Does World of Warcraft suck?

[skyclops]

Ummm...WOW is not the "best" fantasy mmo...it is just the one that appeals to the bigger player base. There is a lot of reasons behind that but calling WOW the best is entirely related to your own person preference. So basically you feel it is..other may say LOTR is or Rifts or whatever.

Basically fans will be fans...Saying WOW is the best is like saying Taco Bell makes the best tacos. Sure, more people eat their tacos but do they make the best one? NAWWW..they are just the easiest to get usually.

You fail to see the point wow is the best mmo it has won the most awards from the gaming industry
it has set a standard, many have tried to match & failed
the awards the subs & the whole ip of wow has made a small genre big
think what tomb raider did when it first came out
wow is the best at what it does

[The Jackal]

You fail to see the point wow is the best mmo it has won the most awards from the gaming industry
it has set a standard, many have tried to match & failed
the awards the subs & the whole ip of wow has made a small genre big
think what tomb raider did when it first came out
wow is the best at what it does

I may be wrong here. But I can't find a website that lists all the awards Warcraft has won. Bioware has had over 30 awards for Game of the Year, Game of the Month ETC, by almost every major news and gaming community out there. I know Blizzard has won some awards but the MOST from the gaming industry?

Please provide the link

[dbgokux4]

No. It doesn't. It's a beautiful rendition of lore and gameplay mechanics, graphical appeal and design. Proof? An opinion. You can't prove a game sucks or is awesome except by what you like. I know plenty of people who hate Lord of the Rings despite its many awards. Same concept. Why ever bring this topic up again? Unless you're looking to get flamed and such, I mean...why?

Some obvious facts people harbor are wrong like saying WoW is what other MMO's are modeled after and such...but you know that.

What's this thread's goal, if you have one? Just wondering

[Gahgoots]

I just read the title....so my answer is "Yes"

[Fogkin]

Ummm...WOW is not the "best" fantasy mmo...it is just the one that appeals to the bigger player base. There is a lot of reasons behind that but calling WOW the best is entirely related to your own person preference. So basically you feel it is..other may say LOTR is or Rifts or whatever.

Basically fans will be fans...Saying WOW is the best is like saying Taco Bell makes the best tacos. Sure, more people eat their tacos but do they make the best one? NAWWW..they are just the easiest to get usually.

red burrito > taco bell

mmm I'm hungry now.

I will agree with you though. WoW has the biggest fan base. I have played Aion and LOTRO both for a few months and they were good games. But it's hard to get into a game when you have nobody to quest with or help you out. But, SWTOR=the greatest mmo evaaaar(yes i'm being optimistic)

[hambonee]

You fail to see the point wow is the best mmo it has won the most awards from the gaming industry
it has set a standard, many have tried to match & failed
the awards the subs & the whole ip of wow has made a small genre big
think what tomb raider did when it first came out
wow is the best at what it does

Dude, no it's not. Please...

WoW has appealed to the masses, that is all it has done best. Many Many other games have done things much better than WOW by a long shot. It was just there at the right time. EQ was a bit too hard core, along comes WoW and produces a "decent" game that lets casual people raid, they join, its ok and they play, invest time, now no one wants to spend effort changing as they have loyalty to old characters. BEST is and allways will be a personal preference. I could give a ounce of damn about what some award says.

However, WoW is the old man now and is loosing that...people are dropping and will continue.

I get it, your a WoW fanboy and no one can tell you anything else. BUt here again..more DOES NOT equal better. WoW has become crap in my view and I am gladly leaving it behind...more and more people are...it's not the best by far.

[shamblingswarm]

I may be wrong here. But I can't find a website that lists all the awards Warcraft has won. Bioware has had over 30 awards for Game of the Year, Game of the Month ETC, by almost every major news and gaming community out there. I know Blizzard has won some awards but the MOST from the gaming industry?

Please provide the link

\

Bioware aint a game is a game company, WoW is a game not a game company. IF u put Bioware against Blizzard im 100% sure blizzard has more awards than bioware. All blizzard games all of them get Game of the Year + at least 5 other wards on every single magazine and game related media.

[bigjohnburger]

reading through i found many of your points outright false and fictitious.
for example:"The end game content is 95% pointless. Since your level is usually maxed out at this point, you get no more experience and items are the only reason for going anywhere. Nothing can be accomplished by yourself or with a small group of friends. Any item worth getting requires you to join a 25 man raid and go into an instance. This many people getting organized can mean standing around and waiting for a couple of hours".
there are these things called 10man raids, and there are these things called loot systems.

going back over your posts its rather clear you do indeed hate WoW and have been hyping rift on these forums since your account started.

false and fictitious mean the same thing lol.

[skyclops]

Dude, no it's not. Please...

WoW has appealed to the masses, that is all it has done best. Many Many other games have done things much better than WOW by a long shot. It was just there at the right time. EQ was a bit too hard core, along comes WoW and produces a "decent" game that lets casual people raid, they join, its ok and they play, invest time, now no one wants to spend effort changing as they have loyalty to old characters. BEST is and allways will be a personal preference. I could give a ounce of damn about what some award says.

However, WoW is the old man now and is loosing that...people are dropping and will continue.

I get it, your a WoW fanboy and no one can tell you anything else. BUt here again..more DOES NOT equal better. WoW has become crap in my view and I am gladly leaving it behind...more and more people are...it's not the best by far.

To say i,m a fanboy is pure speculation on your part
i played city of heroes at launch & loved the game
i played warhammer & liked some of the original concept
i played conan & hated it
over the course of wows time if you GOOGLE its your friend you know
you will find that during wows time from creation upto today it has won
the most MMORPG awards than any other MMORPG
awards voted for by ppl & the industry.
also if you feel that way about wow why on earth are you on a wow based forum
moaning about it? makes no sense?

[unkn0wnerr0r]

i withdraw my apparent error in not reading the first 5 words, and the statement of the information withdrawn from that.

but maintain the statement of the original poster's sincerity.

Not your fault, people that are so devoted to a game are very quick to come to it's defense. Which is one of the problems with the game to be honest. If people were more open to admit mistakes made, and then call Blizz on them it would be a much different game. I remember for over a year being told that "Wintergrasp" will be fixed, being called a noob,retard, other names I won't mention when asking about it. Same for TB when I brought it up during beta. I was called names by people on these, and the official forums. The paladin ret mastery, when I worked out some of the math and posted it I was called a bunch of names and told they would fix it.

If people like this didn't exist the game would be so much better.

also if you feel that way about wow why on earth are you on a wow based forum
moaning about it? makes no sense?

Maybe I got my boards confused, but I thought we were in the off topic video games board? Is that right? I mean there is a main general board for discussing WoW. So I guess the question is "if you aren't interested in other games besides WoW, why are YOU here?" Personally I know why people do that. They come to this to flame other games. That and they want to belittle, and bully people to keep them from switching over. It's a damn shame we have seen it become so much a part of these forums.

[reemi]

For me, World of Warcraft is the only good game available.

I got every console since Atari 2600.... So, I played many many many many games and usually I stop playing after 5 minutes.

[blablablablablabla]

Yes its scientificly proven that world of warcraft suck so if you thought you were enjoying it you were wrong. So now that you know you can stop enhoying it.

On a unrelated note its nice to see that rift devlopers thing theire game is finished enough that they have time to hang out on mmo champion

[Grable]

Doesn't change the fact that RIFT hasn't done anything innovative.
It takes a bit more than just a copy to succeed in MMO world these days.

[skyclops]

Not your fault, people that are so devoted to a game are very quick to come to it's defense. Which is one of the problems with the game to be honest. If people were more open to admit mistakes made, and then call Blizz on them it would be a much different game. I remember for over a year being told that "Wintergrasp" will be fixed, being called a noob,retard, other names I won't mention when asking about it. Same for TB when I brought it up during beta. I was called names by people on these, and the official forums. The paladin ret mastery, when I worked out some of the math and posted it I was called a bunch of names and told they would fix it.

If people like this didn't exist the game would be so much better.



Maybe I got my boards confused, but I thought we were in the off topic video games board? Is that right? I mean there is a main general board for discussing WoW. So I guess the question is "if you aren't interested in other games besides WoW, why are YOU here?" Personally I know why people do that. They come to this to flame other games. That and they want to belittle, and bully people to keep them from switching over. It's a damn shame we have seen it become so much a part of these forums.

I have not said one bad word towards you
so how cani be flaming you?
i,m just getting a point across
& the reality is that wow must be doing something right for the awards & sheer number of ppl that play it?
case closed
to quote stan lee
Nuff Said

[The Jackal]

For me, World of Warcraft is the only good game available.

I got every console since Atari 2600.... So, I played many many many many games and usually I stop playing after 5 minutes.

I have a simple question how can you tell how good a game is if only after five minutes you stop playing? that honestly makes no sense to me. For you Warcraft may be the best game and I admit when it came out, it polished itself and added instances it did a really good job. However the stale pattern started to show itself..."Same Dungeon, Get badges and repeat" you are pretty much doing the exact same dungeon expect with different people several times a month. After seven years of the same. Getting a little boring.

I know some will say that's how all MMO's are. Not exactly it's not just a grind fest at the end.But back to my original point. It takes about 3 hours to download Rift and all the updates. For the average game I'd say with a high speed connection it still takes about an hour to two depending on how much game there is.

You mean to say, for all that time downloading. You play five minutes of a starter area and then stop?

[zephurwitch]

Doesn't change the fact that RIFT hasn't done anything innovative.
It takes a bit more than just a copy to succeed in MMO world these days.

This mindset is completely boggling to me. You see a UI that looks kind of the same and you jump to "its exactly like wow"
just so you are aware..there are dozens of games that use that ui...many from BEFORE wow came out. It is what people like and can use easily.

[Deleted]

First off - I apologise if this is not sufficiently cohesive, or if there are logical errors or generally something makes sense. I've some problems with writing, but I do my best to make it understandable.

This is primarily a post for people who are interested on a level which extends a bit further than just "I like to play games", thus I rather not have an abstract but...
TL;DR:
Part 1.
WoW Killer discussion only truly applied to AoC and WAR (primarily) as these were games positioned as WoW Killer
Rift is not positioned anywhere like this, despite the "We are not in Azeroth anymore" thing of theirs

Part 2.
What is innovation in MMO's? Expansion packs are basically just makeovers, with little to no innovation, yet in their own way, they are completely new games.
What level/type of innovation should we expect and require from developers of new MMO's or IP, and how much innovation should we expect from Blizzard with their expansion packs?

Part 1.
Whenever a new MMO is launched, the same discussion arises: "Is this a WoW killer?"
After semi-quitting WoW because of a change in priorities, I have kept paying attention to the significant MMORPG launches and discussions surrounding them. Additionally, I have investigated the new products themselves, to learn the basic idea, as well as their intended position.
Since Age of Conan, Lord of the Rings Online and WAR, I have not seen any game positioned on the basis of "Taking market share from WoW", it must also be said that I am not sure if LotRO was positioned that way either.

Reflecting the launch of these 3 games, I noticed the most significant "WoW Killer" discussions regarding AoC and WAR, LotRO had a few, but generally people appeared to perceive it as an addition to WoW, or an appeal to a somewhat different audience.

Since then, there has been little of interest, as I have seen it until recently, with Rift.
Now, the WoW killer discussions are almost at AoC level, however there is one major difference: Funcom made their game with the hopes of becoming serious competition to WoW, a game positioned as what we refer to as a potential "WoW Killer". (The spectacular failure is another discussion)
Trion on the other hand are positioning their game as a mere alternative, or a "Same for Same" product. The same concept and idea as WoW with so far one main point of difference: Classes available (Might be more, but this seems to be their most significant (dis)advantage)
Rift is, in other words, a game which is not positioned as a potential "WoW Killer", it is simply just another game.

Any discussion regarding WoW killers are irrelevant and does not necessarily reflect the up and coming games. The WoW killer discussion was started by a few games early on, however it has now reached a point where the developers have pulled out, and it is only kept alive by gamers who for some reason are interested in discussing it.

Part 2
As for the OP:
I agree with ideas conveyed by the article, and it raises a highly interesting point.
Publishers have for a long time now increasingly focused on "playing it safe", avoiding high-risk games and this way also to a high extent avoiding indie developers (independent devs for all those who are uncertain about "indie", like I was until yesterday).

This risk aversion does to an extent prevent innovation within games, and to an extent, Blizzard is doing the same.
I remember reading about an interview with blizzard about the "upcoming cataclysm", where they stated they were worried about doing such a significant overhaul (Sourde: Edge, 2010). One of the heads wanted to do the normal "couple of new races and classes" (inaccurate quote), but he his trust in his team resulted in Cataclysm. Blizzard did in other words take 1 step away from "the same old", however they still kept (to an extent) the same way of doing things. "collect this and come back to me".

My question is, to which extent is it OK to "play it safe" and how much innovation should we expect and require from Blizzard? (Or any developer of new MMO's)
And also, what constitutes Innovation in this aspect? (Both in Exp. packs and in new IP's)

Should they seek out greater amounts of change, how will the audience react and what should in that case be changed?
With Cataclysm, Blizzard launched a completely new "Context", as I call it, compared to what they did in previous expansions. The game itself shifted with its environment and its history instead of just what races/classes it offered its users.
Rift offers players a different context, but also a different "manner" of playing, hopefully not in a way like AoC, which offered a slowish and clumsy avatar control system, but hopefully something similar to WoW in feel, but not in use.
How boring wouldn't it be if Starcraft and CC played the exact same way.

[Specops]

the whole ip of wow has made a small genre big

World of Warcraft isn't its own IP, it's the Warcraft IP turned into an MMO.

[Deleted]

No World of Warcraft does not suck

[Yseran]

WoW isn't the "best". The main thing that keeps people from quitting is the time that they poured into the game. They don't want to start another MMO even if it is better because that would be -admitting- that the time they spent on the game was pointless. Yes, WoW is pointless, so is every other video game. Personally, I find no problem with switching MMOs because I wasn't enjoying my time on WoW. I would log on and afk in Stormwind for about an hour and then just go play a console game. I'm sure there are many who still find the game fun, or they just enjoy playing with friends that they've been playing with on WoW for a few years. Some play MMOs for fun, while many play them to make up for a lack of real life accomplishments.
On the Rift vs. WoW deal. -On paper-, Rift is better than WoW. It has everything WoW has but with some extra features. Why won't it beat WoW? Because most people don't want to start over on a new MMO.
People argue over a new MMO being better than WoW because they want the game to be more known so it can be more successful. And a successful game = more time spent by developers to make a better quality game. In the end, people need to play a game because they enjoy it, and not for E-bragging rights.