Bear Guide: 4.0.0

[Auroro]

Welcome to Bear Guide 4.0.0+

It's still a work in progress atm, but you'll see it growing to its’ full size in the coming hours/days.

Table of Content:
I ............................ Introduction
II ........................... Bear Form
III .......................... Bear Stats
IV .......................... Bear Talents
V ........................... Bear Glyphs
VI........................... Changed/Added Abilities
VII ......................... Mastery
VIII ........................ Gears
IX .......................... Enchantments/Gems
X ........................... Reforge
XI .......................... Macros
XII ......................... Rotation/AoE Tanking
XIII ........................ Addons
XIV ........................ FAQ

I: Introduction

The purpose of this Guide is to sum up knowledge around Bear Tank. Cat Druid, you should go to this link for the Cat Guide: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...-4.0.1-edition.

First of all, let give recognitions to Gzilia (Original Creator), Arel00 (3.0.0 Creator), Leafre (Co-Creator), Retovia (Co-Creator), Alski (Co-Creator), and Qieth (Co-Creator). For this new guide, I will like to give recognitions to Infernix17, and Alski. Also, thank you to those that contributed to the Bear Guide and will keep contributing. This guide is a collection of many people's contributed.

I will paste data from other posters and sources and will cite those sources. If you feel like adding up to it, or correcting any wrong data, just hit reply. Alski or me will make sure the information is updated and correct.

Since the patch 4.0.0 came out many things were change: Gems, Enchantment, Glyphs, Rotation and even Talents. I will update all the changes from 4.0.0 toward all the major points for tanking as a Druid Bear.

We will continue to focus on stats, talents, glyphs, rotation and mechanics designed to develop the tanking skill of Bear druids in 4.0.0+. I have grab couple key-points from Arel00’s Guide and Infernix17’s Guide then carry them over to this guide.

II: Bear Form

Pre 4.0.0: There was two different Bear Forms: Bear Form and Dire Bear Form. When 4.0.0 came out both forms merge as one: Bear Form. Dire Bear Form will upgrade the Bear Form at lvl 40 without having to learn the new spell.

The spell cost 5% of base mana and it is instant cast.

Here is the tool-tip for Bear Form:

Shapeshift into bear form, increasing melee attack power by 30 (120 at lvl 40+), armor contribution from cloth and leather items by 65% (120% at lvl 40+), and Stamina by 25%. Causes Agility to increase attack power. Also protects the caster from Polymorph effects and allows the use of various bear abilities.

The act of shapeshifting frees the caster of Movement Impairing effects.

Bear Form have 200% (4.0.0) threat generation.

Strength compare to other tanking class (Death Knight, Paladin, and Warrior):
Immune to Polymorph Effects
Bigger Health Pool (≈ 60% more stamina at level 75, Talent Build: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#0ZfMGbRu0zrck0c)
Good physical mitigation (High Armor and Savage Defense)
Good avoidance (High Dodge)
Good Solo threat generation

Weakness compare to other tanking class (Death Knight, Paladin, and Warrior):
Lack of critical abilities for when emergency situations occurs
Harder to control when Mind Control due to the Polymorph Immunity (Stun, Cyclone, Roots, and Blind will work)
Weak AoE threat generation

III: Bear Stats

Bear Stats are important to tanking as a Bear. These stats help you control threat, and survive hard-hitting mobs.

Threat Stats: Agility/Strength, Critical Strike, Expertise, and Hit

Agility/Strength: Due to Druid only able to wear leather armor, Agility is now grant 2 attack powers for each agility points. This bring up another problem since Tanking Cloak, Tanking Relic, Tanking Necklace, Tanking Rings, Tanking Trinkets will be filled with Strength stats. Lucky for Bears, we are able to gain 2 attack powers from Strength as well. Agility also gives Critical Strike rating.

Ghostcrawler said: http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...sid=1&pageNo=1

We talked about druids in bear form also getting AP from strength. Strength won't appear on leather and no piece should have Str and Agi together, so it's not like they would really double dip. That let us still have tanking necks, rings and cloaks with strength on them that are attractive to all 4 tanking classes.

Critical Strike: Critical Strike pays a major role in Survival as well as being a threat stat. Bear tank gain a spell called Savage Defense at lvl 40. Each time you deal a critical strike while in Bear Form, you could gain a buff called Savage Defense, which does reducing the damage taken from the next physical attack. Once you learn Mastery at lvl 80, you can also improve the reduction %.

Expertise: Expertise lowers the enemy's change to parry and dodge. The Dodge Cap, is called "Expertise soft cap", and is set at 26 Expertise. This can be achieved with 214 expertise ratings. The "Expertise hard cap" is at 56 Expertise. You need 460 rating to get there. The Hard cap is also called Parry Cap. Will upgrade the Info once Cata come out.

Hit: Hit rating help by lowering our chance to miss an enemy. There are some fight where missing a taunt or a spell could led to a wipe. The Hit cap for Bears is 8% against a raid boss in WotLK, which translates into 263 hit ratings. Cata raid boss might have a different % and will update once Cata is out.

Survival Stats: Agility, Armor, Expertise, Stamina, and Dodge

Agility: Even though Agility gives 2 attack powers, Agility also gives Survival Stats. Agility gives both dodge and armor.

Armor: Armor helps by lower the incoming physical attacks. The reduction from armor is capped at 75% of the damage.

Expertise: There is a boss’ mechanic called parry-haste. Parry-haste can greatly improve the boss damage output, endangering the life of the tank. Thus, expertise, reducing the enemy's chance to parry, qualifies not just as a threat stat, but also as a form of mitigation, effectively lowering the number of counterattacks.

Stamina: This stats boost our health, the higher the stamina the longer we last until a heal.

Dodge: Dodge is the bears only real Defensive stat, since we can't block or parry with our claws, we rely on Dodge and Stamina.

Mastery: Mastery is a new stat in patch 4.0 and Cataclysm. Mastery helps the Bear to improve our Savage Defense. Since Savage Defender give 32% damage reduction + 4% for each Mastery point we gain toward Savage Defense. It is average of 45.9±0.01 points of mastery rating to equal 1 point of mastery at level 80. You gain 8 Mastery when you learn it from your trainer at lvl 80.

50 Mastery rating = 1.09 Mastery = 4.5%

Effective Health VS Time-to-Live VS Threat Control

Thank Exochaft and Enigmaran for helping bear tanks get a clear picture of Effective Health VS Time-to-Live.

Effective Health: Effective health (EH) is calculated based off of armor/resist mitigation and health values to give you a grand total to what your HP really is without any mitigation factors (does not factor in avoidance). Basically, it's a calculation of how much damage you can take before dying w/o heals (aka, burst damage). EH does not have much value for damage over longer periods of time, because either you're getting heals or your dead from burst.

Time-to-Live: Time-to-Live (TTL) is simply a calculation of how long you can live without a heal over time (this includes avoidance). The reason more people don't gear around TTL is because it changes on a per-fight basis, since it uses factors such as avoidance, boss swing timer, boss damage, and anything you can do to extend your life that is not included in the EH calculations.

The best way to gear for raid fights is to make sure you can take the big hits while minimizing damage you do take over the course of the fight. So you would do a mix of Effective Health and Time-to-Live. You just need to keep an eye on your avoidance, even when buffering your health.

Meanwhile trying to the balance the Effective Health and Time-to-Live, you also have to balance threat control.

Threat Control: As a Bear tank, you have two taunt spells, Growl and Challenging Roar. However most of the time you want to make sure the mobs is on you. Hit and Expertise will help a lot with Threat Control.

Yes, Bear tank is a three-scale balance. Too much of anything can be bad for the party or raid. So try to balance these core abilities as much you can.

IV: Bear Talents:

You can’t tank without having any talent build.

This is a core talent for every bear tank:

In Feral Tree: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#0ZfMGbRu0zrck

With the Resto tree: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#0ZfMGbRu0zrck0c

Once you hit lvl 81, you better start building your tanking build.

Only Choice: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#zZfMGbRu0zrckMcu with one point for anything you want to go.

V: Glyphs

Due to the major changes in Cata, many bear tank found themselves learned Glyph of Solarbeam which did replace Glyph of Growl. Damn you Blizzard.

However, it is likely that Blizzard will add more Tanking Glyph post 4.0.3.

Here is the new updated list of Tanking Glyph for bears.

Prime:

• Glyph of Mangle:
• Glyph of Berserk:
• Glyph of Lacerate:

Major:

• Glyph of Maul:
• Glyph of Frenzied Regen
• Glyph of Thorns
• Glyph of Barkskin
• Glyph of Feral Charge

Minor:

• Glyph of Unburdened Rebirth:
• Glyph of Challenging Roar:
• Glyph of Wild
• Glyph of Dash

VI: Changed/Added Abilities

Thank you, Infernix17 for listing the changes and new Abilities.

Changed:

Mangle

• Mangle the target for 230% normal damage plus 172.5 and causes the target to take 30% additional damage from bleed effects for 1 min.
• Mangle is your second strongest hitting ability and needs to be kept on CD at all times.

Feral Faerie Fire

• Decrease the armor of the target by 4% for 5 min. While affected, the target cannot stealth or turn invisible. Stacks up to 3 times. Deals damage and additional threat. (Sunders) If you talent Feral Aggression, you only need to cast one Feral Faerie Fire to reach the cap.
• FFF is only useful for opening threat or if the target is far away, if you find time to throw in FFF then throw it in.

Lacerate

• Lacerates the enemy target, dealing damage and making them bleed for damage over 15 sec, and causing a high amount of threat. Damage increased by attack power.
• This effect stacks up to 3 times on the same target.
• Lacerate has been changed to only stack 3 times and the Lacerate Dot is bad now, Lacerate(non dot) does an insane amount of damage and you should be pulverizing every 10-15 seconds, so make sure you always have 3 stacks of Lacerate on the target.
• The only good thing about the Lacerate DoT is that it gives you a 30% chance to refresh the Cooldown of Mangle when Berserk.

Maul

• An attack that instantly deals physical damage. Effects which increase Bleed damage also increase Maul damage. 3 second cooldown.
• Maul has been changed to have a 3 second cooldown rather than "on next attack."
• Macro everything to maul, because it is still off the GCD. **See "XIII Macro" for more information.

Swipe

• Swipe nearby enemies, inflicting 2610 damage. Damage increased by attack power.
• Swipe now has a 6 second Cooldown, but has been compensated by a huge damage increase.
• This does hurt our AoE tanking a little, but easy to fix.

Berserk

• Your Lacerate periodic damage has a 30% chance to refresh the cooldown of your Mangle (Bear) ability and make it cost no rage. In addition, when activated this ability causes your Mangle (Bear) ability to hit up to 3 targets and have no cooldown. Lasts 15 sec. Clears the effect of Fear and makes you immune to Fear for the duration.
• Pretty Straight forward, exactly like warriors "Sword and Board."
• Still amazing for opening threat.

Frenzied Regeneration

• Increases maximum health by 30%, increases health to 30% (if below that value). 3 minute Cooldown.
• Added Survival Instincts to the ability. (I didn't add the rest because the glyph negates it.

Survival Instincts

• Reduces all damage taken by 60% for 12 sec. Only useable while in Bear Form or Cat Form.
• Exactly like warriors "Shield Wall" ability.

New Ability:

Pulverize

• Deals 120% weapon damage plus additional 943.2 damage for each of your Lacerate applications on the target, and increases your melee critical strike chance by 3% for each Lacerate application consumed for 10 sec.
• Very strong attack and is used every 10-15 seconds.
• Make sure to have 3 stacks of Lacerate up before using it.
• Must be kept up as the 9% crit is huge for our threat and Mastery.

Skull Bash

• You charge and skull bash the target, interrupting spellcasting and preventing any spell in that school from being cast for 5 sec.
• Extremely useful for picking up casters.

VII: Mastery

Thank you, Infernix17 for testing this new build.

Bear’s Mastery is significantly OP. The guide is going to use the numbers that Infernix17 got during his raid in ICC.

Savage Defense is considered to be a "bubble" as it reduces the damage on the next hit. As we are all aware, the ICC 30% buff increases absorbing effects.

So when Infernix17 finally figured out that:
1) Vengeance does work with the ICC buff.
2) Savage defense does work with the ICC buff.
3) Vengeance does work with Savage Defense.

Thanks to that answered, here are the new results:
Please remember, using Infernix17’s stats:

Vengeance added:
Infernix17 have 94,000 HP fully raid buffed including feast and flasks.
When Vengeance reaches max he would have 9,400 extra AP, Infernix17 add his original AP of 7,200 and would have a total of 16,600 AP.
Savage Defender + Mastery= 110.5% of his AP turned into a bubble and Infernix17 would get a shield of 18,343.
When he apply 18,343 to the 30% ICC buff, would have a shield of 23,846.

Inside of ICC, with a crit chance of 65% (with Pulverize), Infernix17 have a 32.5% chance to get a free bubble that will absorb around 24,000 damage.

As you can see, Bears have an amazingly OP Mastery, although with 1 downfall.

Like always, Savage Defense only takes 1 hit, so whether it is a 500 dot tick, 1,000 aura tick or 40k hit, Savage Defense will fade after. It is a little bit RNG based as it can be wasted with a 400 dot tick or sometimes save your life when it absorbs a 20,000 Soul reaper hit.

Please remember all stats used were directly based off of Infernix17 and it gives you the general idea of how our mastery works.

VIII: Gears

TBA

IX: Enchantments/Gems

The only way to improve your gears is by adding enchantments and gems to your gears. These are lists of best Enchantments and Gems for Bear Tank in WotLK. Will update soon.

Enchantments:

The ordering goes by Best to Worse, then Professions only.

Head:

• Arcanum of the Stalwart Protector (+37 Stamina and +20 Dodge rating)
• Mind Amplification Dish (+45 Stamina and mind control function, Engineers only)

Note: This may be a bug since Mind Amplification Dish was listed to have the mind control function without the Stamina for 4.0.1. It will stack with Arcanum of the Stalwart Protector giving you 82 Stamina and 20 Dodge rating with mind control function. I will crossout Mind Amplification Dish once the bug is fix.

Shoulder:

• Greater Inscription of the Pinnacle (+22 Stamina and +20 Dodge Rating)
• Greater Inscription of the Gladiator (+30 Stamina and +15 Resilience)
• Master Inscription of the Axe (+120 attack power and +15 critical strike rating, Inscribers only)
• Master Inscription of the Pinnacle (+60 Dodge rating and +15 parry rating, Inscribers only)

Note: I do not know why Blizzard did not upgrade the Master Inscription of the Pinnacle and Lesser Inscription of the Pinnacle match the Greater Inscription of the Pinnacle. Again will update once the confusion is fix.

Cloak:

• Enchant Cloak - Major Agility (+ 22 Agility)
• Enchant Cloak - Mighty Armor (+225 Armor)
• Enchant Cloak – Titanweave (+16 Dodge rating)
• Enchant Cloak - Greater Speed (+23 haste)
• Flexweave Underlay (+23 Agility and a parachute, Engineers only)

Chest:

• Enchant Chest - Powerful Stats (+10 Stats)
• Heavy Borean Leather Kit (+18 Stamina)
• Enchant Chest - Super Health (+275 Health)
• Enchant Chest - Greater Defense (+22 Dodge rating)

Bracer:

• Enchant Bracers - Major Stamina (+40 Stamina)
• Enchant Bracers - Greater Stats (+6 stats)
• Fur Lining - Stamina (+102 Stamina, Leatherworkers only)
• Socket Bracer (Socket, Blacksmith only)

Gloves:

• Enchant Gloves - Major Agility (+20 Agility)
• Heavy Borean Leather Kit (+18 Stamina)
• Reticulated Armor Webbing (+250 Armor, Engineers only)
• Socket Gloves (Socket, Blacksmith only)

Legs:

• Frosthide Leg Armor (+55 Stamina and +22 Agility)
• Jormungar Leg Reinforcements (+55 Stamina and +22 Agility, Leatherworkers only)

Boots:

• Enchant Boots - Tuskarr's Vitality (+15 Agility and Minor Movement Speed)
• Enchant Boots - Superior Agility (+16 Agility)
• Enchant Boots - Greater Fortitude (+22 Stamina)
• Nitro Boosts (Major Movement Speed, Engineers only)

Belt:

• Eternal Belt Buckle (Socket)

Rings:

• Enchant Ring - Stamina (+30 Stamina, Enchanters only)

Weapon:

• Enchant Weapon - Mongoose (+120 Agility and little haste)
• Enchant Weapon - Blood Draining (Free ~2k heal at 35% or less HP)

Gems:

It is your choice how you want to gem however these are tanking gems.

Red:

• Delicate Cardinal Ruby (+20 Agility)
• Precise Cardinal Ruby (+20 Expertise Rating)
• Delicate Dragon's Eye (+34 Agility, Jeweler only)
• Precise Dragon's Eye (+34 Expertise Rating, Jeweler only)

Blue:

• Rigid Majestic Zircon (+20 Hit Rating)
• Solid Majestic Zircon (+30 Stamina)
• Rigid Dragon's Eye (+34 Hit Rating, Jeweler only)
• Solid Dragon's Eye (+51 Stamina, Jeweler only)

Yellow:

• Subtle King's Amber (+20 Dodge Rating)
• Subtle Dragon's Eye (+34 Dodge Rating, Jeweler only)

Purple:

• Accurate Dreadstone (+10 Expertise Rating/+10 Hit Rating)
• Glinting Dreadstone (+10 Hit Rating/+10 Agility)
• Guardian's Dreadstone (+10 Expertise Rating/+15 Stamina)
• Shifting Dreadstone (+10 Agility/+15 Stamina)

Orange:

• Resolute Ametrine (+10 Expertise Rating/+10 Dodge Rating)

Green:

• Regal Eye of Zul (+15 Stamina/+10 Dodge Rating)
• Nimble Eye of Zul(+10 Hit Rating/+10 Dodge Rating)

Prismatic:

• Nightmare Tear (+10 Stats)

Meta:

• Austere Earthsiege Diamond (+32 Stamina and 2% Increased Armor Value from Items, Requires at least 2 Blue gems, and 1 Red gems)

The most common gemming for Bear Tank is Solid gems, and Shifting gems. Pre 4.0.0, Bear sometime gem hit rating in their yellow sockets due to low hit rating in T10.

Due to the Meta requirement, many Bear tank use one Shifting gems or one Nightmare Tear and gem the rest Solid gems. This is wrong, it is called “Blind Stamina Stacking”, and you may have too much health and not enough avoidance, see Effective Health VS Time-to-Live VS Threat Control.

A good ideal mixture for the gems is:

Blue Socket:

• Solid Majestic Zircon if threat is under control
• Rigid Majestic Zircon if Hit is worse, ≈ 3% or less, should be between 4% to 8%.

Red Socket:

• Nightmare Tear (if the socket bonus is good enough)
• Guardian's Dreadstone (if the socket bonus is good enough, you need more expertise and health, and the Nightmare Tear been use)
• Accurate Dreadstone (if the socket bonus is good enough, you need more expertise and hit, and the Nightmare Tear been use)
• Shifting Dreadstone (if the socket bonus is good enough, you need more health, and the Nightmare Tear been use)
• Glinting Dreadstone (if the socket bonus is good enough, you need more hit, and the Nightmare Tear been use)
• Solid Majestic Zircon (If the socket bonus is not good enough)

Yellow Socket:

• Nightmare Tear (if the socket bonus is good enough)
• Regal Eye of Zul if the socket bonus is good enough, you need more health, and the Nightmare Tear been use)
• Nimble Eye of Zul (if the socket bonus is good enough, you need more hit, and the Nightmare Tear been use)
• Solid Majestic Zircon (If the socket bonus is not good enough)

Prismatic Socket:

• Solid Majestic Zircon

Profession Combo:

Many Bear tanks choose Jeweler/Leatherworker, Jeweler/Blacksmith, or Jeweler/Enchanter due to the high Stamina: 255 Stamina (Jeweler/Leatherworker), and 213 Stamina (Jeweler/Blacksmith and Jeweler/Enchanter).

X: Reforge Need to test.

Reforge ALL the haste you can into Mastery.

Haste is basically pointless for Bears. The only thing that we benefit from haste is Fury Swipes and that has an internal CD anyways. Haste also affects our attack speed, which increases how many attacks we can get in that also increases more chances of getting a critical strike which then affects our Mastery.

After haste you want to reforge crit into Mastery.

Haste ---> Mastery
Crit ----> Mastery
Anything else ----> Mastery
Stop mastery when you are at 551 Mastery rating = 20 Mastery = 80%

XI: Macros

Maul is still off the GCD, it just no longer happens on next attack.
The reason most won't work is because you will have ranks posted in the code. Those have gone bye-bye now and you can redo the macros using the abilities directly out of the spellbook.

Lacerate
#showtooltip
/cast Lacerate
/cast !Maul

Mangle
#showtooltip
/cast Mangle(Bear Form)
/cast !Maul

Pulverize
#Showtooltip
/cast Pulverize
/cast !Maul

Swipe
#Showtooltip
/cast Swipe(Bear Form)
/cast !Maul

XII: Rotation/AoE Tanking Need to test.

Rotation:

Enrage* > Berserk** > FFF > Mangle > Laceratex3 > Swipe > Mangle > Pulverize***

*If you have 4 piece tier 10 you could be specced into KoTJ, pop enrage first for opener threat.
**If you are having threat issues pop berserk after Enrage and mangle like crazy for some strong threat.
***After pulverize, you want to immediately get your Lacerate stacks back up, so after your first Pulverize it would look like this:

Pulverize > Laceratex3 > Mangle > Swipe > Pulverize

You want 2-3 ticks from your lacerate before you Pulverize and be using swipe in between Mangle CD and Lacerate Tick.

The Full Rotation would look like:

FFF > Mangle > Laceratex3 > Swipe > Mangle > Pulverize > Laceratex3 > Mangle > Swipe > Pulverize > Laceratex3 > Mangle > Swipe > Pulverize

*When you get a free mangle from the Berserk Proc throw it in first and then move on.
*Keep up Demoralizing Roar, use every 30 seconds between Mangle and Swipe. (Extra time on Lacerate won't hurt at all.)
*Only use FFF at the start and if you are waiting for a Lacerate tick and everything else is on CD.
*Use Enrage as needed.
*Use Berserk as needed.

AOE:

Yes, we now have some pretty bad AoE tanking, although there are many ways around it. Here is a really good rotation you should use.

Thorns > Swipe > Mangle > Laceratex1 **>** Swipe > Mangle > Laceratzex1 **>** Swipe > Mangle > Laceratex1

**Tab Target** You are really going to have to Tab Target, Thorns is going to help keep some good initial aggro, although in time you will have to apply some more.

Swipe's damage is really OP now and if you do it correctly, you won't have any AoE problems.

In Cataclysm, we will have Thrash and it is not shared with Swipe so we will have 2 AoE abilities to spam, YAY! Just hang in there until Cataclysm.

XIII: Addons

TBA

XIV: FAQ

TBA

[Fizzleshot]

Any particular reason you felt like copy pasting a whole pile of information directly from a thread that is already stickied? A lot of this stuff is word for word and even the same formatting as Infernix17's sticky.

[Auroro]

Any particular reason you felt like copy pasting a whole pile of information directly from a thread that is already stickied? A lot of this stuff is word for word and even the same formatting as Infernix17's sticky.

Infernix17's guide is a mess, it is missing so many info. I told him that i had this ready to go before his guide and was willing to work together.

The gears choices need to be tested since he is a fan of EH and not mix of EH/ToL.

The only thing i saw his reason to change the tanking rep ring to DPS rep ring is that it has more Stamina/Agility/AP. Well, in cata both type of gear will give same amount of stamina, DPS would give threat control but what about avoidance.

[Infernix17]

Any particular reason you felt like copy pasting a whole pile of information directly from a thread that is already stickied? A lot of this stuff is word for word and even the same formatting as Infernix17's sticky.

He PM'd me saying he was making a new guide and asked if he could take most of my information.

I replied with "If you have anything you would like to add, you can PM it to me and I will put it in as long as its necessary."

Whether I am a fan of EH or ToL is irrelevant now, because I created a guide. It's not opinionated nor telling you to do something one way or another. It is telling you what to exactly do to be the most effective during relative content.

I might be opinionated if you post and ask why, but thats why its called an opinion.

I didn't want you to just steal my guide and add what you thought was correct and make it look prettier, but I guess you already did. =/

[Tiolith]

Hit: The Hit cap for Bears is 8% against a raid boss in WotLK, which translates into 263 hit ratings.

8% hit now translates into 246 rating.

Agility: Agility gives both dodge and armor.

Agility no longer provides armor.

Updated list of Tanking Glyph for bears:
Major: * Glyph of Barkskin

Glyph of Barkskin reduces chance to be crit by melee attack by 25%.
How is that considered a bear tanking glyph?

[Cheezee]

My thoughts on both guides...

III: Bear Stats

Bear Stats are important to tanking as a Bear. These stats help you control threat, and survive hard-hitting mobs.

Threat Stats: Agility/Strength, Critical Strike, Expertise, and Hit

Agility/Strength: Due to Druid only able to wear leather armor, Agility is now grant 2 attack powers for each agility points. This bring up another problem since Tanking Cloak, Tanking Relic, Tanking Necklace, Tanking Rings, Tanking Trinkets will be filled with Strength stats. Lucky for Bears, we are able to gain 2 attack powers from Strength as well. Agility also gives Critical Strike rating.

Ghostcrawler said: http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...sid=1&pageNo=1

We talked about druids in bear form also getting AP from strength. Strength won't appear on leather and no piece should have Str and Agi together, so it's not like they would really double dip. That let us still have tanking necks, rings and cloaks with strength on them that are attractive to all 4 tanking classes.

Agility is now far superior to strength for a druid whether cat or bear. We get the same AP, as well as crit and dodge from agility. Now that agility pieces have the same stamina amounts as their tanking counter parts there is no reason to use strength tanking items unless the strength piece has a much higher item level than the agility piece.

Survival Stats: Agility, Armor, Expertise, Stamina, and Dodge

Agility: Even though Agility gives 2 attack powers, Agility also gives Survival Stats. Agility gives both dodge and armor.

Agility no longer gives armor.

Stamina: This stats boost our health, the higher the stamina the longer we last until a heal.

Stamina also provides higher levels of vengeance which affects threat & savage defense.

Dodge: Dodge is the bears only real Defensive stat, since we can't block or parry with our claws, we rely on Dodge and Stamina.

Should be noted that we should now obtain our dodge solely from agility and not actual dodge rating.

Mastery: Mastery is a new stat in patch 4.0 and Cataclysm. Mastery helps the Bear to improve our Savage Defense. Since Savage Defender give 32% damage reduction + 4% for each Mastery point we gain toward Savage Defense. It is average of 45.9±0.01 points of mastery rating to equal 1 point of mastery at level 80. You gain 8 Mastery when you learn it from your trainer at lvl 80.

The way this paragraph is worded is misleading. Mastery increases the amount of damage absorbed by Savage Defense; it is not a flat percentage damage reduction per point as seems to be implied.

IV: Bear Talents:

You can’t tank without having any talent build.

This is a core talent for every bear tank:

In Feral Tree: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#0ZfMGbRu0zrck

With the Resto tree: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#0ZfMGbRu0zrck0c

Once you hit lvl 81, you better start building your tanking build.

Only Choice: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#zZfMGbRu0zrckMcu with one point for anything you want to go.

Taking Stampede over Brutal Impact is a mistake; no serious tanking build will do so. Having a reliable interrupt every 10 seconds over 30% haste for a few seconds after a charge is a no-brainer.

XII: Rotation/AoE Tanking Need to test.

Rotation:

Enrage* > Berserk** > FFF > Mangle > Laceratex3 > Swipe > Mangle > Pulverize***

*If you have 4 piece tier 10 you could be specced into KoTJ, pop enrage first for opener threat.

Honestly, I've dropped 4T10 for most fights in ICC. I still use it for Sindragosa & LK but that's about it. Right now the damage reduction CD is not worth the extra stats I can get while using off set shoulders, gloves & chest which further devalues KoTJ for a bear.

[Millhi]

My thoughts on both guides...



Agility is now far superior to strength for a druid whether cat or bear. We get the same AP, as well as crit and dodge from agility. Now that agility pieces have the same stamina amounts as their tanking counter parts there is no reason to use strength tanking items unless the strength piece has a much higher item level than the agility piece.



Agility no longer gives armor.



Stamina also provides higher levels of vengeance which affects threat & savage defense.



Should be noted that we should now obtain our dodge solely from agility and not actual dodge rating.



The way this paragraph is worded is misleading. Mastery increases the amount of damage absorbed by Savage Defense; it is not a flat percentage damage reduction per point as seems to be implied.



Taking Stampede over Brutal Impact is a mistake; no serious tanking build will do so. Having a reliable interrupt every 10 seconds over 30% haste for a few seconds after a charge is a no-brainer.



Honestly, I've dropped 4T10 for most fights in ICC. I still use it for Sindragosa & LK but that's about it. Right now the damage reduction CD is not worth the extra stats I can get while using off set shoulders, gloves & chest which further devalues KoTJ for a bear.

you'll have noticed that there's 5points left at the lvl 80 build so people could still stick 2points in brutal impact like i did with running http://www.wowhead.com/talent#0ZfMGbRubzrck0c
about the lvl 85specc you are completely right, though i would run with http://www.wowhead.com/talent#zZfMGbRubzrckMcz with one point left to use.

[Richmond]

Nice guide, things i did pick up on that i found abit strange was the specs, each one missed out Brutal Impact, at 80 i've currently gone with this spec, i picked up brutal impact because a 10 second CD interrupt is imense i couldn't imagine tanking without it anymore. Plus i picked up both points in Stampede because there isn't anywhere else to spend it really? KoTJ is still crap for bears and everything else is basically Cat talents.

At 85 (unless anything changes) i'm going to go with this spec as again, where else do you spend them? Natural Shapeshifter is rubbish i know, but Perseverance is a very nice damage reduction talent to pick up.

[Infernix17]

My thoughts on both guides...



Agility is now far superior to strength for a druid whether cat or bear. We get the same AP, as well as crit and dodge from agility. Now that agility pieces have the same stamina amounts as their tanking counter parts there is no reason to use strength tanking items unless the strength piece has a much higher item level than the agility piece.



Agility no longer gives armor.



Stamina also provides higher levels of vengeance which affects threat & savage defense.



Should be noted that we should now obtain our dodge solely from agility and not actual dodge rating.



The way this paragraph is worded is misleading. Mastery increases the amount of damage absorbed by Savage Defense; it is not a flat percentage damage reduction per point as seems to be implied.



Taking Stampede over Brutal Impact is a mistake; no serious tanking build will do so. Having a reliable interrupt every 10 seconds over 30% haste for a few seconds after a charge is a no-brainer.



Honestly, I've dropped 4T10 for most fights in ICC. I still use it for Sindragosa & LK but that's about it. Right now the damage reduction CD is not worth the extra stats I can get while using off set shoulders, gloves & chest which further devalues KoTJ for a bear.

I don't know why you are saying both guides. He took mine and added onto it.

Everything you commented on is not in mine except for the rotation.

As far as tier 10 + KoTJ goes:
12% damage reduction + 15% damage + stats from tier 10 > any other item combination.

#1 You shouldn't be using tier chest.

#2 The only thing close to tier 10 shoulders is Cultist's Bloodsoaked Spaulders and even then the tier shoulders have the SAME exact crit and more haste.

#3 The only thing close to tier 10 gloves is Aldriana's Gloves of Secrecy and that gives: +18 agility and +50 Stamina = ~750HP more than Tier 10 gloves.

Do you really think +18 agility and 750HP > 12% damage reduction + 15% damage for 10 seconds?

---------- Post added 2010-10-17 at 09:43 AM ----------

Vengeance(at maximum) will give 75 more Attack Power than normal.(From the 750 HP)

You will have 32 more AP, a very very small fraction of crit and dodge. (From the +18 Agility)

Your savage defense will absorb for 200-450 more damage (dependant on your Mastery)

---------- Post added 2010-10-17 at 09:57 AM ----------

Also, where are you putting the extra 2 points?

Stampede?
Natural Shapeshifter?

Those are the only 2 points that would even be considered and both are terrible. Stampede is worthless as a tank and NSS is useless until level 81 when we can move on in the tree.

[Alski]

Removing sticky for the time being.

[Embermoon]

Wait, does dodge rating really not give dodge? WTH?

Why would we still have "dodge" gems, if that's the case?

[Alski]

Wait, does dodge rating really not give dodge? WTH?

Why would we still have "dodge" gems, if that's the case?

Of course it still gives dodge >.< its just agi is far superior.

[Tiolith]

current issue with the 4set bonus

Enrage lost its armor reduction and the debuff was turned into damage taken
4set still reads "prevents you from losing armor and you gain 12% damage reduction"
they completely overlooked this *shakes head*

[dlg]

Taking Stampede over Brutal Impact is a mistake; no serious tanking build will do so. Having a reliable interrupt every 10 seconds over 30% haste for a few seconds after a charge is a no-brainer.

I miss read the tool tip disregard.

[uzumati]

You mean a reliable interrupt that you can't even use while main tanking? ( Skull bash has a minimum range. )

No Skull Bash has a maximum range (13 Yards) no minimum. Came in very handy on LDW as our rogue took the night off.

[Richmond]

You mean a reliable interrupt that you can't even use while main tanking? ( Skull bash has a minimum range. )

What? As a main tank you'd make use of this all the time, all i can think is Jarax and his casting ability, perfect example. (Yes it has a minimum range, but your stood right next to the boss). Was you smoking something when you posted this reply?

[Auroro]

My thoughts on both guides...
Agility is now far superior to strength for a druid whether cat or bear. We get the same AP, as well as crit and dodge from agility. Now that agility pieces have the same stamina amounts as their tanking counter parts there is no reason to use strength tanking items unless the strength piece has a much higher item level than the agility piece.

Strength tanking items give avoidance, armor and dodge.

Agility pieces only give threat and little avoidance, dodge.

Agility no longer gives armor.

Ok, that is good to know. Since Agility no longer gives armor, why would you not take tanking item for avoidance.

Stamina also provides higher levels of vengeance which affects threat & savage defense.

Agains Blizzard does not want us to be mana drain tank. Having too much stamina and not enough avoidance can hurt us.

Should be noted that we should now obtain our dodge solely from agility and not actual dodge rating.

We still gain dodge from dodge rating. Making the tanking items still useful. I have a feeling that Bear tank are going to fighting out the use of Tanking Items VS Agility Items, making Threat VS Avoidance. The Epic Tanking Relic give Mastery, Dodge, Stamina, and Str.

For example: Both Relic give same amount of Agi/Str (107), Stamina (161), same item ivi (359), and one socket.

Relic of Golganneth: Critical Strike rating by 72 and Haste Rating by 72 (44 when reforge to 28 Mastery Rating)

Relic of Khaz'goroth: Dodge Rating by 72 (44 when reforge to 28 Hit/Crit/Exp Rating) and Mastery Rating by 72

Which one would you choose?

I get more Mastery Rating from a Tanking Relic compare to a Agility Relic.

Taking Stampede over Brutal Impact is a mistake; no serious tanking build will do so. Having a reliable interrupt every 10 seconds over 30% haste for a few seconds after a charge is a no-brainer.

Taking Stampede give 30% haste

Brutal Impact give Bash a cooldown of 50 second, Skull Bash would have 10 sec cooldown, it stop that school being use for 5 sec, and force the mana cost of that school to increase by 30%. I smelling a nerf coming soon since Skull Bash is too good be true.

Well, you could do http://www.wowhead.com/talent#zZfMGboubzrckMcu or http://www.wowhead.com/talent#zZfMGbRu0zrckMcu

one point in Taking Stampede or Brutal Impact or KoTJ, it is your choice. Haste just give you more threat at the beginning of the fight. We still have DPS not waiting for us to get the threat under control.

Honestly, I've dropped 4T10 for most fights in ICC. I still use it for Sindragosa & LK but that's about it. Right now the damage reduction CD is not worth the extra stats I can get while using off set shoulders, gloves & chest which further devalues KoTJ for a bear.

I never drop 4T10 for any of those fight. At the same time, I never talent KoTJ.

[Deleted]

Good post man, thanks for this.

[Infernix17]

Strength tanking items give avoidance, armor and dodge.

Agility pieces only give threat and little avoidance, dodge.



Ok, that is good to know. Since Agility no longer gives armor, why would you not take tanking item for avoidance.



Agains Blizzard does not want us to be mana drain tank. Having too much stamina and not enough avoidance can hurt us.



We still gain dodge from dodge rating. Making the tanking items still useful. I have a feeling that Bear tank are going to fighting out the use of Tanking Items VS Agility Items, making Threat VS Avoidance. The Epic Tanking Relic give Mastery, Dodge, Stamina, and Str.

For example: Both Relic give same amount of Agi/Str (107), Stamina (161), same item ivi (359), and one socket.

Relic of Golganneth: Critical Strike rating by 72 and Haste Rating by 72 (44 when reforge to 28 Mastery Rating)

Relic of Khaz'goroth: Dodge Rating by 72 (44 when reforge to 28 Hit/Crit/Exp Rating) and Mastery Rating by 72

Which one would you choose?

I get more Mastery Rating from a Tanking Relic compare to a Agility Relic.



Taking Stampede give 30% haste

Brutal Impact give Bash a cooldown of 50 second, Skull Bash would have 10 sec cooldown, it stop that school being use for 5 sec, and force the mana cost of that school to increase by 30%. I smelling a nerf coming soon since Skull Bash is too good be true.

Well, you could do http://www.wowhead.com/talent#zZfMGboubzrckMcu or http://www.wowhead.com/talent#zZfMGbRu0zrckMcu

one point in Taking Stampede or Brutal Impact or KoTJ, it is your choice. Haste just give you more threat at the beginning of the fight. We still have DPS not waiting for us to get the threat under control.



I never drop 4T10 for any of those fight. At the same time, I never talent KoTJ.

First off, strength only gives Attack Power. No dodge.

Second, Blizzard wants us to have equal avoidance and health, they don't want us to just stack stam, IN CATACLYSM AT LEVEL 85
We are talking about whats best for right now, for patch 4.0.1 what is best.
Blizzard even stated that they want us to use tanking pieces (relic, neck, cloak, rings, trinkets) in Cataclysm. So stop comparing level 80 to level 85.

Third, Stampede is a useless talent for bears. http://www.wowhead.com/talent#zZfMGboubzrckMcu is the correct talent tree at level 85. (If theres going to be a fight in Cataclysm where we will be charging everytime its on CD, then it will be worth it, but I don't think there will be.)

Fourth, KoTJ will give more threat than 30% haste.

[coocoo]

Strength tanking items give avoidance, armor and dodge.
Agility pieces only give threat and little avoidance, dodge.

Strength
1 Str = 2.1624 AP

Dodge Rating
1 Dodge Rating = 0.0220982% Dodge

Agility
1 Agi = 2.1624 AP
1 Agi = 0.0129744% Crit
1 Agi = 0.0225641% Dodge

I fail to see how you can claim Agility gives "little avoidance" when it clearly gives more dodge than dodge rating, gives crit to power our Savage Defense, and gives AP to boost the SD itself.
At the same time those items give same amount of stamina.
I'll take that over the Strength tanking items, and in fact already replaced them all, gaining a noticeable amount of crit, reforged haste where possible & gained juicy mastery rating = win.