Vengeful retreat seems counter-intuitive

[Deleted]

Especially the talent.

Aren't we supposed to want to be in melee range, not run away from it? It should be vegenful lunge forward, not retreat.

The talent is odd because that maximum fury sounds good but why get more fury while leaping away from the combat you're building fury for?

It's just putting the cart in front of the horse for me.

[Hyve]

Avoiding enemy hits is a big part of tanking, this literally takes it one further and makes it your choice to kite, or avoid a big incoming hit. It sounds cool to me.

[Imnick]

You can just retreat and then lunge if you don't actually want to leave melee range, but there's a lot of enemy powers that being able to quickly flip out of melee would be useful against.

[Deleted]

You can just retreat and then lunge if you don't actually want to leave melee range, but there's a lot of enemy powers that being able to quickly flip out of melee would be useful against.

But surely that's what fel rush is for? I just don't get why you'd want to run out of melee.

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Avoiding enemy hits is a big part of tanking, this literally takes it one further and makes it your choice to kite, or avoid a big incoming hit. It sounds cool to me.

I guess but like as a tank I'm sure they could have made it vengeance specific and made it a little more tanky. Right now it just feels dumb as a havoc ability and talent.

Like you want to fel rush to get out of things. Isn't that what that's for? Idk man.

[Vemras]

But surely that's what fel rush is for? I just don't get why you'd want to run out of melee.

Well, we don't have the full picture, yet. Could be there will be more abilities meant for use to engage/start melee combat that would benefit from the occasional vengeful retreat.

[FobManX]

Could be useful for kiting which is something tanks have to do from time to time(assuming its not just a DPS talent).

Can also be useful for mechanics which require tanks to swap and then run away(e.g. 2nd boss in HFC).

[Cooper]

Vengeful Retreat out for the big hit, Fel Rush back in to melee range. Or some variant thereof. Vengeful Retreat, Glaive Toss, Fel Rush. Something like that.

[The Archmage]

Also, apparently the ability has been moved to core, since it's not a talent anymore. MOAR free movement!

[kensim]

Vengeful retreat into eye beam?

[Kyzawolf]

Vengeful retreat into eye beam?

Into glaive toss into fel Rush?

DH is going to be so fun.

[Orloth]

Into glaive toss into fel Rush?

DH is going to be so fun.

Talented Fel Rush makes it rotational (more DPCT and equal FuryPCT then Demon's Bite), couple that with talented Vengeful Retreat and you've got a scary burst of Fury on a 25 sec CD. And if your Guild leader's a stickler for melee staying put, you can just take different talents and save it for jumping out of fire.

Edit: Also good for positioning for AOE, as our main AOE will be Fel Rush. Chaos Nova > VR > FR > FR the other way > Eye Beam = Lots of AOE damage on stunned mobs.

[Kuze]

You don't pvp do you?

[The Archmage]

I think it's an amazing ability, and i am glad it has been moved to core abilities. In PvP it's a beast, allows for some decent kiting and getting out of trouble.

PvE wise it's free movement, can be used ala Disengage style for minimum movement downtime... talented allows also to build fury (and a FULL bar at that) when travelling to the next target/not being able to hit anything.

All on a 25 seconds CD. What's not to love?

[shimerra]

You can seriously think of no situation in any dungeon, raid, BG, or Arena where being able to exit melee quickly would be useful? Really? Hell using this ability alone as a quick re-positioning ability will be excellent. Need to drag boss across the room quickly? Vengeful retreat, oh and enjoy your couple of seconds of not taking damage because you lept presumably out of melee range. On top of that I imagine with intelligent use of the ability and proper positioning you can effectively use it as another charge.

The talent is simple. You exit melee give yourself some breathing room and allow cds to come back up so when you go back in you've got full fury to unload on them.


Seriously how can you not see how this could be used?

[Deleted]

I'm thinking it is useful for helping ranged on adds (think Kilrogg in HFC). Especially since we have Fel Rush to get back to the boss again.

I'm thinking the extreme mobility will be really helpful since Legion will be quite melee heavy.

[InkarnateKT]

Theres no downside to this ability whatsoever:

• If you don't need to leave melee don't use it.
• You can turn your character and use it to lunge forward like disengage.
• There's a talent that generates 96 rage over time after you use it (dps increase).
• There is a whole type of gameplay called PvP that some players enjoy.

[Saverem]

I think it's weird that Vengeance is also getting it.

It's fine for Havok as an escape ability.

[Deleted]

I think of it as a more controlled version of Death from Above from rogues . You retreat back for the extra fury then dash back in to continue dealing damage . Now for rogues that was absolutely terrible because they lost so much auto DPS during that time and it required alot of ressources . If that will be the same for DH we will see in the future

[Deleted]

Warriors used to leap during CS for additional damage with the glyph, it was counter intuitive to roll it in the rotation but was fine doing it. Here you chose the talent to make it a dps cd so i'm fine with it.

[Cooper]

Oh they changed it from "Avoid 1 hit." Huh.