Solo Challenge! I know you want it too.

[Veranya]

I'll start off by saying I've played this game since a few months after launch. Soon seven years then. I'm 23 years old, a decently skilled player and playing fairly casual. Our guild clears Dragon Soul normal in 2 hours etc. Just to get a view on where skill wise I/we are.

Reason for this post is that I started lvling my (second) Death Knight, and I surprisingly have not deleted this one. Playing as (OP) Blood, and which it has before, it strikes me how mind numbingly easy it is to level. And ofcourse it should be, with a tank class with heirlooms. But it got me thinking about other things in the game that are (too) easy.

I think it started with Blizzards removal of World Elites. Remember when in Loch Modan in classic, the quest with the Elite Ogres. First Elites I met. They killed me so bad, but it was fun anyway. Second time I encountered them, I could solo one with an effort. Those are gone now, just normal mobs. As with almost all other world elites, if not all of them. This is not a big issue, however it lead to other thoughts as said.

I jumped on my Holy Paladin a while ago, which I had not played for more than 3 months. Barely enough ilvl to join the new 5man heroics, hoping to get some gear and a challenge. Gear there was, but the challenge shone with it's absence.
And as we all know LFR is even easier than 5man heroics and a loot pinata of epic proportions. And because of my semi casual play style I will not ever enter a normal raid with an alt. Just doesn't happen, so I will not get a challenge that way.

I would really want a non-time consuming solo challenge in this game. Would be nice while leveling, but not needed. But for my max lvl alts, or even my main, I would like to have something that is hard but yet possible to kill alone. Right now, there exist no such things. World Elites are gone, and the group quests (while leveling then) are too hard to solo. They just hit too hard. Doesn't matter what CDs you use, you WILL die. Leveling sure would be more interesting if I, at least some time, had to use more than 3 skills to kill stuff. I killed Durn the Hungerer on the DK, with Blood Strike while killing the extra mob that aggroed ... That guy used to be HARD! -.-

I have a feeling I will be quite dissapointed by Challenge Modes in MoP also. Timed runs? Meh. That is barely skill, just memorizing and repeating a pattern.)

TL;DR: I WANT SOLO CHALLENGES, GIEF NAO

I have certainly forgotten something, and could most likely written this better. But oh well, you guys will add what's missing I hope =)

CLARIFICATION: (you can kinda skip the above original post and just read this)

Readily available challenges is non-existant in WoW, I want more of those. That's the essence of it really.

- I want to log a max lvl alt and get a challenge, <with> people, without raiding. Not possible since heroic five mans are fail-your-way-to-success.
- Leveling is bland and boring, and should not be. Even Blizzard should agree with this; where is the sense of progression if nothing is a challenge? Levels are just levels without that sense of progression. If I would be new to the game, I would want a challenge. I do not play on easy mode in other, single player, games. Though I have not been new to this game for 7 years, so I do not know what new players think coming into WoW now. Maybe they like the difficulty level of questing sure.
- The title of the thread maybe is not entirely appropriate. Should be called: Challenges in this game, I know you want it! But then again, that would be misleading also, since this is not about raids or PvP. I'll blame this on it being a quite hastily written post, and the first thread I've started.

What I want is a challenge outside of raids and PvP.

1) Facerolling stuff is all good, but not in the HEROIC part of the game. I do not really understand Blizzards decision to make Heroic 5mans as easy as they are. Give VP from finishing normals, but not as much, so you can still eventually get epics from them. (Maybe you already get this, what do I know.) Noone wants Heroic raids to be faceroll, so why would the heroic 5mans be? Really do not get it.
2) Bring back world Elites. Easy as that to make questing just a bit more interesting. Must say the rares in Northrend are quite good. But that's the only place with a bit harder world mob. I want them everywhere! (Not really everywhere, but at least ONE Elite quest mob per zone >_<)

Those 2 are the major points that would make the game more fun for me. It would actually give some pleasure in leveling or gearing an alt at max level. I do not care that normal instances are faceroll while I level, but why is NEW heroic 5mans faceroll at release? On alts I can not even play properly? Or am I really that good that when I play bad I play better than the majority of the playerbase? I honestly do not think so. At least I hope that is not the truth lol.

[dignaidgnaiud]

You want solo challenges, Go solo DW

[charleybwoy]

You are dk? Yes. You are Op? Yes. Well you could solo a lot, google the name Mionelol. Happy hunting!


assuming you geared and skilled.

[Sackman]

I recently leveled on a classic private server, the individual skill required to kill just one mob is so much more fun than killing 30 mobs with a large sigh from how friendly the world of warcraft has become to players. It really is the world of fluffypinkpillowcraft now, it was easy enough when Flying mounts allowed us to skip over huge dangerous areas and passages. But the mobs now are just so easy to dispatch that it makes me wonder why the hell they are even there.

Classic involved a lot of grinding, and nobody wants to see "life" consuming elements of the game return like Argent Dawn rep (zzzZZ) but I really don't know why Blizzard keeps making it so simple.

I would prefer a quest that takes me 3 minutes to kill 1 mob, as I use all my classes abilities and feel great satisfaction from killing them (and danger from being near them), and only have to kill 3 of those mobs, than have to kill 20 mobs that require no skill whatsoever.

It ties in with, whats the point of having leveling really, Leveling used to be fun, but nowadays it just ruins the story and lore in the game because you cannot do quests at the level they are supposed to be done as it takes 1-5 quests to make you too high for them to be challenging.

Might aswell just give us a quest log full of all the lore in the game and tell us to grind mobs. Would make more sense if there was no levels, and questing was just another part of the game - that is challenging solo - and occasionally has group quests or (scenarios) as blizz is trying to make.

And make the "leveling and learning" aspect of the game be set through achievements that provide class abilities after certain conditions have been met.

That way we can all enjoy questing all over without arbitrary levels making certain areas redundant for replay value.

TL;DR I agree with you and know what you mean.

[vep]

You ask for a challenge. But a non time consumin one. That doesn't work like that. You want a real challenge? You spend time on it. You want a challenge now? take your blood DK and solo a TBC heroic (seems he's in that level range). Then solo a freaking raid at lvl 70 if you wish.

There is challenge in the game, only not as you think of it. You just have to get out and find one... Try soloing some of the lvl 80 raids. I'm sure a fair amount of bosses can be soloed by a blood DK. Go out, figure what kind of gear you need to do it, what glyphs, what talents, what rotation, when to use CDs...

But remember, there is no "real" challenge that is not time consuming.

[Cairm]

Doesnt exist nowaday. Now you need either good gear or dedication for challenge.

[Veranya]

Ofcourse it works like that. I do not want the time spent equal to making a normal raid pug. Or even guild alt run. I want to be able to go someplace and start. Not rely on others to be there, and have to rely on THEIR skill. Just my skill.

And you completely missed the part where I stated there was no challenge whatsoever to go on my paladin and heal. Wich I play like crap on. What's up with that really? It's just failing my way to success.

I do not only play a Death Knight; I just got to thinking about this while playing it. And what about my main rogue? It can not solo the same thing as a DK? What are the challenges for that character?

---------- Post added 2011-12-31 at 03:38 PM ----------

That was well put Sackman. Quite exactly what I mean. Thank you =)

[Deleted]

You want solo challenges, Go solo DW

thats not a challenge dumbass, god some peeps here have standard answers...

GO DO THIS [ insert heroic end boss here ] SOLO OR ON ALL YOUR CHARS THEN WE TALK!

or stuff like..

DID YOU DO [ insert heroic end raid here ] 8/8 ( or more bosses ) THEN YOU CA SAY YOUR BORED

grow some originality...


but to the op , yes solo challenged would be nice ^^ try to kill Deth'tilac as a hunter solo ;p thats fun xD i wanted to bring him down to 20% to tame him , but i did not know that sending my pet in would help , so me and a friend we're shopping on Deth'tilac for like 30-60 min xD but i got him so its okee

[Deleted]

I agree that the leveling have become plain boring.

But solo challenges, as in going off and killing hard stuff alone, wouldnt even be good for most classes, i mean, Blood DK's would breeze through it, some other classes too. But then on the other end you have a lot of classes that just cant. So either all would have to be balanced to solo, meaning one hell of a balancing hell in pvp, or they have to balance that new content for the worst solo class, meaning the best would not have a big challenge.

[vep]

Ofcourse it works like that. I do not want the time spent equal to making a normal raid pug. Or even guild alt run. I want to be able to go someplace and start. Not rely on others to be there, and have to rely on THEIR skill. Just my skill.

Well then. Easy answer to that. Quit the game.
This is an M M O RPG... Where MMO stands for massive MULTIPLAYER. If you want to rely just on your skill, simple: quit the game and play an RPG...

You want a challenge to heal on your paladin? Do heroic DS and lemme know if it's good enough.

You want a challenge as a rogue? Sure:


Another one?


Another one?


Yes, there is plenty of challenge out there, just be creative and go find some!

[Sackman]

You ask for a challenge. But a non time consumin one. That doesn't work like that. You want a real challenge? You spend time on it. You want a challenge now? take your blood DK and solo a TBC heroic (seems he's in that level range). Then solo a freaking raid at lvl 70 if you wish.

There is challenge in the game, only not as you think of it. You just have to get out and find one... Try soloing some of the lvl 80 raids. I'm sure a fair amount of bosses can be soloed by a blood DK. Go out, figure what kind of gear you need to do it, what glyphs, what talents, what rotation, when to use CDs...

But remember, there is no "real" challenge that is not time consuming.

There are tonnes of challenges that are not time consuming.

Running up a steep incline can be challenging, but it is not time consuming. What tosh.

---------- Post added 2011-12-31 at 03:23 PM ----------

I am finding Super Meat Boy more challenging and fun than any part of WoW at the moment. I am playing Classic on the priv because BRD is actually so difficult live pales by comparison. Running through DS has been such a breeze it's just silly. I think the main reason is gear availability. I think doing DS in 359-378 gear is more tuned than 384-391 gear it should really be tuned for. DPS can do 5-10k more dps than what is required so easily... even in my tank gear I am doing more DPS than what is required of an individual. Which is a shocking concept to design a game around. I understand to some casual means "fucking lazy" but, I think if you're fucking lazy, you shouldn't do multiplayer components.

Considering WoW has dumbed down all multiplayer components into segregated facets, there should be challenging areas to show off individual skill that don't involve what you call "being creative". You ever tried finding 10-25 people on the same skill level as you who are available to raid at the same times as you?

I can tell you when you are actually good its fucking difficult and its annoying that people who are shit have ruined the word "casual" to mean "is shit". I am casual, and trying to find the time to get enough good people together to do heroic raids is difficult.

Fortunately, I am not in the mind to actually care so I will be unsubbing soon (obv not gonna just leave my guild raiding something in the middle of the season especially as an officer) and I'm going to continue caining up Super Meat Boy, and playing BF3.

You might say "good ridance", "another quit post". But I have been a member since Classic, and have enjoyed calling WoW one of the best and most influential games of the decade and most certainly of its genre. Now I can't call it that, or won't call it that. It's no longer influencing anything, because everything is easy. It is becoming/has become the farmville of MMO's.

[Veranya]

I have a feeling this will turn into a content-is-easy thread hm. Maybe that's okay though.

Gonna add something little here; Blizzard added LFR for the casuals and "bads" to see the content. But why in earths name is then still Heroic 5mans piss easy? You have seen the content on normal (wich maybe could be seen as the LFR difficulty for 5mans then). That would fix one of the issues with non-existant challenge in the game. Care if it's not solo challenge, but a challenge for example my Holydin. Tune Heroic 5man to be harder, and say to the others who can't complete it "you got normal modes". Like they did with LFR. Not a huge step there right?

[Sackman]

I have a feeling this will turn into a content-is-easy thread hm. Maybe that's okay though.

Gonna add something little here; Blizzard added LFR for the casuals and "bads" to see the content. But why in earths name is then still Heroic 5mans piss easy? You have seen the content on normal (wich maybe could be seen as the LFR difficulty for 5mans then). That would fix one of the issues with non-existant challenge in the game. Care if it's not solo challenge, but a challenge for example my Holydin. Tune Heroic 5man to be harder, and say to the others who can't complete it "you got normal modes". Like they did with LFR. Not a huge step there right?

I agree.

But apparently my message is too short. I resoundingly and whoreheartedly agree.

[Machriren]

You want to try something hard?

Go and level (not Drenai/belf/goblin/worgen) character without heirlooms.

Speaking from experience.

Theres a quest as a human that i tried. it involves going into a cave full of mobs.

You have to kill 10.

Its impossible to just pull one at a time. In fact, usually you pull 3 or 4 at a time. With Heirlooms its amazingly faceroll as any class, but withot heirlooms, Even one mob is a struggle.

give it a go, see how you do

[Igirol]

What he is probably talking about is something like this:

Let's say you're on your mage. And you enter this dungeon type of thing alone, some dummys appear out of nowhere and you gotta
shoot em with the correct spell or they will reflect the damage back to you. All of this while you keep movin forward
cause the bridge you're on is collapsin.
Add more of your imagination.

[Sackman]

You want to try something hard?

Go and level (not Drenai/belf/goblin/worgen) character without heirlooms.

Speaking from experience.

Theres a quest as a human that i tried. it involves going into a cave full of mobs.

You have to kill 10.

Its impossible to just pull one at a time. In fact, usually you pull 3 or 4 at a time. With Heirlooms its amazingly faceroll as any class, but withot heirlooms, Even one mob is a struggle.

give it a go, see how you do

I'm sorry but what?

No quest in this game is a struggle.

In fact the closest quest I got to not being a struggle, since i resubbed to wow this year, was the christmas greench quest. Which was still soloable without a struggle. But was much more fun.

[Veranya]

The greench is quite hard. I could not solo him as a rogue. But there we go again, it is more or less impossible to solo it with certain classes. The DoT and his swings just ate my health. CDs, Recup and all that shit did do nothing. And if I vanish - reset fight meh. And that's not fun really. Fun for those who play certain classes maybe, but not the others.

[Dr. Wuky]

TL;DR: I WANT SOLO CHALLENGES, GIEF NAO

Lich King 10 - Heroic.

[Veranya]

Lich King 10 - Heroic.

Do that as something else than a Death Knight, post a video. Preferably as a rogue or Holy Paladin. Then I'll consider doing it myself. I can bet ya, it won't even remotely work.

[Deleted]

and the group quests (while leveling then) are too hard to solo.

While those no longer exist they most certainly were possible to solo with varying difficulty depending on the class. For example the big Frostwyrm in Dragonblight was too easy as a frost mage since it could be snared but was difficult on a tank because it was meant to have a dedicated healer.