Anyone feel like the KJC nerf has ruined the Warlock class?

[Nerfarien]

Ruined? No.
Handicapped? No.
The removal of FF is the only bad thing here I can mention. Having nothing to cast while on the move except when you save conflags is a bad change. Oh well...

[Aruhen]

It's been like this before MoP so no I don't agree. Though I will say that Warlocks are vastly different these days then Pre MoP days so I can understand where some people are coming from. Nightfall Shadow Bolt is one of those mechanics that we used to have that had a chance to proc while moving.

Personally the thing I miss the most is 3.2 Affliction as it used to be my favorite spec but these days I just can't stand playing that spec. That wont happen though as they seem to love this new Affliction design which I'm just not a fan of.

[Deleted]

It's been like this before MoP so no I don't agree. Though I will say that Warlocks are vastly different these days then Pre MoP days so I can understand where some people are coming from. Nightfall Shadow Bolt is one of those mechanics that we used to have that had a chance to proc while moving.

Personally the thing I miss the most is 3.2 Affliction as it used to be my favorite spec but these days I just can't stand playing that spec. That wont happen though as they seem to love this new Affliction design which I'm just not a fan of.

We used to have at least 2-3 DoTs everyone could refresh while moving as well. Instant Soulfire from Cata was also a thing to think about for Destruction.

Honestly I think the overhaul of Demo would've been enough for MoP. The other stuff feels so unnecessary. Especially since Cata brought an overhaul in Mechanics already and those only needed to be polished a bunch more to feel really good.

[Last Starfighter]

I've had a Warlock since Vanilla, even got the Dreadsteed at lvl 60, but it wasn't until MoP that I played one seriously, and I LOVED it!!! It finally felt like something more than just "a Mage with a pet".

With the KJC nerf, though, he class is right back to being that "Mage with a pet" except even Mages can have a pet.

Frankly, I think Blizzard took the laziest route possible to "balancing" KJC. How about instead of completely gutting what made it so fun, you have it reduce your movement speed, damage, or even spell-range? Something that keeps the same "feeling" of playing a KJC Warlock, without being quite so powerful against other classes)

As it stands, though, I just find the WoD Warlock to be boring as shit, which is a shame since my Betrayer set will be left to rot on a lvl 90 toon.

Hey look! I can play this game!

-Death Knight- Warrior with diseases
-Rogue-Monk with stealth
-Hunter-Warlock with Arrows
-Priest-Paladin with Shadowform
ETC ETC

And everything is boring as shit. They've taken away tons of abilities. And did you play a lock when KJC had a snare? Nobody took it. They took AV which was also stupidly bad, but better than KJC. Having it on a 1 minute cd is fine. 8 seconds is more than you would be moving anyway in pve, and in pvp, same. Casters shouldn't be freely doing casting damage while kiting.

KJC now is much, much better than reducing your damage, or snares you. Casting and moving needed nerfed. And it got nerfed. It should be removed completely. I loved playing my lock prior to mop. And I'll love it in WoD.

- - - Updated - - -

Seconded by every melee spec in the game.

Let's keep casting and moving in the game. And let's also give all melee abilities a 40 yard range? How's dat shit sound yo?

[Apero]

And did you play a lock when KJC had a snare? Nobody took it. They took AV which was also stupidly bad, but better than KJC.

Talking about the the prior 5.4 version? EVERYBODY took it (except for some bosses where the old mf was king), who cares about the snare, you were able to cast everything, it was just amazingly op. Fun times on lei shen with the snare up though were you needed to plan ahead sometimes.

It was always kjc vs mf , archimondes was never an option before 5.4 hits. I even used kjc in t14 when it had the cast time increase passive while moving because it was still superior to av.

[Jessicka]

Prior to the cast everything with a snare version, pre 5.1 or 5.2, it slowed cast times. No one used it. It has been iterated on a few times, its that unbalanceable.

[Baconeggcheese]

Prior to the cast everything with a snare version, pre 5.1 or 5.2, it slowed cast times. No one used it. It has been iterated on a few times, its that unbalanceable.

Make it passive, give it its own energy bar type thing, if you begin moving while casting or begin casting while moving it automatically drains from the energy bar thingamajig and allows for a max of 8 seconds of movement, takes 60 seconds for the energy bar to recharge from 0 to full.

Now its intuitive, compelling, and allows for the same amount of maximum movement.

Tweak numbers and usable spells as needed.

I'm sure people could think up 500 million other ways to make the skill compelling, but blizzard clearly desires to not have casting while moving being a thing so that's the real problem...

[andromalia]

Make it passive, give it its own energy bar type thing, if you begin moving while casting or begin casting while moving it automatically drains from the energy bar thingamajig and allows for a max of 8 seconds of movement, takes 60 seconds for the energy bar to recharge from 0 to full.

Now its intuitive, compelling, and allows for the same amount of maximum movement.

Tweak numbers and usable spells as needed.

I'm sure people could think up 500 million other ways to make the skill compelling, but blizzard clearly desires to not have casting while moving being a thing so that's the real problem...

Or remove it completely and give us talented fel flame to use in niche encounters and scrap the entire current KJC concept. Then we can pick and choose between FF, AV, and MD based on the encounter (lol MD will still never be used). Being able to spam filler while moving is absolutely stupid.

[Kashii]

Or remove it completely and give us talented fel flame to use in niche encounters and scrap the entire current KJC concept. Then we can pick and choose between FF, AV, and MD based on the encounter (lol MD will still never be used). Being able to spam filler while moving is absolutely stupid.

I'm not sure I agree that being able to spam a filler while moving is stupid - - depends on the power of the filler spell. I do agree with your suggestion to replace KJC with talented FF and balance accordingly.

[luckydevours]

Or remove it completely and give us talented fel flame to use in niche encounters and scrap the entire current KJC concept. Then we can pick and choose between FF, AV, and MD based on the encounter (lol MD will still never be used). Being able to spam filler while moving is absolutely stupid.

Having to spend a talent point for an everyday movement ability every other class/spec gets for free? You must be kidding?!

[Deleted]

Having to spend a talent point for an everyday movement ability every other class/spec gets for free? You must be kidding?!

Still a better short-term solution with 1 month to launch then keeping KJC in the Tier (which is also a everyday baseline ability now - Mages got the godlike version of it on Tier 1 - AGAIN.)

[Deleted]

Try going to a private realm and create a warlock and see what happends. The spell made them waaaaaay to powerfull. There would be no way ever you would have anything else than a warlock in your team if it was left as it was. If you want to move while doing DPS go play a hunter. If you wanna try something really insane go play a melee class and see how that feels.

[Deleted]

Try going to a private realm and create a warlock and see what happends. The spell made them waaaaaay to powerfull. There would be no way ever you would have anything else than a warlock in your team if it was left as it was. If you want to move while doing DPS go play a hunter. If you wanna try something really insane go play a melee class and see how that feels.

Problem is that Hunter does EXACTLY what Warlocks did in WoD and without any drawbacks on the class compared to what we had (5.4 Version aside, because it's basically now Glyph level). Not only that, but they also got a lot more CC and escapes from Melee than Warlocks. All it needed was number tuning if you pick the Talent, since Hunter have most of their mobility baked into their baseline/glyphs so the tuning happens around that already.

I'm sure the main reason it got removed from Locks though is that "Hunter has to be unique as a ranged physical." I can totally see that being the reasoning of a part of the team. And since Warlocks had the 3rd overhaul in 3 expansions (which is telling about how good they are at getting how the class works) we're out of luck this time.

Another reason is that the talent is so fun and useful, it invalidated their shitty other attempts at talents for that Tier. Archi needed to be changed entirely to be a consideration at all and FoM is still worthless crap if they don't make a fight with 300 adds. Now AD is actually the only really worthwhile pick (add the Glyph and it becomes crazy useful in mid-level mobility fights) and the other two are super situational.

Problem is they crapped on the class so much that original KJC was basically the only thing that could've kept it enjoyable for WoD. Oh well, another rework with 7.0 is coming regardless. Bet ya it's gonna be worse than the MoP one.

[luckydevours]

Still a better short-term solution with 1 month to launch then keeping KJC in the Tier (which is also a everyday baseline ability now - Mages got the godlike version of it on Tier 1 - AGAIN.)

Ot maybe we just get to keep Fel Flame, the same way Mages get to keep Ice Lance and Scorch, Shadowpriests Shadow Word: Pain, Moonkins Moonfire/Sunfire and Ele Shamans their shocks, Lava Surge and Unleash Flame.

[Jessicka]

Try going to a private realm and create a warlock and see what happends. The spell made them waaaaaay to powerfull. There would be no way ever you would have anything else than a warlock in your team if it was left as it was. If you want to move while doing DPS go play a hunter. If you wanna try something really insane go play a melee class and see how that feels.

KJC doesn't make us overpowered. Overtuning did. Please, stop conflating the issue.

[Jahrern]

I am one of those guys that find KJC to be great. It was IMO the step in the right direction for WoW. However, i think all casters should be able to move. Hence why i say it was a step in the right direction. When you play other games and feel the power you have while moving, its hard to see any reason why we need to stationary in the first place. That, and the fact that being stationary in the first place makes no sense.
Another thing being that casters being mobile would also make the game feel alot more "new" and revised. This is my opinion, an opinion i strongly feel should be the norm in WoW.

[Xanattos]

I am one of those guys that find KJC to be great. It was IMO the step in the right direction for WoW. However, i think all casters should be able to move. Hence why i say it was a step in the right direction. When you play other games and feel the power you have while moving, its hard to see any reason why we need to stationary in the first place. That, and the fact that being stationary in the first place makes no sense.
Another thing being that casters being mobile would also make the game feel alot more "new" and revised. This is my opinion, an opinion i strongly feel should be the norm in WoW.

I think casting while on the move is great for some classes but not all. Kjc for locks was great but in order to maintain the balance in the eyes of the QQ it needed to be "balanced." While I do not agree with how they did the balance, something had to be done as melee have stated time and time again it wasn't fair that they had to chase us. I think something along the lines of a damage modifier for the spell affected by kjc (Ex. Incinerate would deal 10% less dmg if you take kjc talent).

[Fenzha]

While I do not agree with how they did the balance, something had to be done as melee have stated time and time again it wasn't fair that they had to chase us.

Thats kind of the point for pvp tho. They are supposed to chase us and we are not supposed to let them catch us. If they complain about that they will be complaining we actually attack them back soon.

[Xanattos]

Thats kind of the point for pvp tho. They are supposed to chase us and we are not supposed to let them catch us. If they complain about that they will be complaining we actually attack them back soon.

I've heard it before. It's not fair that a warlock could put dots on. It's not fair that warlocks can fear. Warlocks shouldn't self heal. I'm by no means a pro at pvp but I dabble in it now and then, the ridiculous QQ that comes out if pvp is sad.

[Bonkura]

All the QoL nerfs combined with nothing exciting to replace said abilities makes the class very unattractive to play for someone who already grew tired of it this expansion. They already gutted Demo before SoO and now they're making Destro a turret/nuke spec as well as Affli becoming just as boring as Shadow has been this expansion (if not even worse). I might actually go back to playing Shadow main again or just something completely different like a healer (which IMO looks exciting for WoD).