Syria

[Liara]

Yes they have every right as a sovereign state to deny entry to anyone they want. Yet i wonder if an olive branch was extended to those most in need if it would not help soften even some of the hardest hearts in the arab world towards Israel. Every country is judged by its policies and oh i dont know maybe changing some of thier policies may help improve relations with neighbors. If peace was and is their true intent in the region. Or maybe it is that deeply imbedded belief of their psych that the believe they are better than everyone else being God's Chosen People.

I wonder, why do you resort to the bashing in every post? Why can't you simply take that part out?

And still, you're completely ignoring the fact that there are many, many (many) other countries, much more suited to host the Syrians than Israel, including but not limited to, Jordan, Turkey, Iraq etc.

[Fuzzzie]

Merged it to this thread here.

Not a big fan of how the OP set up this line of discussion but we'll be keeping an eye on it I guess.

[xylophone]

Merged it to this thread here.

Not a big fan of how the OP set up this line of discussion but we'll be keeping an eye on it I guess.

Judging by the replies so far it looks like people were able to cut through his bullshit pretty easily.

[SirTolomay]

Edit: And another thing. It really does show how biased you are, when it's Israel refusal that pisses you off. But not any of the other Muslim states that border Syria.(Quoated from Liara)


You miss the greater point of my "rant"....they above all else should be most understanding of the travesty and crime against humanity that is taking place. Therein lies their fault. They insist on everyone else recognizing the suffering they have gone through and persecute anyone who says the slightest thing in opposition to their policies and yet have not the human decency to give aid where its most needed.

Oh and just because no particular country owned a land does not make it right to take it from the indigeneous peoples that have lived there for centuries...no matter who ratifies it.

[xylophone]

Edit: And another thing. It really does show how biased you are, when it's Israel refusal that pisses you off. But not any of the other Muslim states that border Syria.
You miss the greater point of my "rant"....they above all else should be most understanding of the travesty and crime against humanity that is taking place. Therein lies their fault. They insist on everyone else recognizing the suffering they have gone through and persecute anyone who says the slightest thing in opposition to their policies and yet have not the human decency to give aid where its most needed.

Oh and just because no particular country owned a land does not make it right to take it from the indigeneous peoples that have lived there for centuries...no matter who ratifies it.

Then get mad at the British.

[Liara]

You miss the greater point of my "rant"....they above all else should be most understanding of the travesty and crime against humanity that is taking place. Therein lies their fault. They insist on everyone else recognizing the suffering they have gone through and persecute anyone who says the slightest thing in opposition to their policies and yet have not the human decency to give aid where its most needed.

Oh and just because no particular country owned a land does not make it right to take it from the indigeneous peoples that have lived there for centuries...no matter who ratifies it.

Well, firstly, there is a huge difference between The Holocaust and the Syrian situation (namely that back then, it was genocide, and now it's a civil war).

Secondly, Israel doesn't "insist" everyone recognize The Holocaust, but view anyone who denies it with a certain perspective (honestly, it's like denying gravity with the amount of available evidence). Nor do they persecute anyone who disagrees with them. But I guess it's easier to generalize.

Thirdly, you say the Palestinians were there first. The Bible says differently. Does it matter? Hardly. The Palestinians forfeited their country (back then, regarding the present it's a different discussion entirely, and one which I will not get into) when they decided to attack the newly founded Israel and try and take the entire area, instead of accepting the UN's partition plan.

Lastly, my claim still stands. Syrians (who are Muslim) would fit in much better in an ally's country (for example, any member of the Arab League), which also happens to be Muslim, than in Israel (an enemy state, which is mostly Jewish with a mix of other religions).

[smelltheglove]

this thread had so much better going for it before this bullshit got merged into it :/ oh, well it was almost in the necro pile any way i guess.

OT: isreal letting syrian refugees in - might sound all nice and all, but probably not the best plan. also, as has been brought up, what about all the muslim countries around them? there have already been defections to turkey

[vindicatorx]

Seeing Syria harbored Palestinian Militants in 2004 and refused to cooperate I guess they should have probably seen this coming.

[SirTolomay]

Liara you keep trying to make it about who is muslim and not...that is irrelevent. What is relevant is what we consider our humanity that separates us from beast. And i stand on my point that of all the nations in the region no other should be more sypathetic. And lets be real it is not a civil war. A civil war would imply that a portion of the people are able to fight and defend themselves against their government. Until most recently that was not even a possibility. It was as close to another genocide as one can get as the ones being crushed by their government were not of the same historical clan and family ties as Al-Assad. You have yet to address the point of their lack of human decency. Rather you are trying obfuscate the issue with questions of muslim and non-muslim ...enemy and non-enemy. What is in question is humanism.

[xylophone]

Liara you keep trying to make it about who is muslim and not...that is irrelevent. What is relevant is what we consider our humanity that separates us from beast. And i stand on my point that of all the nations in the region no other should be more sypathetic. And lets be real it is not a civil war. A civil war would imply that a portion of the people are able to fight and defend themselves against their government. Until most recently that was not even a possibility. It was as close to another genocide as one can get as the ones being crushed by their government were not of the same historical clan and family ties as Al-Assad. You have yet to address the point of their lack of human decency. Rather you are trying obfuscate the issue with questions of muslim and non-muslim ...enemy and non-enemy. What is in question is humanism.

Those words, I don't think they mean what you think they mean...

[Liara]

Liara you keep trying to make it about who is muslim and not...that is irrelevent. What is relevant is what we consider our humanity that separates us from beast. And i stand on my point that of all the nations in the region no other should be more sypathetic. And lets be real it is not a civil war. A civil war would imply that a portion of the people are able to fight and defend themselves against their government. Until most recently that was not even a possibility. It was as close to another genocide as one can get as the ones being crushed by their government were not of the same historical clan and family ties as Al-Assad. You have yet to address the point of their lack of human decency. Rather you are trying obfuscate the issue with questions of muslim and non-muslim ...enemy and non-enemy. What is in question is humanism.

And you're trying to completely ignore reality... (for example, by saying that the relationship between the countries has no bearing).
And seeing as they have plenty of allies (let's use that instead of Muslim, since it bothers you so much), there are lots and lots of other countries who should want to help them.

And why on earth should Israel be sympathetic towards a country that has attacked it on multiple occasions, and helps out one of the biggest threats to Israel's security (Hezbollah)?

You claim the question is humanity. Well, being human means not overlooking reality.

[Deleted]

Americans sure do loves them some Israel, gotta defend that nation at allllll costs.

[Liara]

Americans sure do loves them some Israel, gotta defend that nation at allllll costs.

Interesting, that doesn't seem to be the case. I know plenty of Americans who don't side with Israel.
Oh, and if you're referring to me, I'm not American.

But I do have one question - using logic, can you really take any other side than Israel's on this particular subject?

[shise]

I don't like dictators, but how could we feel empathy for the syrian people after 9/11?

You made no sense there.
People should make some research about 9/11 really, they'd trust tv even if it asked them to jump off a plane.

What's going on in Syria is mostly a make up lie, they want to show you something to justify what the NATO has been doing around there for years of killing people, just to spread their territory and take all it's resources, mostly oil.


But i'm already sick of people who'd rather live in a fantasy world and trust TV and the "official" crap. Go ahead, but just so you know, not everything is pink and i'm not talking from one side, i'm talking from neutrality.

[Deleted]

Interesting, that doesn't seem to be the case. I know plenty of Americans who don't side with Israel.
Oh, and if you're referring to me, I'm not American.

But I do have one question - using logic, can you really take any other side than Israel's on this particular subject?

I generally don't take the sides of Nation States, I generally sympathise with the poor sods getting killed and are powerless, just makes it easier to sleep at night.

[Tierbook]

Edit: And another thing. It really does show how biased you are, when it's Israel refusal that pisses you off. But not any of the other Muslim states that border Syria.(Quoated from Liara)


You miss the greater point of my "rant"....they above all else should be most understanding of the travesty and crime against humanity that is taking place. Therein lies their fault. They insist on everyone else recognizing the suffering they have gone through and persecute anyone who says the slightest thing in opposition to their policies and yet have not the human decency to give aid where its most needed.

Oh and just because no particular country owned a land does not make it right to take it from the indigeneous peoples that have lived there for centuries...no matter who ratifies it.

meh countries do that all the time... taking land from indigeneous people that is its the right of the strong

[Liara]

What's going on in Syria is mostly a make up lie, they want to show you something to justify what the NATO has been doing around there for years of killing people, just to spread their territory and take all it's resources, mostly oil.

Not exactly sure what you mean. Could you elaborate?

I generally don't take the sides of Nation States, I generally sympathise with the poor sods getting killed and are powerless, just makes it easier to sleep at night.

I don't see how the two are mutually exclusive, but that's your choice I guess.

[Deleted]

meh countries do that all the time... taking land from indigeneous people that is its the right of the strong

The right of the powerful to do what they want, how civil.

I don't see how the two are mutually exclusive, but that's your choice I guess.

Nation states are generally run by a class of self interested thugs who happen to control territory that people live in, myself included. Maybe I've been reading too much Bakunin.

[SirTolomay]

In the course of human history there always comes a time when people are given the chance to affect the "reality". Now could have been such a time whereby some simple action one peoples could set aside their own instinct for self preservation and do something so bold as to shake the very foundation of the "reality". And with those actions rise themselves above all others with clear proof as to intention and merit. This is something that has been done over and over in history on the small scale and on the grand. But maybe i expect to much of humanity and we are doomed to eventually annihilate ourselves in some global conflict just because when the chance arrived for someone to step up and be a better human they chose to continue wallowing in the basest ideologies of what we now are today.

So yeah my original post was filled with hate and anger...not particularly at the Israelis for being Israelis but rather for having in their possession an opportunity to quite possibly change the course of global relations and do something simply human as help thy neighbor yet they choose to step over him instead. Done!

[habitsbreaker]

The right of the powerful to do what they want, how civil.

they always forget that one day they will lose their power