lot of people together in the same group and provide a form of endgame content for them, while reducing queue times as much as possible.

Reducing queue times? Are you tripping? DPS queue times are 4 times as long for LFR.

[Louis CK]

Look at the time spent in queue waiting for tanks now.
Now look at me.
Look back at the time spent
Now BACK to me.
Sadly, the time spent isnt me.
I have no idea where I'm going with this.
I'm a tank.

lmao

Typical tank =P

[Yimereh]

I support 5-man LFR, dungeon queues have rarely been as absurd as LFR queues and considering how watered down LFR can be I don't think it would take a whole lot of resources to implement.

My biggest problem with LFR is you are throwing new players into a jungle to learn with many people ready to rip out their throats at the first sign of weakness. This doesn't promote growth and development it promotes failure and cancelling subscriptions.

LFR has the tendency at times to be as ugly as League of Legends except with 20 more people which doesn't make the scenario any prettier. 5-man LFR would be a much more intimate experience and allow New players to ease their way into the raiding environment without being overwhelmed with 24 other potentially judgmental people.

It is difficult to identify in LFR who is new and who is botting/not trying because they assume the group will carry them and or determination stacks will make up the difference. Less players = more accountability.