Blizzard thinks its player base is full of idiots.

[Huntingbear_grimbatol]

While it's a fact that a vast majority of the playerbase don't give a f*ck about playing optimally it doesn't make them idiots or whatever, it does however make blizzard idiots because there's not enough incentive to make more players care about playing optimally. Case and point = lfr.

[Paperfox]

I think in many cases you're confusing "idiots" with "New players who want to do well and are in the process of learning their class".

My first toon was a hunter who I levelled to 58 (in Wrath), then a DK to 64 then a rogue to 80. Finally I went back to my hunter and laughed - she had no glyphs, talents were totally wrong (if at all) and her gear was crap (for her level).

WoW is a complex game and it takes some time to understand it and do well.

[Dasani]

It does remove depth. It does remove complexity. And for those who actually know what they are doing, it removes options.

This change is for casuals (shocking right? since everything has been aimed at licking casual boots for years) who don't know a damn thing about how to play but at the same time 1) Can't figure out how to properly use their abilities and 2) Are too lazy to look up how to properly use their abilities once they understand they're too stupid to use them properly. So blizzard removes all the offending abilities that confuse idiots.

I'm not sure most of the abilities removed here lately are warranted though. The worst case of this level of rampant stupidity was with Death Knights in wrath. Since they had SO many abilities that used the same runes... I used to try to teach my fellow DKs how to play properly back then and when I asked them what their rotation was, almost all of them, like literally 80-90% of them i spoke to simply said they put ALL of their abilities on their bar, like literally every strike, and just hit them as they lit up. They had no concept of managing runes or using the specific abilities they should've used in that spec and so on, the morons simply threw it all up there and played whack-a-mole with it. You could look at damage meters and check abilities they used and you'd see heart strike, blood strike, death strike, obliterate, and so on on a blood DK DPS. It was mind blowing.

But then blizzard said "NOPE! CANT ALLOW PEOPLE TO BE THIS RETARDED!" so they made the current system where you literally don't get any abilities except what your spec is actually supposed to use. You CANT cast obliterate as blood anymore.

Outright removing MORE abilities on top of that so you literally have nothing else to use is just... ridiculous.

Blood DKs for example in Warlords only have ONE ability that uses blood runes. Just one. That is all. Pestilence. They removed blood boil, they removed heart strike, now you just spam pestilence which is the new blood boil, even single target. And death strike of course is where all your frost/unholy runes will go. And all RP goes into death coil now.

Literally 3 button rotation. GG

[Deleted]

they are right - 7 million of idiots are paying 15 bucks a month for no content ;S

[Deleted]

Based on official forums and mmo-champs im not suprised

[Deleted]

Blizzard thinks its player base is full of idiots.

Nah, not just blizzard.

[Venziir]

"What abilities and spells got cut is a very, very difficult question to answer. Every ability is vital to someone, so we don't take this process lightly. We hope that even if we cut your favorite ability, you can see it in the context of our larger goals. It's important to remember that the point of these changes is to increase players' ability to understand the game, not to reduce depth of gameplay."



As a tank death knight, I never knew when to use blood boil or rune strike. thank you based blizzard. Now I don't have to think. I'd actually prefer if I could just bring my rotation down to hitting the "1" key so if you guys could help out some more that would be great.

There are roughly 7 million people playing the game; That equals a lot of idiots.

[Fluttershy]

wrong post

[Deleted]

Sure they think. They believe to serve a community of "bros" and "dewds".

As more dumb the players are, as less they will see that it's all about gametime played. Loyal customers are those who are easily being dragged into social attachment based addiction.

[Ragedaug]

Breaking News: Company designs game to be more friendly to the majority of their audience!!! People who are not in that majority are outraged that the game isn't being designed for them specifically!!! Breaking News!!!

[Deleted]

Breaking News: Company designs game to be more friendly to the majority of their audience!!! People who are not in that majority are outraged that the game isn't being designed for them specifically!!! Breaking News!!!

So what you're saying is that the majority of the games audience want bad, pandering design. No, the majority of the games audience simply don't care or don't care enough to complain.

The fact of the matter is if you challenge your playerbase with interesting content, they might actually rise to the ocassion and adapt to the challenge. Look at Dark Souls, that game has entirely sold itself on its difficulty because people actually like a challenge sometimes.

I don't think WoW should go back to the kind of balance it had in Vanilla/TBC, where a lot of players simply got stuck at certain levels or raid tiers due to poor progression aids, but I do think it would make WoW a better game in terms of its gameplay rather than just its financial success if Blizzard tried actually making the players work and think in order to get rewarded.

Frankly, I don't think WoW deserves to succeed if Blizzard are going to develop it with the attitude of 'pander to the worst wants of our audience'.

[Binko]

It used to be that you would work your ass off to optimize your characters because you took pride in how you played and performed.

Now many players seem to only do the bare minimum that the game provides incentive for or makes easy. It's pretty damn sad if you ask me.

[Khorm]

"What abilities and spells got cut is a very, very difficult question to answer. Every ability is vital to someone, so we don't take this process lightly. We hope that even if we cut your favorite ability, you can see it in the context of our larger goals. It's important to remember that the point of these changes is to increase players' ability to understand the game, not to reduce depth of gameplay."



As a tank death knight, I never knew when to use blood boil or rune strike. thank you based blizzard. Now I don't have to think. I'd actually prefer if I could just bring my rotation down to hitting the "1" key so if you guys could help out some more that would be great.

Idiots always get offended when people say there are idiots around, that's why you are an idiot.

[Skarzog]

I don't recall that response. Any chance you could dig it up?

Took me a while to find this, but I never forgot it because of how hilarious it was. Here is the source. Also have to clarify, initially I thought this was a response to a question. It was actually just a long post first introducing flexible stats on gear a few months ago.

http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/...enor?#comments

Here is the section I was talking about.

A Holy Paladin has a raid tier set from the Blackrock Foundry. If she switches to her Retribution spec, the tier set is still functional, as the primary stats and set bonuses change. However, if she prefers Haste for her Retribution spec and Crit in her Holy spec (and is someone who enjoys the min-max game), then a single set of armor may not be optimal.

For her healing set, let’s assume this player also has one ring with Spirit, a shield with Spirit, and a trinket that procs on heals. The trinket is almost useless in her Retribution set. The shield is also useless, since Retribution is designed to wield a two-handed weapon. The ring will be sub-optimal because Spirit is useless to a Retribution Paladin, but if it has another valuable stat (e.g. Haste), it may still be worth using—again depending on how min-max-focused the player is.

A more casual player would probably be fine just using the trinket anyway and using a lower Item Level two-handed mace when she plays Retribution. A more min-max player would probably want separate rings, cloaks, trinkets, neck pieces, and weapons to use in the different specs. A very min-max player—such as someone competing in world-first Mythic raid progression—might even want different heads, shoulders, chests, and so on depending on the mix of secondary stats. This player might even swap out gems between the two specs.

This may seem like a lot to take in now, but we’ll continue to watch feedback and answer any additional questions where we can. And again, keep in mind that as with anything still in development, this information or some of the details will likely change as we progress.

As always, we welcome your constructive feedback, and we look forward to reading what you think.

So yes, this is who Blizzard believes a casual player is. Casual player used to mean someone with a limited amount of free time to play. Its evolved into someone who either does not care enough or does not know any better than to use a healing trinket in their dps set. And lets be clear in this quote the theoretical person being discussed is a raider not just some Joe/Jill running around questing. Apparently using a trinket which actually provides some value towards your spec is now min/maxing.

Again I think this quote was hilarious, definitely one of my favorites right next to Tseric's rant. And at the same time its kind of sad how far down the bar has been lowered.

[lockedout]

Casual player used to mean someone with a limited amount of free time to play. Its evolved into someone who either does not care enough or does not know any better than to use a healing trinket in their dps set.

A casual player has nothing to do with time. A casual player means someone without definite or serious intention; careless or offhand. Seeming or tending to be indifferent to what is happening; apathetic or unconcerned. A casual player is one who doesn't take the game seriously, they might not gem or enchant gear, do not care about rotations or max dps. A casual player is a player who may play the game for hours on end but never takes it to seriously or cares enough to learn more. Basically most of the WoW population are casual players and may fir one or all of these criteria.

[Faladrath]

Snapshotting wasn't the vital thing that differentiated one bad player from another. What does that is:

1 - Are they standing in fire? Yes? Bad
2 - Are they failing to interrupt when required to? Yes? Bad
3 - Are they getting out of the group when they have a debuff? No? Bad
4 - Are they performing their rotation well? No? Bad

Forget dps meters. For a long time now, meters are crap. What matters is that people are doing their jobs and getting the boss down, not that you're edging out the other warlock by 5k.

Your nr 4 is what snapshotting dots was about.. And if the strive for a guild is to make people to do basic things(1-3) then yes by all means forget dmg meters(cause yes indeed dps meters are crap, they tell you nothing relevant..) if you are actually progressing when it's relevant and all that then 1-3 won't cut it and nr 4 need to be done at a excellent level.The lower the skill cap on 4 is the easier it will become. But I guess any hc raider won't try to claim that removing snapshotting did't lower the skill-cap..

[MetroStratics]

Take a look around the forums and you'll understand why.
Half the players subscribed to this game likely don't even get to max level or do anything on their characters, yet constantly complain about everything under the sun regardless of its effect on the small portion of the game they cover. People will less than 4k achievement points complain the game is dead or it takes too long for content.

Regardless, Blizzard employees are entirely right. Button Bloat is way overboard now a days compared especially to BC and Wrath. Especially for tanks in situations like Challenge Modes. You can't just use tanking abilities, you have to use stuns, potions, engineering stuff, etc.

The people arguing against this must not really understand the position they are trying to fix.
I don't see how anyone could misconstrue their remarks as condescending, but they are actually trying to help people.

I would be MUCH happier to have 2-3 few buttons, but have our decisions count for much more. This appears to be the direction they are going, especially for healing.
I support it one hundred percent, for now. We will see during the Beta though.
Can't imagine it will matter either way.

[caninepawprints]

There were a lot fewer abilities, and rotations for most classes were simpler in vanilla. Over time, ability bloat has become an issue, and Blizzard is trying to cut back on spells that just don't belong in the game (Druid's Symbiosis, for example). Some of the spells feel like they were thrown in because Blizzard had to add SOMETHING for a certain class at a certain level just because everyone else was getting something. I, for one, am glad to see things scaled back. It's about time it happened.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

Take a look around the forums and you'll understand why.
Half the players subscribed to this game likely don't even get to max level or do anything on their characters, yet constantly complain about everything under the sun regardless of its effect on the small portion of the game they cover. People will less than 4k achievement points complain the game is dead or it takes too long for content.

Regardless, Blizzard employees are entirely right. Button Bloat is way overboard now a days compared especially to BC and Wrath. Especially for tanks in situations like Challenge Modes. You can't just use tanking abilities, you have to use stuns, potions, engineering stuff, etc.

The people arguing against this must not really understand the position they are trying to fix.
I don't see how anyone could misconstrue their remarks as condescending, but they are actually trying to help people.

I would be MUCH happier to have 2-3 few buttons, but have our decisions count for much more. This appears to be the direction they are going, especially for healing.
I support it one hundred percent, for now. We will see during the Beta though.
Can't imagine it will matter either way.

I don't know exactly everything they are removing.. but it would be nice if, instead of removing they just made them less vital. I agree with your main points, its over the top for many specs/classes.. but they could use many of those spells as (pvp only) or for fun only. Like Fel Flame? One of my favorite spells for older stuff. It could easily be changed so its not necessary for raiding (if it is currently)... it could be PVP only.. (give it a short CD, lower damage, and a slow)

[Hardkorr]

A casual player has nothing to do with time. A casual player means someone without definite or serious intention; careless or offhand. Seeming or tending to be indifferent to what is happening; apathetic or unconcerned. A casual player is one who doesn't take the game seriously, they might not gem or enchant gear, do not care about rotations or max dps. A casual player is a player who may play the game for hours on end but never takes it to seriously or cares enough to learn more. Basically most of the WoW population are casual players and may fir one or all of these criteria.

I dunno about not caring. I think a casual is just someone who doesn't take raiding seriously. When I stopped hardcore raiding with my guild and started messing with my alts, I was considered a casual. However, I just preferred min/maxing my twinks for pvp rather than min/maxing my main for pve.