Elemental opening rotation and then onwards

[Girthmonster]

So I've looked at teh guide here at on EJ and I seem to have understood the Elemental rotation except for the opener. Could anyone give me some insight into what goes on here and then how I carry on into my regualr rotation?

I'm a totally new boosted Shammy, but have heroic raided on my druid a fair bit so I can pick stuff up rather quickly.

Thanks!

[shamantime]

It's a fairly easy rotation.

Flame Shock(Keep this up at all times), Lava Burst on C.D or when it procs, Use Earth Shock when you have 6-7 Lightning Shield Charges, and Lightning Bolt Spam!
FS>LvB>Fulm(6-7)>LB

for lvl 90 Talent
Elemental Blast
FS>EB>LvB>Fulm(6-7)>LB
Unleashed Fury
FS>UE>LvB>Fulm(6-7)>LB

Searing Totem can be kept up for a small dps increase, but it's usually not worth it.

FS=Flame Shock
UE= Unleash Elements
LvB= Lava Burst
Fulm= Fulmination
LB= Lightning Bolt
EB= Elemental Blast

[Girthmonster]

Wow that seems almost insanely simple. What about my fire elemental?

[Sigmatic]

Unleashed Fury Opener:
Pop Fire Elemental with 3-4 seconds left on pull
Use Pre-pot
Pre cast Lightning Bolt at 1.5 seconds
Bloodlust
Flame Shock
Stormlash (if you aren't dropping this first, then drop it after Ascendance).
Unleash Elements
Lava Burst
Ascendance
Spam Lava Burst

Elemental Blast/Primal Elementalist Opener:
Pop Fire Elemental with 3-4 seconds left on pull
Use Pre-pot
Pre cast Elemental Blast or Lightning Bolt (If you took PE) at 1.5 seconds
Bloodlust
Flame Shock
Stormlash (if you aren't dropping this first, then drop it after Ascendance).
Lava Burst
Ascendance
Spam Lava Burst

After the opener just follow the priority list that shamantime put above.

[Deleted]

Elemental Blast/Primal Elementalist Opener:
Pop Fire Elemental with 3-4 seconds left on pull
Use Pre-pot
Pre cast Elemental Blast or Lightning Bolt (If you took PE) at 1.5 seconds
Bloodlust
Flame Shock
Stormlash (if you aren't dropping this first, then drop it after Ascendance).
Lava Burst
Ascendance
Spam Lava Burst

After the opener just follow the priority list that shamantime put above.

I think that instead of using Elemental blast on the pull use Lightning bolt instead. If you use use Elemental Blast just before Ascendance you will have the buff from EB a short while longer during Ascendance and your EB will also benefit from your trinket proccs.

Elemental Blast/Primal Elementalist Opener:
Pop Fire Elemental with 3-4 seconds left on pull
Use Pre-pot
Pre cast Lightning Bolt (If you took PE) at 1.5 seconds
Bloodlust
Flame Shock
Stormlash (if you aren't dropping this first, then drop it after Ascendance).
Lava Burst
Elemental Blast
Ascendance
Spam Lava Burst

[Bllets]

I think that instead of using Elemental blast on the pull use Lightning bolt instead. If you use use Elemental Blast just before Ascendance you will have the buff from EB a short while longer during Ascendance and your EB will also benefit from your trinket proccs.

Elemental Blast/Primal Elementalist Opener:
Pop Fire Elemental with 3-4 seconds left on pull
Use Pre-pot
Pre cast Lightning Bolt (If you took PE) at 1.5 seconds
Bloodlust
Flame Shock
Stormlash (if you aren't dropping this first, then drop it after Ascendance).
Lava Burst
Elemental Blast
Ascendance
Spam Lava Burst

What you gain by doing that is either crit (useless), mastery or haste. But you loose 1.5 seconds of trinket uptime with ascendance, which seems like a way bigger lose then getting 3500 haste or crit for a few seconds. I would definitely rather pre-cast EB then LB.

[Gistwiki]

Unleashed Fury Opener:
Pop Fire Elemental with 3-4 seconds left on pull
Use Pre-pot
Pre cast Lightning Bolt at 1.5 seconds
Bloodlust
Flame Shock
Stormlash (if you aren't dropping this first, then drop it after Ascendance).
Unleash Elements
Lava Burst
Ascendance
Spam Lava Burst

Elemental Blast/Primal Elementalist Opener:
Pop Fire Elemental with 3-4 seconds left on pull
Use Pre-pot
Pre cast Elemental Blast or Lightning Bolt (If you took PE) at 1.5 seconds
Bloodlust
Flame Shock
Stormlash (if you aren't dropping this first, then drop it after Ascendance).
Lava Burst
Ascendance
Spam Lava Burst

After the opener just follow the priority list that shamantime put above.

For each of those you'll want to UE before the Flame Shock for 2 reasons.

1) The precast won't hit the boss to proc the meta before you cast the flame shock otherwise, losing you out on 3 ticks of flame shock.
2) In the case of PE/EB because of #1 it's worthwhile using UE on the pull.

The best personal dps involves having another (say a resto) shaman drop their Stormlash on the pull and dropping yours after Ascendance for maximum trinket uptime on Ascendance, but if you don't have another one that'll likely be the best raid dps.

You'll also want to cast the Lava Burst before the Stormlash in this one if you're the first lash to avoid wasting a potential Lava Surge before Ascendance

So in short, optimal personal dps would be:

Pop FE ~2.5-3 seconds before the pull
Pre-pot
Pre-cast EB if using EB, Lightning Bolt if you took PE/UF at 1.5-2s
UF at pull
Heroism
Flame Shock
Lava Burst
Stormlash (if you're the first or only one, otherwise after Ascendance)
Lava Burst if you got a Lava Surge Proc, otherwise Ascendance
Lava Burst Spam

[Hypasonic]

Wouldn't you miss out on the burst from UF by popping it so early before ascendance?

[EruptorNZ]

Wouldn't you miss out on the burst from UF by popping it so early before ascendance?

Yeah that's what I'm thinking

DPS wise

3 extra ticks of flame shock + 30% extra damage on flame shock < 1-2 lava bursts doing 10% more damage, and 1 lava burst doing an extra 30% damage.

[Anzen]

For UF:

Fire Elemental > Lightning Bolt >==> Unleash Elements (0) > Flame Shock > Lava Burst > Ascendanceeee

For EB:

Fire Elemental > Pot > Elemental Blast > Flame Shock (0) > Lava Burst > Ascendanceee

Ain't nobody getting me to drop Stormlash during my opener!

[hatchetman240]

why lighting bolt then pot? Doesnt UE pop your trinkets and meta?

EDIT: also why Unleash Elements (0) > Lava Burst > Flame Shock ? Wouldnt UE>FS>LB>ASC be ideal for capitalizing on your UE buff? I assumed order didnt matter since GCDs are the same, knowing that FS will land before LB either way.

[Gistwiki]

Wouldn't you miss out on the burst from UF by popping it so early before ascendance?

A small bit of it. You'll lose 2 Lava Bursts on it there. 1 for the flame shock, and 1 for the Stormlash Totem. The Stormlash totem loss however is something you'll lose regardless though unless you're using yours after Ascendance making the comparison another 30% on Flame Shock + 30% damage to Flame Shock vs 30% damage to a single Lava Burst and 10% for a second. Assuming 35% haste as a base you're at 12 ticks (if I remember FS starting at 9 right,) heroism brings you up to 17, and the meta to 22 (haste is multiplicative, 35% haste should be brought up to 128% haste with heroism/meta.)

That's what I get for not doing the math before. It's 5 ticks you gain rather than 3.

@ Anzen - Why Lava Burst before Flame Shock there? I don't see how the 30% to Lava Burst would outweigh the 50% lost from not having Flame Shock on the target. You get the same # of Lava Bursts boosted by the UF debuff either way.

[hatchetman240]

because LB has a travel time and when you FS after LB the FS lands slightly before the LB due to 0 travel time. I still want to know the logic in opening with lightning bolt

[Girthmonster]

Thanks for all the great feed back. quicj addendum. Do ele shamans care about flameshock haste breakpoints? It doesn't seem like we do. We just kind of take the haste taht comes with out gear and then stack out mastery. correct?

Ive noticed most ele shamans have a haste level that is about 1/2 of what their mastery level is.

[Divos]

Thanks for all the great feed back. quicj addendum. Do ele shamans care about flameshock haste breakpoints? It doesn't seem like we do. We just kind of take the haste taht comes with out gear and then stack out mastery. correct?

Ive noticed most ele shamans have a haste level that is about 1/2 of what their mastery level is.

We don't care about the haste break points for Flame Shock.

As for stacking mastery or haste, it depends on your gear. You'll need to run a sim to see what would be best for you.

I go back and forth between stats. When it was progression, I based it on the fight we were working on; now that progression is over for me, it's what ever I feel like, lol.

[Gistwiki]

because LB has a travel time and when you FS after LB the FS lands slightly before the LB due to 0 travel time. I still want to know the logic in opening with lightning bolt

That's what the ue is for in that situation though, to hit the boss with something before flame shock to proc the meta. What I don't get in there is the lava burst. The idea would be to get the benefit of ue on both, but the gain on lvb would be outweighed by the loss for not having flame shock up first, hence my confusion.

[Girthmonster]

We don't care about the haste break points for Flame Shock.

As for stacking mastery or haste, it depends on your gear. You'll need to run a sim to see what would be best for you.

I go back and forth between stats. When it was progression, I based it on the fight we were working on; now that progression is over for me, it's what ever I feel like, lol.

Ok, well pretend I'm just starting progression. I'm Ilvl 495 and wondering what's up. Haste or mastery?

[Tock20]

Also, lately with simcraft, my results have not been giving me a number for int, just crit/mastery/haste. Any ideas what I'm doing wrong?

[Anzen]

For UF:

Fire Elemental > Lightning Bolt > Pot > Unleash Elements (0) > Lava Burst > Flame Shock > Ascendanceeee

For EB:

Fire Elemental > Elemental Blast > Pot > Flame Shock (0) > Lava Burst > Ascendanceee

Ain't nobody getting me to drop Stormlash during my opener!

Sorry just re-checked, eurgh Flame Shock obviously should have been before Lava Burst there. I shouldn't post that early in the morning.

EDIT: also why Unleash Elements (0) > Lava Burst > Flame Shock ? Wouldnt UE>FS>LB>ASC be ideal for capitalizing on your UE buff?

Yep.

@ Anzen - Why Lava Burst before Flame Shock there? I don't see how the 30% to Lava Burst would outweigh the 50% lost from not having Flame Shock on the target. You get the same # of Lava Bursts boosted by the UF debuff either way.

#2early

That's what the ue is for in that situation though, to hit the boss with something before flame shock to proc the meta. What I don't get in there is the lava burst. The idea would be to get the benefit of ue on both, but the gain on lvb would be outweighed by the loss for not having flame shock up first, hence my confusion.

Correct on both.

Also, lately with simcraft, my results have not been giving me a number for int, just crit/mastery/haste. Any ideas what I'm doing wrong?

Under options, go to the scaling tab; ensure Analyze Intellect is checked.

[sumoncps]

There are excellent answer .

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Well conversion