PTR: Icy Touch Threat

[Savarea]

Note: I have not played DK in the PTR as of yet.

To anyone who has tested out DK tanking (specifically ICC raids) with the new Icy Touch threat change, I'm curious how it affects taunt juggle fights. Is it minor enough to keep up diseases when boss is not on you or is it comparable to a taunt? Having diseases up is a big part of our function even as a tank, and I'd hate to screw up the taunt juggle simply by applying a disease.

[Zao]

Frost Fever is not affected by the threat change. The change only affects the direct damage portion of IT.

Edit: Oh yeah...misread your post. What below posters said is correct. The only issue I could see would be Festergut after you switch to OT. But you'll have to watch your threat there anyways.

[Wingwraith]

I don't think that was the question.

I think he's asking, if his diseases drop off while he is not the focused tank, will reapplying his diseases via IT and PS cause so much threat that it's essentially a taunt?

Without having actually experienced the new IT, I'd guess no.
However, I could see IT pulling agro if you just performed a tank swap.

[Shiira]

Blizzard will probably just double or triple the threat caused by icy touch, nothing significant when you and another tank are on a mob but the point is to make initial threat easier.

[mhp]

If you just performed a tank swap, the taunt is still on the boss, so performing IT won't immediately pull.

If the swap happened earlier, the other tank should have a decent lead, and IT shouldn't pull either.

In other words: No, it shouldn't be an issue to reapply frost fever with IT. Just don't go all out on damage, and watch your threat. That's about it. But a single IT shouldn't ever pull off of a decent tank.

[Apostolic]

Just as other tanks have High Threat moves and can use it after you have a decent lead, the same should apply to DKs. DKs always had a problem because we had to wait for RS to proc rather then an "on use" ability.

Blizzard will probably just double or triple the threat caused by icy touch, nothing significant when you and another tank are on a mob but the point is to make initial threat easier.

It is actually 7 times normal threat. IT Threat calculation is DMG * FP (2.0734) * 7 = or 14.5138 per 1 point of dmg.

[Savarea]

Thanks for all the feedback thus far... I plan on giving it decent testing here soon, if I find anything worth mentioning I'll be sure to post.

[Shiira]

It is actually 7 times normal threat. IT Threat calculation is DMG * FP (2.0734) * 7 = or 14.5138 per 1 point of dmg.

That's a pretty ridiculous threat bonus, I'm not a tank myself but I bet they can't wait to be able to put upwards of 20k threat on mobs from 20 yards away.

[Shelly]

If you just performed a tank swap, the taunt is still on the boss, so performing IT won't immediately pull.

Um .... it doesn't quite work that way.

What happens with the taunt is that the taunter becomes the focus of the tauntee for 6 seconds. If the taunter doesn't do more aggro than the person they are taunting off of then after 6 seconds the tauntee goes right back to their other target. All it does is put you at the top of the threat chain, it's not a guarantee that you'll remain there.

OP, if you have any experience playing a warrior then you should know to not use your IT immediately after a taunt if it's generating as much threat as a shield-slam. In general I (as a tanking warrior) typically have to deal with off (and sometimes main) tanks who don't push their threat. So on bosses I typically have to stop attacking completely in order for them to pick up a boss after a taunt.

It sucks. But you get used to it.

[Wingwraith]

That's a pretty ridiculous threat bonus, I'm not a tank myself but I bet they can't wait to be able to put upwards of 20k threat on mobs from 20 yards away.

It's only ridiculous that it took them so long to give it to us. They essentially gave us our own Shield Slam.

[Shiira]

It's only ridiculous that it took them so long to give it to us. They essentially gave us our own Shield Slam.

True, but it's situationally far more useful for initial threat than shield slam due to the range and the lack of a real cooldown.

Of course it's not like shield slam is all that warriors have, it's just nice that dks are finally getting a decent snap threat ability that isn't a 51 point talent at the bottom of a sub optimal tree.

[Wingwraith]

True, but it's situationally far more useful for initial threat than shield slam due to the range and the lack of a real cooldown.

I'm looking forward to it. It should really help smooth out those problematic times with adds arriving and only 1 taunt and 1 rune off CD.

[Dakara]

Well, on Saurfang for example, my threat is pretty horrible when I don't have threat due to no rune strikes. So with the new IT, when the other Tank taunts, instead of them getting a commanding threat lead on me (which I eventually inherit anyway) I'll be able to keep up with them.

[Shiira]

How hard is icy touch hitting for a decently geared blood tank anyway?

[Apostolic]

How hard is icy touch hitting for a decently geared blood tank anyway?

About 1k, frost is about 3k (these are raid buffed numbers). Frost gets about 20-30% more crit on IT.

[mhp]

What happens with the taunt is that the taunter becomes the focus of the tauntee for 6 seconds. If the taunter doesn't do more aggro than the person they are taunting off of then after 6 seconds the tauntee goes right back to their other target. All it does is put you at the top of the threat chain, it's not a guarantee that you'll remain there.

Exactly. For 6 seconds, IT won't immediately pull. Which is exactly what I said. The other tank has a small window to out-threat the IT, which shouldn't be an issue.

If it is, well... it's time to replace a tank.

[Shiira]

About 1k, frost is about 3k (these are raid buffed numbers). Frost gets about 20-30% more crit on IT.

So for blood that's about 11k threat if you get a 20% resist and about 14k with no resist. That sounds pretty reasonable.

[Apostolic]

So for blood that's about 11k threat if you get a 20% resist and about 14k with no resist. That sounds pretty reasonable.

1k * 2.0734 * 7 = 14513.8 threat as blood
3k * 2.0734 * 7 = 43541.4 threat as frost

Crits are double damage (meaning double the threat)

[kumduh]

1k * 2.0734 * 7 = 14513.8 threat as blood
3k * 2.0734 * 7 = 43541.4 threat as frost

Crits are double damage (meaning double the threat)

It's been a long time since I've looked at the frost tanking tree, but it seems like it would be smart to pick up Death Chill to use at the very beginning of the fight for a whole lot of threat. Nearly 40k front loaded threat just seems like it would be too good to pass up.

[mhp]

It's been a long time since I've looked at the frost tanking tree, but it seems like it would be smart to pick up Death Chill to use at the very beginning of the fight for a whole lot of threat. Nearly 40k front loaded threat just seems like it would be too good to pass up.

While that'd be grand, where would you get the point from? And.... with the buffed IT, even an on-crit IT does a truck load of threat, which should be good enough. Spending a whole point into an otherwise fairly lackluster talent, for the sake of the pull alone doesn't seem appealing to me